He was elite, but "middle of the road" type elite. You can see when the jump took place. After 4 years, I think he'll be like Ramzi and be another 3:35 guy (3:38 minus super shoes and pace lights). That doesn't get you much these days...not when JI is doing 3:38 back to back.
Katir will be older in 2028 than Manangoi when he came back after a two year ban. He was a 3:28 guy (before super shoes) who was boasting shortly before he got suspended that he would smash El G's WR at Monaco. He trained his a$ off in the two years he was banned, including continuing to train (against the rules) with Potato Tim and his younger brother at Rongei. I don't think he's broken 3:36 since he returned. He's another one who the OP continues to defend to this day, claiming I have a 'weird obsession' with.
Manangoi was actually born in 1991, which he disclosed to a Letsrun correspondent. You also have no proof that I’ve ever seen that he violated training restrictions. Since he didn’t come back to Rongai after, I don’t get the impression that notion makes any sense. If Tim/Ouma wanted him there and he wanted to be there, there’s no rule against it. But taking a baseless potshot at Cheruiyot is par for the course for you. The same person that accuses every Kenyan coached by Kim McDonald for doping, while sparing all the Brits. Or has no suspicions about George Mills while in the same breath accusing his OAC Europe training partner. Who wouldn’t dare accuse Marc Scott who had a teammate busted in Shelby and then sought out Patrick Sang whose athletes you also categorically say are doping. On it goes.
To the post before, it’s worth probably pointing out that Ramzi may have been a completely reckless doper. In his era the testing apparatus was not nearly as robust. So it’s possible he punched even further above his weight. Still I’d be skeptical of Katir ever running under 3:32 and 13:00 again.
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It also seems weird to concurrently run these two offenses. While connected, “cheating” the whereabouts system this obviously is not in common with simply not being in the right place. It is a separate offense. 4 years is correct, but should be applied independently.
It's in the rules (another loophole that cheats can exploit), so you cannot apply it independently. The 2nd offense only leads to an additional, not concurrent (and then harsher) ban, if the athlete had already received notice for the 1st one at that point.
See Salazar for another example, whose testo tampering/possession ban ran concurrently with his forbidden method and tampering bans, although the offenses were unrelated and years apart. Otherwise Salazar would have been banned 4 + 4 + 2 = 10 years for those instead of his actual ban of only 4 years, or rather, lifetime because 2nd and 3rd offenses get increasingly harsher punishments.
See 10.9, specifically 10.9.3.1 of WADA Code 2021 for example:
an anti-doping rule violation will only be considered a second violation if the Anti-Doping Organization can establish that the Athlete or other Person committed the additional anti-doping rule violation after the Athlete or other Person received notice pursuant to Article 7, or after the Anti-Doping Organization made reasonable efforts to give notice of the first anti-doping rule violation.
If it is considered "a second violation", see 10.9.1.1: "twice the period of Ineligibility otherwise applicable to the second anti-doping rule violation", so Katir's ban would have been
2 years for whereabouts + 2x 4 years for tampering = 10 years.
To the post before, it’s worth probably pointing out that Ramzi may have been a completely reckless doper. In his era the testing apparatus was not nearly as robust. So it’s possible he punched even further above his weight. Still I’d be skeptical of Katir ever running under 3:32 and 13:00 again.
Ramzi was a completely reckless doper. You can find his blood values (and then back calculate his EPO (CERA) dosages) in the documents surrounding the IAAF 2015 scandal.
Best Christmas present any true fan of track could have.
He has been posting on Instagram lately of himself training hard in preparation for his 'comeback'. So arrogant, he actually expected to be cleared.
Let's not forget that the mods deleted the original 'Is Katir the most obvious doper in history?' thread for being 'discrimanatory', and that the OP defended him endlessly.
No Moroccan has ever run under 3:32 clean.
The mods are brain dead. Don’t let them discourage you.
Best Christmas present any true fan of track could have.
He has been posting on Instagram lately of himself training hard in preparation for his 'comeback'. So arrogant, he actually expected to be cleared.
Let's not forget that the mods deleted the original 'Is Katir the most obvious doper in history?' thread for being 'discrimanatory', and that the OP defended him endlessly.
