Is this the end for Kipchoge?

They should have a match race, just the two of them and a few pacers as long as they can last.

Lopes got the silver in the 10,000 nearly a decade before --not as young as Kipchoge but not exactly a late bloomer.

Seyta wrote:

This isn't Western Media. This is AFRICAN media (specifically Kenyan) describing how Kenyans are not aware of their age and engage in age-cheating. What are you even arguing against, when ACTUAL Kenyans living in Kenya are describing the situation?

I know I should be used to it by now but, man, the ignorance on this site is staggering. Other than the minor matter of whitesplaining my own country to me, I'll just drop a few facts which I don't expect to change your mind at all, as I've dealt with too many of your kind:

1. The Kenyan article is about criminality. An overwhelming majority of Kenyans, since the late 70s are born in hospital. The few in very remote areas who aren't, have to be registered at the local village chief's within days or the baby can't have access to basic government services. I don't know about Ethiopia, but most Kenyans know the exact date, and even time, of their birth.

2. It's always how they're deliberately age-cheating or can't possibly know when they were born, followed by some white foreigner confidently stating their "true" ages for them. So basically nothing's changed since colonial times. Of course, the implicit point being that Black Africans are predisposed to untruths. Always eager to believe the worst, most extreme, most negative thing you hear.

3. Eliud, being Catholic, would have a record of his baptism at his parish. Easily verifiable although snooping through personal records would be something only Western journalists would do without compunction

4. Finally, I find interacting with most of you people, even the supposedly educated, extremely trying. This is how you sound:

London marathon elite race is happening.

El Keniano, I've read your posts before, and you are a biased person. (I am sure that most people are biased.)

When I read your post and Seyta's post, I give greater weight to Seyta's post.

You have not directly responded to the serious and substantial points in his post, especially the third-person articles he references, and the sources referenced by those articles.

Instead, you attack him, and then insist that the facts are otherwise, without providing any evidence beyond your own statements.

From reading Seyta's references, I would suggest that the situation in Kenya may well be changing, and moving toward greater accuracy in stating athletes' ages. But athletes like Kipchoge and Gebreselassie, who were born in the 1970s or 1980s, may indeed have been born in times of less rigorous accuracy. Even you should be able to admit that.

Even in the last twenty years, can we doubt that incentives remained for African athletes to falsify their ages (usually by understating them)? Where there is a longtime habit of inaccuracy, and an ongoing incentive to maintain that habit, there is room for reasonable doubt that accuracy is being strictly observed even today. This is not "whitesplaining," this is simple logic based on understanding of human nature.

Alfred de Musset wrote:

It's even worse for Kenenisa.

He had a great window to beat the marathon world record and now it is closing. Kipchoge can't do much better than he has done, he has had the WR and the gold at marathon. He only target a second gold I assume.

+100000000

And I'm a huge Bekele's fan, but father time is undefeated, and even his track WRs may soon be broken.

London isn’t cancelled. No idea if Kipchoge wants to run it, of course.

El Keniano, did you even READ the article? It doesn't discuss criminality at ALL. It discusses the phenomenon of how falsifying ages has hurt older Kenyans because the system in place does not allow them to retire, and that one of the motivations behind the issue has been age-cheating in sports.

The journalist also describes that registering of school-age children only started in 2018, and that a portion Kenyans do not have either birth certificates or death certificates.

Again, you're not even arguing against Western Media. This is a KENYAN JOURNALIST Moses Ojuang, who was born in Kenya, grew up in Kenya, and writes for one of the most prominent Kenyan newspapers.

Who do you think knows more about the current state of affairs in Kenya? You? Or a Kenyan journalist?

More importantly, this is not "whitesplaining" your own country to you. You are arguing against KENYA's media. A KENYAN is explaining to you that Kenyans often lie about or do not know their own ages (often to their detriment later in life).

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

In fact, we can just ignore all western media from this point onwards. Here are four sources from African media, three of which are from Kenya:

Here is an article from Kenyan publication Daily Nation again, describing that 2 members of the 2019 Kenyan World Jr. XC team were kicked off due to age cheating. In addition, it describes that how this was determined was that one produced a birth certificate but no ID (which apparently holds greater weight), and the other could not produce official documents to verify age at all. The articles go on to describe that in the past, they had issues with athletes who competed at world juniors over many years, using different birth certificates to falsify age.

Next, here is an article from another Kenyan publication describing that in order to combat Age-Cheating in Football, Kenya's most prominent sport, Kenya is implementing MRI scanning:

And here is an article from another Kenyan publication describing how Athletics Kenya had to issue warnings against Age-Cheating, and how they actually caught individuals who falsified their ages:

And here is an article from AfricaNews, headquartered in Congo, written by Victor Muisyo, who apparently lives in Ethiopia:

The article describes how rampant age-cheating is in the CAF tournaments. Yes, this is the Confederation of African Football, meaning that this is not angry Europeans accusing Africans of age-cheating, it is various African teams accusing each others' players of cheating. In fact, the writers goes on to BLAME age-cheating as the reason African teams are not competitive at the senior-level, because it causes otherwise younger talented Africans to not continue with the sport.

The article also goes on to describe that in many African nations, individuals age-cheat unintentionally because they do not have birth certificates, and often do not know their own age.

~~~~~~~~~~~~

Would you like to explain to these actual African journalists that their conclusions about their own countries are incorrect?

If you are indeed a Kenyan with strong ties to Kenya, you clearly don't seem to know your own country's reports particularly well.

Seyta wrote:

The article also goes on to describe that in many African nations, individuals age-cheat unintentionally because they do not have birth certificates, and often do not know their own age.

~~~~~~~~~~~~

Would you like to explain to these actual African journalists that their conclusions about their own countries are incorrect?

If you are indeed a Kenyan with strong ties to Kenya, you clearly don't seem to know your own country's reports particularly well.

Mic Drop.

El Keniano, you lost everyone's respect when you made it about race and said things like "whitesplaining." That kind of language is useless in a civilized discussion about an important issue.

And you never addressed the substantive claims raised in all the above articles posted by several different people.

In the articles, apparently the Kenyan orgs state that MRI is used to assess true age?

Can someone explain exactly how an MRI is that accurate when it comes to this? The Kenyan rep apparently seems quite confident that they can catch age-cheaters with that.

"Whitesplaining"? Aren't you white, El Keniano?

oranges wrote:

"Whitesplaining"? Aren't you white, El Keniano?

Do I sound white to you?

Work Commute Track Club wrote:

London marathon elite race is happening.

I hope you have some inside knowledge.