Elle needs to practice mentally and physically relaxing and staying clam that first 300/400.........bad coaching or bad tactics?....everyone can see it....most posts here are spot on....62 first quarter rather than 58 changes everything.....not like Muir (that was too far back), but something in between, just off the back....so many tactical mistakes, definitely didn't run like a confident world class runner
She races like a high schooler — antsy, making unnecessary sharp moves and surges. It started with the semi-final where she seemed to be running panicked, jostling to always get to where she thought she needed to be. Be patient! Sure enough, space opened soon after these moves and her moves proved to be pointless. Compared to the confidence in one's fitness displayed by runners like Kipyegon, the difference is stark.
Then in the final today, it seems she has an adolescent mentality of "stay right on the leader, no matter what!" — even if the leader is Tsegay going out at a suicidal pace. I think it's obvious to say that she and Hiltz would have been better served today doing something closer to what Muir did and running a bit more within themselves for the first 600.
St. Pierre is fit, sure, but lots to learn in the ways of racing.
It's partially not her fault. Her coach messed up. First, he filled her with belief that she could run 3:52-3:53 "fresh" without the 5000m, and he also knew she should run the 5000m but let her choose the 1500m. It's like when Pre thought he was a Miler and Bowerman was like, no, you are a 3-miler. Poor decision today to chase Tsegay.
The 1500 was her race and she should have run about 3:52. Like others have said, pacing was a problem, but sometimes these abrupt moves really hurt a middle distance runner as much as the fast pace. If you watch the way Arop ran the 800, his moved are all very subtle which won't take as much out of the legs.
It's interesting that in the indoor season she and Hull were neck and neck. In the following months, Jess went and focussed purely on 800/1500 training and ESP kept up more aerobic 1500/5000 training heading into the US trials.
Is this the difference in how they diverged? ESP stayed strong. But Jess got lean and quick?
As a non-American, I wasn't sorry to see ESP run poorly today. She looked a dirty racer in the US trials and never seems gracious in victory or defeat. Is she unliked on the circuit?
I think that is a pretty fair assessment of ESP. I don't think she has many friends in professional track and field outside little New Balance Group.
yeah, honestly I think it almost a cultural thing. I think she is a nice person but most of the track women are liberal middle to upper class lots of Stanford and Oregon and Colorado etc and Elle is salt of the earth farm folk from rural NH. just a different background. I think she has no time for bs though. wouldn't talk bad about you behind your back, just doesn't waste time with any "high school drama", a straight shooter.
She really should have run the 5k instead. She does not have enough speed for the 1500m.
I said the same after the Trials. 3:55.99 pr, was thinking at best she could knock that down into the 3:54low range in Paris. With Kipyegon, Tsegay, Hull, Muir, I felt like St Pierre didn't have a plausible route to a 1500m medal, felt like it was going to take 3:53.5 to be competitive and turned out it was quite a bit faster than that.
14:34 5000m pr coming in. Felt like if she was in 1500m pr shape she be equally likely to be in 5000m pr shape, maybe a chance to get down sub 14:30, maybe into the 14:25 range but that seems a little optimistic. Still a stacked field in the 5000m, it's not like any Olympic event has an easy route to a medal, but I felt like in the right race she had a better chance to pick off racers for a top 3 finish at 5000m.
ESP is a huge talent with an average coach. She gets it done on the national level but always blows it on the world level. Coach Coogan is not the coach to help athletes get medals. He’s very average and doesn’t get it
I think that is a pretty fair assessment of ESP. I don't think she has many friends in professional track and field outside little New Balance Group.
yeah, honestly I think it almost a cultural thing. I think she is a nice person but most of the track women are liberal middle to upper class lots of Stanford and Oregon and Colorado etc and Elle is salt of the earth farm folk from rural NH. just a different background. I think she has no time for bs though. wouldn't talk bad about you behind your back, just doesn't waste time with any "high school drama", a straight shooter.
Lol, she's from Vermont not New Hampshire. And just because someone isn't from or didn't go to school at liberal meccas in the Pacific NW doesn't mean their conservative or poor! Vermont is one of the most liberal states in the USA by the way-hello Bernie Sanders. And her husband’s family are cattle people and I would guess pretty well off. He went to Cornell U. Which is pretty left wing as well.
ESP is a huge talent with an average coach. She gets it done on the national level but always blows it on the world level. Coach Coogan is not the coach to help athletes get medals. He’s very average and doesn’t get it
I would agree with poster on her bad tactics in semi, but she did make the final.
In final she got good position early and easily and never left rail for the whole race. They believed she could run 3:52 and went for it.
She did fall for Tsegays hard first lap, if she keyed off Hull or Kipyegon, she night have had more left for last 200. Still a conservative strategy might have resulted in a pb and 5th place, but no medal.
I give her credit for giving it her best shot.
