Tim Hutchings savage quote about spring loaded mechanized shoes

[quote]old hand wrote:

Hmm, you need to read up on what the "jump the shark" expression means and what its origin is. Nike didn't "jump the shark" by adding a plate to the foam. Quite the opposite.

You are right, but I'm struggling to come up with a descriptive phrase for, as an example, kids enter a friendly weekly boxing match, but one kid starts lifting weights on-the-side to improve his performance, so another kid starts holding onto steel weights inside of his boxing gloves. The second kid, "went-off-script"? Feel free to provide a better phrase.

"Changed the rules of the game" or "were playing a different game" or something along those lines. I'm sure there's better. As an analogy, yours works but I'm thinking more like the Nazis versus the Maginot Line or Civil War soldiers charging gatling guns or 18th century British soldiers marching in formation and getting picked off by long rifles hidden in the woods. Nike changed the rules of the game.

old hand wrote:

"Changed the rules of the game" ...Nike changed the rules of the game.

Agreed. That's literally what they did. They got in cahoots with World Athletics and modified the shoe rule regulations.

Is this thread missing his point? I don't think Hutchings was saying the shoes are bad or should be banned. I think he was saying that the times aren't comparable , kind of like a "BC" (Before Carbon).

I picked up a pair of next% before lockdown and have ran a few "races". The longer the effort, the more I notice - haven't seen much diff from 5km down, but somehow got a 10-mile pb when I was certain that all my pbs were behind me. A 10k pb is a realistic prospect now even though my 5km times are 30 seconds slower than they were back then. In my mind at least it's a fatigue reduction thing.

Is my M48 10-miler of 54min actually better than the M36 55min I ran in 2009 or should it have an asterix in my log, that's the question? I now have a faster time, but I know the "me" of 12 years ago would kick my ass with ease. I'll still tell people 54 if anyone asks me my 10-miler pb, but I also add a "however I wore the shoes" so I guess I agree with Hutchings.

there is no going back. down the line they will put little rockets in the heel. that is the way it is. but make no mistake, none of these men/women would be setting records today are close to the best like geb and bekele and radcliff. at least they have not proved they have comparable talent. this is a situation that should have been governed out by standards. now the cat is out of the bag. they are spings in the shoe pure and simple.

hr measurement wrote:

thesecretracer wrote:

I pointed out that improvement in shoe technology was hardly new & cited the adios Boost as an example.

I still recall Hutchings' commentary from Kimetto's world record marathon, "they're bouncing off of the pavement".

Nike got trounced by Adidas with a better springier foam. So in response, Nike full-on 'jumped-the-shark' and added a mechanical spring plate to the foam, completely disregarding the old rule to "not provide mechanical advantage".

This was my position for awhile. Boost rule the front area of the starting line at NYRR races. Took all the marbles away from Nike. Then Nike went ape crazy and ruined the sports.

BTW, there is nothing in the Nike sponsored rule that precludes carbon coil springs being inserted into the mid sole either. Springs won't return any energy that isn't put in by the runner either.

Another Dime for the Cursed Jar wrote:

It's not to stop talking about technology. It's vital to ALL sport.

Lots of sports where technology is minimal during competition.

Gymnastics, wrestling, equestrian show jumping, judo, weightlifting. beach volleyball.

Literally who?

Some nobody old timer with a couple of mediocre medals?

Nice high-and-mighty act, like he wouldn't wear the shoes himself if he were running today.

Hard pass, 0/10.

>inb4 "hOw MaNy MeDaLs Do YoU hAvE?"

Be more original.

Old burnt-out duds past their time will always have something meaningless to say; living in the past and hating on the present and future.

Shrivel up and fade away already.

This shoe controvery and the "races" or time trials that are geared to breaking world records with pacers and timing lights are pushing long time track geeks away from following the sport.

Now HS invitational meet directors are trying to set distance races up with pacers.

Its not racing

hr measurement wrote:

old hand wrote:

"Changed the rules of the game" ...Nike changed the rules of the game.

Agreed. That's literally what they did. They got in cahoots with World Athletics and modified the shoe rule regulations.

Ah, but is this any different as when pole vaulting went from bamboo to steel to fiberglass to carbon? Or when the high jump went to the Fosbury Flop, or the SP went to the spin? Seems to me advances in sports are inevitable and either you accept them or you brood about it.

barefootthon wrote:

Wear no shoes if you’re a purist

Ha ha! Nice try. We’ve been wearing shoes for thousands of years. It’s probably one of the most earliest forms of technology. There is nothing “purist” about wearing regular ol’ shoes.

Huthings is right. But why stop there. Why not rollerblades!? Or rollerblades with little engines!? Don’t tell me what I can’t use in my next 5k. Technology is here to stay!

Track has become an absolute joke.

We've already made better than it was like every generation before us, you're living in it enjoy it. Let us see how you make it better. You think all these advancement your living with happened last night.

Rolling Rock of Maine wrote:

Old burnt-out duds past their time will always have something meaningless to say; living in the past and hating on the present and future.

Shrivel up and fade away already.

Imagine if you will ..MLB using aluminum bats ... you’ve got a brain not all bidened out..? When technology ruins records and no one cares. Just remember Ron Clarke ran 13:16 and 27:39 on dirt...

They give an obvious advantage over previous shoes and they've been approved.

So lets move on because just like the full length swim suits that we also approved they're here now and nothing's going to change things back.

Oh 'ang on a sec:

"Beginning this year, swimmers are banned worldwide from wearing polyurethane and neoprene suits during competition...Dec 28, 2009"

Apologies, new to this forum. My previous post was an attempt to reply to "hold the press" regarding us old geezers not changing the world for the better.

Who is Tim Hutchins? Be relevant and then maybe I’ll care about your opinion.

Pretty dumb take by a dumb individual. No sh*t a pr isn’t the same anymore. But if I’m racing against someone wearing the shoes or I want to compare myself against what everyone else is doing, I’m going to wear the shoes.

Oregon should have their titles from the 60s and 70s stripped. I mean they had an unfair advantage. The best spikes, flats, singlets, shorts that were not commercially available. Custom made.