SDSU Aztec wrote:
Question Assumptions wrote:
There hasn’t been a “great runner a Sac State” in a very long time. So you must be talking many years ago.
His name was Mike Van Horn and he was a 1976 HS grad. He went on to run about 14:20/29:45 which was very competitive for D-2 and not too shabby for a 9:20 HS guy.
And was 45 years ago
Question Assumptions wrote:
SDSU Aztec wrote:
His name was Mike Van Horn and he was a 1976 HS grad. He went on to run about 14:20/29:45 which was very competitive for D-2 and not too shabby for a 9:20 HS guy.
And was 45 years ago
Yeah, don't know why their program has fallen apart. They used to recruit some 9:20 guys and good runners from American River College would transfer there.
SDSU Aztec wrote:
Question Assumptions wrote:
And was 45 years ago
I find it super creepy that many people fixate on hs runners here. I think it’s a weird kind of fantasy/reminiscence.
There were things I was good at then. Not as much now. I’m way better at other things.
Yeah, don't know why their program has fallen apart. They used to recruit some 9:20 guys and good runners from American River College would transfer there.
SDSU Aztec wrote:
Question Assumptions wrote:
And was 45 years ago
Yeah, don't know why their program has fallen apart. They used to recruit some 9:20 guys and good runners from American River College would transfer there.
Because they haven’t had a good coach in decades.
Does anybody know what happened to Liam Anderson? Injury, lack of interest/motivation, attempting a comeback?
fkkfkfkfkf wrote:
Precious Roy wrote:
A guy I know who is trying to get his PGA pro card was a top junior golfer and state champ.
At the top there is much room. Say there are about 100 american PGA golfers on tour and thr average 10 year careers. That is 10 golfers/year. You are going to end up tons if state champs and all americans who dont sniff the PGA.
Same thing in track. Lets say you the 10th best guy in the country. Go to college and there are 60 guys(say 40 americans and 20 international) and just making nationals is huge. And then there are the 30 guys who were right behind you and 2-3 of them didnt train in HS and blow by you when they start running more than 25mpw.
through in things like luck (4 years of injury free running in HS versus missing a couple seasons in collage) and you get different results.
Does this former 25mpw HS runner competing in college really exist? If he was that unmotivated in HS, why would he want to compete in college?
SDSU Aztec wrote:
fkkfkfkfkf wrote:
At the top there is much room. Say there are about 100 american PGA golfers on tour and thr average 10 year careers. That is 10 golfers/year. You are going to end up tons if state champs and all americans who dont sniff the PGA.
Same thing in track. Lets say you the 10th best guy in the country. Go to college and there are 60 guys(say 40 americans and 20 international) and just making nationals is huge. And then there are the 30 guys who were right behind you and 2-3 of them didnt train in HS and blow by you when they start running more than 25mpw.
through in things like luck (4 years of injury free running in HS versus missing a couple seasons in collage) and you get different results.
Does this former 25mpw HS runner competing in college really exist? If he was that unmotivated in HS, why would he want to compete in college?
I know plenty of people that ran 25mpw and ran in college
GOPrunnerboi wrote:
SDSU Aztec wrote:
Does this former 25mpw HS runner competing in college really exist? If he was that unmotivated in HS, why would he want to compete in college?
I know plenty of people that ran 25mpw and ran in college
Why would they do that? Unless the kid is as dumb as a rock, he would have known he would be far more competitive if he ran 50+mpw, but yet he only went through the motions. Now he's jumped up a level and decides he wants to become a serious runner? It makes no sense and that first XC season would be a miserable experience. It is possible he could find the right D-3 school where he could continue his 25mpw regime.
That’s what my high school was like “save us for college, run low mileage” never made sense to me since aside from a few kids, most people wouldn’t be fast enough to run the places they end up going
SDSU Aztec wrote:
Why would they do that? Unless the kid is as dumb as a rock, he would have known he would be far more competitive if he ran 50+mpw, but yet he only went through the motions. Now he's jumped up a level and decides he wants to become a serious runner? It makes no sense and that first XC season would be a miserable experience. It is possible he could find the right D-3 school where he could continue his 25mpw regime.
This is not a fair comparison, but what about a guy like Cole Hocker? I stated earlier in this thread that he supposedly ran around 25-30 mpw while in high school. Now I have no way of knowing if this is true or not but I've heard it from more than one person so there is probably some validity to it. Would he have run better in high school at 50-60 mpw?
Hocker is a genetic anomaly so, as I said, probably not a fair comparison.