The US will get better, if we run more 3:50-3:55 races instead of 4:00 races at home.
yeah, honestly I think it almost a cultural thing. I think she is a nice person but most of the track women are liberal middle to upper class lots of Stanford and Oregon and Colorado etc and Elle is salt of the earth farm folk from rural NH. just a different background. I think she has no time for bs though. wouldn't talk bad about you behind your back, just doesn't waste time with any "high school drama", a straight shooter.
Lol, she's from Vermont not New Hampshire. And just because someone isn't from or didn't go to school at liberal meccas in the Pacific NW doesn't mean their conservative or poor! Vermont is one of the most liberal states in the USA by the way-hello Bernie Sanders. And her husband’s family are cattle people and I would guess pretty well off. He went to Cornell U. Which is pretty left wing as well.
And the main reason Vermont is not only one of the most expensive states to live in and the most liberal is because of the influx of New Yorkers who saw the beauty of the Green Mountain ⛰️ State and bought up second homes and moved there permanently. Uncle Bernie Sanders isn't a Vermonter he's a New Yorker. It's horrible I use to live in this beautiful state. Sorry off topic.
This post was edited 40 seconds after it was posted.
I live here and the influx is real, but it's from all over - and it's either the well off seeking the idyllic picture they had in their minds, or extremely low income people seeking the freebies we hand out here. No in between.
Lol, take a drive through Franklin Co. Vermont and tell me where all the New Yorkers live. The tiny bubble of Jay Peak Resort, sure, but I think those "Lets Go Brandon" flags hanging from every trailer ain't votin blue.
Lol, take a drive through Franklin Co. Vermont and tell me where all the New Yorkers live. The tiny bubble of Jay Peak Resort, sure, but I think those "Lets Go Brandon" flags hanging from every trailer ain't votin blue.
Well there's no way ultra- liberal Bernie Sanders would ever have been elected if there wasn't a majority of left- wingers on the voting rolls. But your right that the people barely making it are more than happy to collect the freebies from The People's Republic of Vermont hands out.
This post was edited 2 minutes after it was posted.
She races like a high schooler — antsy, making unnecessary sharp moves and surges. It started with the semi-final where she seemed to be running panicked, jostling to always get to where she thought she needed to be. Be patient! Sure enough, space opened soon after these moves and her moves proved to be pointless. Compared to the confidence in one's fitness displayed by runners like Kipyegon, the difference is stark.
Then in the final today, it seems she has an adolescent mentality of "stay right on the leader, no matter what!" — even if the leader is Tsegay going out at a suicidal pace. I think it's obvious to say that she and Hiltz would have been better served today doing something closer to what Muir did and running a bit more within themselves for the first 600.
St. Pierre is fit, sure, but lots to learn in the ways of racing.
When you make a statement like "She races like a high schooler", I'm hoping your expert opinion is coming from experience of participating in an Olympic 1500m final, or even making an Olympic team. Unless you've been there in ANY capacity, probably shouldn't throw shade on a 2-time Olympian, Oly Trials champion, and reigning world indoor 3000m champion.
Running a fast time is an indication of being a good time trialist. It's not an indication of being a good racer. Finishing high in a championship race is an indication of being a good racer.
Running a fast time is an indication of being a good time trialist. It's not an indication of being a good racer. Finishing high in a championship race is an indication of being a good racer.
ESP is fine as long as she is the fastest woman in the event. She goes to the front and takes off. But when she is racing against competitors of her same speed or faster she pretty much has no idea what to do as evidenced by her Olympic rounds. Is it poor coaching or is she just not coachable...
Hull is clearly on another level right now. Is it from speed training? Maybe. She is also coached by her “dad” after being affiliated with a club ripe with doping.
Elle also raced like an over matched freshman at the first invitational. It’s tough to cover up tactical mistakes on milk protein shakes alone.
She is coached by her “dad”. Not sure why you put the quotes there
She races like a high schooler — antsy, making unnecessary sharp moves and surges. It started with the semi-final where she seemed to be running panicked, jostling to always get to where she thought she needed to be. Be patient! Sure enough, space opened soon after these moves and her moves proved to be pointless. Compared to the confidence in one's fitness displayed by runners like Kipyegon, the difference is stark.
Then in the final today, it seems she has an adolescent mentality of "stay right on the leader, no matter what!" — even if the leader is Tsegay going out at a suicidal pace. I think it's obvious to say that she and Hiltz would have been better served today doing something closer to what Muir did and running a bit more within themselves for the first 600.
St. Pierre is fit, sure, but lots to learn in the ways of racing.
OAC bots are rabid and need to start these threads because they suck
Interesting that one or two people (with multiple accounts) spend their time trashtalking one of the best US runners in the country. How about take a seat back and shut up and appreciate her racing as is. Who is actually better than her besides Cranny??? NOBODY.