No Moroccan has ever run under 3:32 clean.
The mods are brain dead. Don’t let them discourage you.
There is no doubt about that. Although he doesn’t need encouragement. He lives for this.
I really liked his style and Makh daddy's too. They are both like heels in pro wrestling. His arrogant comeback about sleeping with his critic's wives was pure WWE.
To the post before, it’s worth probably pointing out that Ramzi may have been a completely reckless doper. In his era the testing apparatus was not nearly as robust. So it’s possible he punched even further above his weight. Still I’d be skeptical of Katir ever running under 3:32 and 13:00 again.
Ramzi was a completely reckless doper. You can find his blood values (and then back calculate his EPO (CERA) dosages) in the documents surrounding the IAAF 2015 scandal.
“Back calculate CERA dosage”….huh? You’re just making things up now. Everyone responds to all medicines differently. It’s completely impossible to look at someone’s hct and tell how much hematopoietin they’ve used. Further, CERA is not epo.
How come people always go back to Shelby? Her ban is up, jeez. If you hate cheaters so much, try losing your mind about Kiprop or Rhonex Kipruto for a while just to spread the love around.
But if possible, stay focused... this is a thread about the most obvious doper in years --- Katir!
It was not I that brought her up and Shelbs was very obvious too!
It also seems weird to concurrently run these two offenses. While connected, “cheating” the whereabouts system this obviously is not in common with simply not being in the right place. It is a separate offense. 4 years is correct, but should be applied independently.
It's in the rules (another loophole that cheats can exploit), so you cannot apply it independently. The 2nd offense only leads to an additional, not concurrent (and then harsher) ban, if the athlete had already received notice for the 1st one at that point.
See Salazar for another example, whose testo tampering/possession ban ran concurrently with his forbidden method and tampering bans, although the offenses were unrelated and years apart. Otherwise Salazar would have been banned 4 + 4 + 2 = 10 years for those instead of his actual ban of only 4 years, or rather, lifetime because 2nd and 3rd offenses get increasingly harsher punishments.
See 10.9, specifically 10.9.3.1 of WADA Code 2021 for example:
an anti-doping rule violation will only be considered a second violation if the Anti-Doping Organization can establish that the Athlete or other Person committed the additional anti-doping rule violation after the Athlete or other Person received notice pursuant to Article 7, or after the Anti-Doping Organization made reasonable efforts to give notice of the first anti-doping rule violation.
If it is considered "a second violation", see 10.9.1.1: "twice the period of Ineligibility otherwise applicable to the second anti-doping rule violation", so Katir's ban would have been
2 years for whereabouts + 2x 4 years for tampering = 10 years.
This is ridiculous. It makes the punishment being for getting caught. No sensible judicial system gives you credit for thinking you have got away with it.
It must be in the athlete's interest to admit guilt rather than fight. And testify against coach / doctor for reduction.
Never knew you were into antidoping as much with the way you sometimes deny some of your dirty American athletes. But this is comforting from you! Khamis, Coevett and Armstrongliv ALREADY presaged Mo Katie’s doping many many months ago, before even todays verdict and what was the response from many? They taunted them abused them and hate on them for being space-time savants.
meanwhile rekrunner is frolicking behind the scenes and cosying up to the alluring prospect of denying there is enough objective evidence of Mo’s doping. You witnessed that so did I before I registered an account on the forum. But I was definitely here reading those nefarious comments from senor rekrunner!
If there is one lesson you can learn from all these is that never you dare not trust the subjective genius of the aforementioned trio of hombres! 🤗
Yes, poor rekbot. Now even he can't deny anymore that Katir is a cheater. No wonder he is so quiet here (while resuming his trolling in the Houlihan threads).
Yes, poor rekbot. Now even he can't deny anymore that Katir is a cheater. No wonder he is so quiet here (while resuming his trolling in the Houlihan threads).
🫡👍👏👏❤️
can’t walt for him to dissociate document forgery from doping. He will say something like there is no objective data to link document forgery with doping because one is made of paper and the other has no benefits for athletes lol 😂
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