I coached an outstanding female thrower in high school a decade ago (165/45 discus/shot PBs) who was highly recruited. She ended up taking a full-ride offer from an out-of-state D2 school. She unfortunately found the freedoms of college life too appealing and she dropped out of school (she "discovered" recreational drugs and partied way too much) before the end of her freshman year.
Question Assumptions wrote:
SDSU Aztec wrote:
Yeah, don't know why their program has fallen apart. They used to recruit some 9:20 guys and good runners from American River College would transfer there.
Because they haven’t had a good coach in decades.
Can that really be an excuse anymore with the internet? Planning basic workouts can't be that hard. Can it?
Alan
your thread is too long wrote:
You’re beating a dead horse and missing the big problems. Cooper was/is a criminal. So was Danielson. Hard to train when you’re in trouble with the law. I went to school with a multi time state champion in all three running seasons. Gatorade award winner. He joined the army and never looked back. And there’s at least two short documentaries on Michael Granville. There’s millions of athletes just like him in many sports that are talented but can’t handle college because they actually have to take tests and learn (usually). Derek Rose and Amare Stoudemire are glaring examples of athletes that gamed the system.
Stoudemire went straight from high school to the pros so I’m not sure how he “gamed the system.” The NCAA system is a disgusting cartel that has robbed athletes for decades. Everyone should game that system. Rose got his brother to take the SAT for him. That’s wrong, but what does the SAT have to do with basketball? Why do you want a test to preempt someone’s athletic career?
what has happened? wrote:
SDSU Aztec wrote:
Why would they do that? Unless the kid is as dumb as a rock, he would have known he would be far more competitive if he ran 50+mpw, but yet he only went through the motions. Now he's jumped up a level and decides he wants to become a serious runner? It makes no sense and that first XC season would be a miserable experience. It is possible he could find the right D-3 school where he could continue his 25mpw regime.
This is not a fair comparison, but what about a guy like Cole Hocker? I stated earlier in this thread that he supposedly ran around 25-30 mpw while in high school. Now I have no way of knowing if this is true or not but I've heard it from more than one person so there is probably some validity to it. Would he have run better in high school at 50-60 mpw?
Hocker is a genetic anomaly so, as I said, probably not a fair comparison.
I don't know if Hocker's claims are true but the poster made it sound like there many 25mpw guys running in college and of course close to 100% would be nowhere near Hocker's level.
If a HSer was running 25mpw it's likely he was attending practice and blowing off weekends. I can't see him maintaining that mpw during the off-season. There were guys on our team that only ran at practice and wouldn't run a step during the winter or summer.
A 25mpw HSer is remarkably unmotivated and he's just not going to jump into a college program. What would cause such a change in his personality during the summer after his senior year? And yes, a kid will be far more successful at 50mpw than 25mpw.
SDSU Aztec wrote:
what has happened? wrote:
This is not a fair comparison, but what about a guy like Cole Hocker? I stated earlier in this thread that he supposedly ran around 25-30 mpw while in high school. Now I have no way of knowing if this is true or not but I've heard it from more than one person so there is probably some validity to it. Would he have run better in high school at 50-60 mpw?
Hocker is a genetic anomaly so, as I said, probably not a fair comparison.
I don't know if Hocker's claims are true but the poster made it sound like there many 25mpw guys running in college and of course close to 100% would be nowhere near Hocker's level.
If a HSer was running 25mpw it's likely he was attending practice and blowing off weekends. I can't see him maintaining that mpw during the off-season. There were guys on our team that only ran at practice and wouldn't run a step during the winter or summer.
A 25mpw HSer is remarkably unmotivated and he's just not going to jump into a college program. What would cause such a change in his personality during the summer after his senior year? And yes, a kid will be far more successful at 50mpw than 25mpw.
As your moniker suggests you have a CA connection, there was a lad in the late '80s from West Sacramento who was 2nd at Arcadia (9:00.66), won the CA state 16/32 double (4:08/8:59) and was the GWI winner in 3K (8:16) and finished the season at 3:47/8:16/14:19, the last two US #1s ... all off of 25-29 mpw. He also won the cross country state Div 2 title the autumn before this track season.
SDSU Aztec wrote:
Does this former 25mpw HS runner competing in college really exist? If he was that unmotivated in HS, why would he want to compete in college?
Bump it to 35 if you want. But yes there are plenty of guys like Pat Porter, Cole Hocker, Brian Sell, Bobby Kennedy, Knight who ran little mileage in HS and did fine in college. And the ones that only become 13:55 guys you never hear of. The list of woman is endless...
