End the BS wrote:
runinovalsoften wrote:
If you can't handle a mask as a high school xc runner maybe take up golf or something like that?
Maybe grow a set and deal with the horrible risk of catching a cold?
Maybe grow a brain and realize even if it is just a cold for young people when they pass it to their older parents it won't be so mild?
Old and Slow wrote:
Michigan’s governor is and idiot and on a power trip. I sincerely hope Michigan isn’t dumb enough to elect her for another term.
This requirement is incredibly stupid. Some kid is going to have a serious medical issue trying to race a 5K with a mask on the entire time.
I grew up in Michigan (Just outside of Flint) and the majority of my family is still there. You couldn’t pay me enough to move back to that state.
I do live in Michigan but did not vote for Gretchen Whitmer. Some did not like any of her covid restrictions. I think many helped lower the case count. I don't think the boating restrictions or the restrictions regarding closing off sections of big box stores made much sense at the time. Other decisions may not make sense now that we know more about the virus but at the time we had less information.
But I am not sure how she can not flip flop on high school football. See below article. As part of the BigTen both Michigan State and the University of Michigan are not playing football this fall but somehow it is safe for Michigan school children. The reasons for reversal on football seems more of a concern of loosing kids to club sports than concern for their safety. Even before the pandemic many high schools and high school coaches in particular were afraid of loosing more athletes to club sports with their private coaching. I recently was dismayed at seeing hundreds of youth football players practicing at a grade school. They were all in one group as they are split up by age groups. The youth organization includes grades 1 through 8.
https://www.mlive.com/highschoolsports/2020/09/how-the-decision-was-made-to-bring-back-high-school-football-in-michigan.html?fbclid=IwAR3yHD_QUxWWRxY-FZMvNkVEZeUSzjRHQWxwz-fDm16kxbIXdzS-eqXB5mAYour governor is a moron, and outdoor spread is extremely negligible, so whether or not you have to wear masks during practices and meets, that's not how kids will spread the virus.
runinovalsoften wrote:
End the BS wrote:
Maybe grow a set and deal with the horrible risk of catching a cold?
Maybe grow a brain and realize even if it is just a cold for young people when they pass it to their older parents it won't be so mild?
Not just parents may contract the virus from young people. Teachers, coaches and assistant coaches, other school employees, along with grandparents may be hospitalized and could die due to spread from students. Many households are multi-generational. While most grade school and high school students may be asymptomatic or have apparently mild cases the long term affects on the body are not known. Some studies claim they have data showing damage to lungs and heart even in asymptomatic cases.
Snippet from below NPR report:
Rose says an asymptomatic outbreak on his team landed a 33-year-old assistant coach in intensive care for nearly two weeks, and sickened a player's mother. The risk of spread is greater, he says, in his rural county where many of his players live in multi-generational homes.
https://www.npr.org/2020/09/04/908967347/high-school-football-beloved-fall-tradition-or-unnecessary-coronavirus-risktalent over wrote:
Why does the Governor think she knows more than the experts? Democrats are all anti science. The CDC says it can only be spread if in constant contact in close proximity.
Yep. Democratic governors who kill thousands of sticking sick people in nursing homes then get celebrated as bringing down the impact of COVID in their state since they infected the super vulnerable populations and the virus is now running through less vulnerable people. There has been silencing of any differentiation of opinion amongst scientific experts by threatening loss of funding and ostracizing anyone who tries to offer the a different opinion. There are only a few top universities in the US who have actually stood behind their experts who have refused to give in to the false narratives.
The manipulation of facts by the NIH and big pharma has been so upsetting during this. Liberals wonder why masks have become such a hot button issue. Because they keep forcing the issue on everyone with non-science like this. Meanwhile, Pelosi has no problem going to the Salon without a mask and claiming it was a setup.
Precious Roy wrote:
With transmission rates still being very high in the US and Michigan, it is virtually guaranteed that there will be a very significant amount of transmission in high schools. This is very dangerous because HS age kids have parents who are mostly 40+ years old and are at higher risk for complications. And HS age kids have been shown to be able to transmit the virus as efficiently as adults.
Transmission rates were higher in August when the Governor allowed xc to compete without a mask. Now rates are lower, football is allowed to compete, and they're necessary? Be consistent.
big HONKING birds wrote:
Your governor is a moron, and outdoor spread is extremely negligible, so whether or not you have to wear masks during practices and meets, that's not how kids will spread the virus.
