Back in the 80's when I was a high school runner I talked with an elite runner who just moved to town, who use to train some with Frank Shorter some back in the 70's.
He said he used to ask Frank if he was ever going to write a book about training since he was self coached post-college. Frank said no it really wasn't that complicated for a whole book. Shorter told him if you wanted to be a good distance runner do 2 quality workouts and a long run each week and as much easy mileage as you could between those 3 workouts without compromising those workouts. Shorter told him to follow that prescription, being as consistent as he could with it, and over the course of a few years as his body adapted, he be able to handle more and more mileage on the days between those workouts and he'd become pretty good, at least for whatever level of talent he had. Shorter said that is how he got to 140-150 mile weeks he was doing 1970-1976.
Now obviously I don't know for sure that was true but given the setting he told me that story in I'll take him at his word. Regardless, it made sense to me and it's something I never forgot. Obviously what quality workouts and long runs you do are important, but that framework is golden. As your body adapts (and with consistency it will) add more mileage.
That's a refinement of Tom Fleming's "Somewhere in the world there's someone training when you aren't. When you race him he'll win." Out of curiosity, where is the Park Forest hill and about how long is it? When I was there the only hills I can remember doing repeats on went from College Ave. to the "top" of the campus.
We were using that "while you are sleeping...." quote in high school years before we ever heard of Tom Fleming.
The Park Forest hill is actually two hills on North Oak Lane, aka "North Choke". Start at the bottom and go up the big/steep side. Jog to the bottom then up the longer flatter side. Repeat. Its not a hill for the weak. I guess if you use Google Street view you could find it.
There are no hills near campus that I would consider to be worthy.
I know George Young had a version of "Someone's training when you aren't" quote. Somehow Fleming seems most associated with it. I never got into that part of town very much when I was there and thought I had to make due with those campus roads.
How quickly can one increase mileage? Should the OP just go straight to 110 or build-up more patiently? Maybe hang-out around 100 for a while?
What if you're much lower mileage but looking to bump the mileage-up significantly?
I'd tell him to do two or three weeks at 120-125 and then drop down to 110 which will seem much easier compared to 120-125.
Its all personal discovery. Don't become married to numbers. Bump it up, drop back down. Repeat. You'll find which levels you're responding to. Its not rocket surgery.
just my opinion but higher mileage is often for very small increases and sometimes higher risk and worse workouts. It doesn’t always end well… I’d ask anyone: have you REALLY maximized your speed work and strength and threshold etc? There’s probably some easier mistakes or holes in training that will affect your race more. Sure there are people who survive the mileage but honestly its not often that extreme mileage runners are the best athletes.. only a few exceptions
I'm a Senior with an additional year of eligibility and I've ran mediocre times but I'm starting to see the light at the end of the tunnel and the big times I've been yearning for approaching (still minute from top xc times). I think the ending of the XC season will go quite favorably, and I'm wanting to carry some immense momentum into hopefully a crazy breakout Track campaign. I haven't ran Track in 2 years because I redshirted and I was curious if 110 miles this winter would result in a good campaign, and additional development or is it just to big of a risk all together? I've been able to do 90 for 3/4 year now and its comfortable when I'm not dragged down by school. I'm looking to be a minute behind the best on the 10k in Track this year for reference, so that graduate year I can shoot for something big. I know that the risk is immense with this type of mileage but the reward is to intriguing. So if you have tried anything similar in the past y'alls experience with this jump would be quite appreciated. I'm willing to quite literally do any regiment that my coach approves of, and the 110 miles a week regiment is something that would be.
One of your old teammates always messaged me asking for such info. He thought I had the old training logs cataloged and what not.
That’s like 2 years of racing for most teams these days.
Odds are OP runs his best race by doing 90mpw and doing the little stuff properly. Odds are also that isn’t going to get him to the next level. He needs to roll the dice and see if he is one of the people that responds well to 110mpw. Odds are he tweaks something and misses track. But maybe he is in that 20% who keep on improving their 10ks as the mileage goes up.
That's a refinement of Tom Fleming's "Somewhere in the world there's someone training when you aren't. When you race him he'll win." Out of curiosity, where is the Park Forest hill and about how long is it? When I was there the only hills I can remember doing repeats on went from College Ave. to the "top" of the campus.
We were using that "while you are sleeping...." quote in high school years before we ever heard of Tom Fleming.
The Park Forest hill is actually two hills on North Oak Lane, aka "North Choke". Start at the bottom and go up the big/steep side. Jog to the bottom then up the longer flatter side. Repeat. Its not a hill for the weak. I guess if you use Google Street view you could find it.
There are no hills near campus that I would consider to be worthy.
I was curious, so I did just that. Is this the right hill? If so, it looks like a nice place to run.
This is the OP, and I appreciate all this feedback. It has fired me the f**k up. All my focus rn is doing the best I can this xc season with what I have now on barely any mileage this summer, but if I run sub 24 easily on 60 mpw in the offseason because of 60 hour work weeks then I can roll into this next season knowing I can do 110 a week and completely change as a runner. It also adds to the fire I'm in the TP and getting nothing right now; the stoke is ablaze and 110 miles will be logged this winter.
This is the OP, and I appreciate all this feedback. It has fired me the f**k up. All my focus rn is doing the best I can this xc season with what I have now on barely any mileage this summer, but if I run sub 24 easily on 60 mpw in the offseason because of 60 hour work weeks then I can roll into this next season knowing I can do 110 a week and completely change as a runner. It also adds to the fire I'm in the TP and getting nothing right now; the stoke is ablaze and 110 miles will be logged this winter.
Quit focusing on a number. You'll find out what you can do once you do it.
One of your old teammates always messaged me asking for such info. He thought I had the old training logs cataloged and what not.
This makes no sense. Who is asking you, and for what? If he is a teammate of mine he could contact me. You don't know me, in fact you have never met me. Other than stalking and harassing me for years, there is no connection between us, and there won't ever be.
This post was edited 8 minutes after it was posted.
I'm a Senior with an additional year of eligibility and I've ran mediocre times but I'm starting to see the light at the end of the tunnel and the big times I've been yearning for approaching (still minute from top xc times). I think the ending of the XC season will go quite favorably, and I'm wanting to carry some immense momentum into hopefully a crazy breakout Track campaign. I haven't ran Track in 2 years because I redshirted and I was curious if 110 miles this winter would result in a good campaign, and additional development or is it just to big of a risk all together? I've been able to do 90 for 3/4 year now and its comfortable when I'm not dragged down by school. I'm looking to be a minute behind the best on the 10k in Track this year for reference, so that graduate year I can shoot for something big. I know that the risk is immense with this type of mileage but the reward is to intriguing. So if you have tried anything similar in the past y'alls experience with this jump would be quite appreciated. I'm willing to quite literally do any regiment that my coach approves of, and the 110 miles a week regiment is something that would be.
I do always wonder why we quote miles per week as it’s a more meaningless figure. As miles is just a product of the pace we run.
surely we would be better off saying is 12 hours a week of easy zero effort running with 1 hour of faster than 5k effort and 3 hours of faster than marathon effort a good combination of winter training?