If you are winning your conference and making your state meet, you might be happy with that. And you can also be deluded into thinking you are training hard.
William Wallace wrote:
SDSU Aztec wrote:
I don't know if Hocker's claims are true but the poster made it sound like there many 25mpw guys running in college and of course close to 100% would be nowhere near Hocker's level.
If a HSer was running 25mpw it's likely he was attending practice and blowing off weekends. I can't see him maintaining that mpw during the off-season. There were guys on our team that only ran at practice and wouldn't run a step during the winter or summer.
A 25mpw HSer is remarkably unmotivated and he's just not going to jump into a college program. What would cause such a change in his personality during the summer after his senior year? And yes, a kid will be far more successful at 50mpw than 25mpw.
As your moniker suggests you have a CA connection, there was a lad in the late '80s from West Sacramento who was 2nd at Arcadia (9:00.66), won the CA state 16/32 double (4:08/8:59) and was the GWI winner in 3K (8:16) and finished the season at 3:47/8:16/14:19, the last two US #1s ... all off of 25-29 mpw. He also won the cross country state Div 2 title the autumn before this track season.
I might remember him. I can't remember the name of the HS, but was he a rare black American distance runner?
He's an outlier but here's another story. We had a talented runner, Bill, that was mostly practice only. We did get him to run a few times during the summer before his Sophomore XC season, he really came on at the end of the season and was in the top 5 Sophomores in the section. He took the following winter off and had a meh track season. I didn't see him over the next summer and I'm pretty sure he didn't run a step. After my usual fanatical off-season, I was beating him by over a minute in the first few meets. Bill had a very competitive personality, I was pretty obnoxious at the time and losing to me was unbearable for him so he quit.
He ran his next three seasons of XC and track but he could never stay with it long enough to run anywhere near his potential. If he had trained reasonably hard during HS, he would have been on the top runners in the section but it just wasn't in him. If course, he didn't compete in college.
fkkfkfkfkf wrote:
SDSU Aztec wrote:
Does this former 25mpw HS runner competing in college really exist? If he was that unmotivated in HS, why would he want to compete in college?
Bump it to 35 if you want. But yes there are plenty of guys like Pat Porter, Cole Hocker, Brian Sell, Bobby Kennedy, Knight who ran little mileage in HS and did fine in college. And the ones that only become 13:55 guys you never hear of. The list of woman is endless...
If you are winning your conference and making your state meet, you might be happy with that. And you can also be deluded into thinking you are training hard.
Those are super talented runners that could run minimal mpw and compete at a high level. Most kids aren't going to run much under 10:00 with such limited training.
I met countless runners when I was in college and not a single one was that unmotivated in HS.
SDSU Aztec wrote:
William Wallace wrote:
As your moniker suggests you have a CA connection, there was a lad in the late '80s from West Sacramento who was 2nd at Arcadia (9:00.66), won the CA state 16/32 double (4:08/8:59) and was the GWI winner in 3K (8:16) and finished the season at 3:47/8:16/14:19, the last two US #1s ... all off of 25-29 mpw. He also won the cross country state Div 2 title the autumn before this track season.
I might remember him. I can't remember the name of the HS, but was he a rare black American distance runner?
He's an outlier but here's another story. We had a talented runner, Bill, that was mostly practice only. We did get him to run a few times during the summer before his Sophomore XC season, he really came on at the end of the season and was in the top 5 Sophomores in the section. He took the following winter off and had a meh track season. I didn't see him over the next summer and I'm pretty sure he didn't run a step. After my usual fanatical off-season, I was beating him by over a minute in the first few meets. Bill had a very competitive personality, I was pretty obnoxious at the time and losing to me was unbearable for him so he quit.
He ran his next three seasons of XC and track but he could never stay with it long enough to run anywhere near his potential. If he had trained reasonably hard during HS, he would have been on the top runners in the section but it just wasn't in him. If course, he didn't compete in college.
Reggie Williams of River City High School. Reggie went on to compete for CAL Berkeley.
Someonewhoknows wrote:
You are still wrong about Horter. His problems are all COVID-related. He was actually doing decently well before COVID hit him. 19th at the Region in CC as a freshman, was regularly beating his fellow Ohio classmate Arjun Jha.
This is unequivocally not true.
You're "soeonewhoknows" and I am also Someone who knows. Horter beat Jha in his freshman year but hasn't beat him since and this is BEFORE covid came about. His trajectory has been in reverse of most since his best performances were in the freshman year and have gotten a bit slower since. Most of the top guys that were in high school at the same time as Horter started surpassing him prior to covid.
Does it all even really matter?