Near the start of the pandemic there were 5 teenagers handing out together trespassing on property next to the public rail to trail I ran on. They was close and not wearing masks. Being outside they were safer than hanging out together inside but they were not staying 6 feet apart. About two months ago I was running just after sunset and saw about 20 teenagers hanging out in the front yard of a neighbors house. I assume it was a party. I don't know how many may have been inside the house. They was not staying at least 6 feet apart and were not wearing masks. Colleges football teams made plans to keep athletes safer at practice but some players went to off campus parties where covid was spread. Weeks later students started returning to some colleges where off campus parties were found to spread covid. The area bars had crowds without mask. Greek houses at some colleges had outbreaks. All the changes to help stop the spread of covid in grade schools, high schools, and colleges will not stop the spread of covid if students and others ignore safety guidelines when they outside of school or outside of team practices and competitions.
Precious Roy wrote:
This is why we struggle with the virus while many other countries have it under control. No one is willing to make sacrifices for the greater good. We are a society of spoiled brats who get upset when the headphones we ordered on Amazon take three days instead of two.
When you breath hard during exercise/sports you produce a very high load of aerosols that can carry the virus. When you yell or talk with a raised voice during or right after breathing hard you also emit a very high load of aerosols. This is why there have been incidents where the virus spreads rapidly among team mates who do strength training in the same gym together. The risk of aerosols spreading outside is considerably lower than inside, but there still is a risk.
Mask wearing helps reduce the risk of transmission, but does not provide 100% protection. A lot depends on the quality of the mask. There is evidence that neck gaiters and masks made to be easy to exercise in do a very poor job of holding in aerosols.
And then there is the problem of compliance. Kids are kids. You may be able to get them to wear masks in competition, but there will always be instances where kids blow it off in practice.
With transmission rates still being very high in the US and Michigan, it is virtually guaranteed that there will be a very significant amount of transmission in high schools. This is very dangerous because HS age kids have parents who are mostly 40+ years old and are at higher risk for complications. And HS age kids have been shown to be able to transmit the virus as efficiently as adults.
HS sports are not so important that we need to risk additional transmission. The only responsible thing to do is cancel the season and wait until there is a vaccine or transmission rates are near elimination levels. Letting kids compete with masks is not a responsible compromise. It is just setting kids up for failure. Sports are not that important. Kids need to keep their parents safe and need to go to class more than they need to play sports for one year.
Tell this to the senior athlete who, although not a very good student, has put in the hard academic work needed to remain eligible for their chosen sport. Sports will never be zero risk, nor will life. Who are you to decide what is and is not important to everyone else? By all means, stay home and stay safe if that is the most important thing in your life. Allow others to choose for themselves.
hyfchncbbnmkg wrote:
It's just not feasible. Races will be decided by who has the most porous mask.
You cannot run with any intensity in a mask.
and you probably made fun of rupp for trying to squeeze out a small advantage while wearing a mask LOL
http://citiusmag.com/rupp-mask-history/Precious Roy wrote:
The only responsible thing to do is cancel the season and wait until there is a vaccine or...
Except the lefty media is building a campaign against the vaccine as we speak. Don't count on anyone taking a vaccine developed under Trump. We're going to have to wait until a vaccine is created under a liberal administration.
Since they are allowing football to start, why are they still requiring cross country teams to start six feet apart and limiting entries to just a handful of teams?
Will they require the opposing team in football to line up 6 feet away on the line of scrimmage and will a player be considered down by "social distancing contact" when a defender is within 6 feet of a ball carrier?
So much doesn't seem to make any sense...
Ward Cleaver wrote:
Since they are allowing football to start, why are they still requiring cross country teams to start six feet apart and limiting entries to just a handful of teams?
Will they require the opposing team in football to line up 6 feet away on the line of scrimmage and will a player be considered down by "social distancing contact" when a defender is within 6 feet of a ball carrier?
So much doesn't seem to make any sense...
This is fully a power grab and it is getting very scary. The New Jersey governor has used this to completely bypass the state legislature and increase is his executive power and his people are eating this up and calling him a hero. It's fine since he's a good old progressive so obviously hes a good guy.
They seem to have forgotten he made hundreds of millions effing up the American Economy during the subprime days and has such cronies as Bush era Sec of Treasury Hank Paulson. But wait they can't be collaborators because one is a dem and the other a rep? They were smart enough to get out of Goldman with their millions built on a house of cards right before the collapse and then bail Hank bailed out his cronies who were responsible for the mess.
Shocking that New Jersey and New York elected governors who played leading roles in the great recession and repeated unfairness of the crony capitalist system we are living with and are now holding these corrupt individuals up as heroes. The Democratic party is just as gullible to these cronies backed by corrupt corporate lobbying machine as the Republicans.
runinovalsoften wrote:
Mostly because it makes the old people I pass on the trail feel better. I agree it's mostly virtue signaling but I'd much rather run with a piece of cloth over my face than spread something to someones grandma. If I'm fast in a mask I'll be faster without one.
lol those old people are in for a rough final few years with their fear and anxiety of being anywhere near anyone. lol at those virtue signaling that they care about those old people to buy them a few more years of life. A life of fear and anxiety and making all kinds of crazy effort to pull a mask over their face when venturing outside.
XC - during non running related activity. No different than the MHSAA guidelines set forth back in July August. Stretching, dynamics walking to starting line etc, masks required. XC meets so far have been handled very well by teams, coaches and parents. Its when administration at any level gets involved and the sh$t show begins
runinovalsoften wrote: The science says that universal mask wearing can save thousands of lives.
Uh, "science" says no such thing. People who build models simply assume that masks will have some degree of effectiveness and *presto* their model spits out some random number of lives 'saved'. Garbage in...garbage out.
OP, what qualifies as a "mask"? Can you run with a buff? Lots of us in the north run with a buff or something similar in the depths of winter anyway, so it's not uncharted territory. Or punch holes in whatever mask is required.
But yeah, another idiotic rule.
They may have a change of heart after some kid passes out from trying to run with a mask.
A lot of ridiculous going on in the world today. I can't figure out why sane people are allowing it to continue.
Precious Roy wrote:
HS sports are not so important that we need to risk additional transmission. The only responsible thing to do is cancel the season and wait until there is a vaccine or transmission rates are near elimination levels. Letting kids compete with masks is not a responsible compromise. It is just setting kids up for failure. Sports are not that important. Kids need to keep their parents safe and need to go to class more than they need to play sports for one year.
This approach really makes no sense in the long run, because it's not going to be just "one year" of lost sports any more than it was "two weeks to flatten the curve". CV-19 is here to stay, it's not going away. Vaccines aren't going to be a magic bullet. Herd Immunity is not a magic bullet. (Masks are a joke). Even trying to minimize community spread is really just postponing the inevitable.
Parents who are scared of Covid can prevent their kids from going playing sports at school. Heck, they can keep them locked in the basement and out of school and society altogether so they don't "set them up for failure" by exposing them to real-world risks. See how that turns out.
The rest of us are perfectly capable of deciding what risks we are willing to tolerate.
Michigan Hobby Jogger wrote:
runinovalsoften wrote:
Maybe grow a brain and realize even if it is just a cold for young people when they pass it to their older parents it won't be so mild?
Not just parents may contract the virus from young people. Teachers, coaches and assistant coaches, other school employees, along with grandparents may be hospitalized and could die due to spread from students. Many households are multi-generational. While most grade school and high school students may be asymptomatic or have apparently mild cases the long term affects on the body are not known. Some studies claim they have data showing damage to lungs and heart even in asymptomatic cases.
Snippet from below NPR report:
Rose says an asymptomatic outbreak on his team landed a 33-year-old assistant coach in intensive care for nearly two weeks, and sickened a player's mother. The risk of spread is greater, he says, in his rural county where many of his players live in multi-generational homes.
https://www.npr.org/2020/09/04/908967347/high-school-football-beloved-fall-tradition-or-unnecessary-coronavirus-risk
I think I'll have to side with Mr. Grow A Pair. The "You could get so and so sick" is such a BS argument because that can be used for every virus from this point forward because the nature of human contact is you can always get someone sick unknowingly. The discussion should be about how bad is this. It's not an end of days plaugue, it's not even the initial models or Imperial College disgrace. At the end of the day, it looks like we're going to end up between 240,000-280,000 in the US. That would equate to around a month of excess deaths for a year, but it will likely be far less as many would have died within the year or next year as they were very sick people too begin with.
The curve is already coming down in America, its not because of increased social distancing and mask use, it's achieving an increasing level of herd immunity.
The American people are willingly surrendering their freedoms for a disease that will kill less than .1% of the population with actions that are saving very few lives.
anonymous4now wrote:
They may have a change of heart after some kid passes out from trying to run with a mask.
A lot of ridiculous going on in the world today. I can't figure out why sane people are allowing it to continue.
Nah the liberals and leftist will pat themselves on the back for their success in how much control they influenced over the kids.
Runner10287 wrote:
anonymous4now wrote:
They may have a change of heart after some kid passes out from trying to run with a mask.
A lot of ridiculous going on in the world today. I can't figure out why sane people are allowing it to continue.
Nah the liberals and leftist will pat themselves on the back for their success in how much control they influenced over the kids.
Exactly. When I made decisions that ended up killing thousands of nursing home patients the Dems wanted to give me a medal and I got so much airtime. They may even nominate me for president. Have you seen what me and my Wall Street Bro Murph have done? We have a death ratio 3 times the national average and the people just let us keep on making more and more rules. Telling people what to do is awesome!