While it is fair at least to question the success of the 1980s Brits, there is one person that no one here doubts is dodgy and that is Said Aouita. Except for you of course.
While it is fair at least to question the success of the 1980s Brits, there is one person that no one here doubts is dodgy and that is Said Aouita. Except for you of course.
Lay off the recreational drugs wrote:
While it is fair at least to question the success of the 1980s Brits, there is one person that no one here doubts is dodgy and that is Said Aouita. Except for you of course.
What's with all this "dodgy" stuff? You Brits are weird with your strange lingo. According to ruler of this thread it is not fair nor appropriate to "question the success of the 80s Brits."
Subway Surfers Addiction wrote:
Deanouk wrote:
LOL. I'm sorry but that's been YOUR role, as I documented in my previous post. You're the one who has got mixed up, lumped 2 different posters together, mis-quoted me and are now attempting to mis-direct accusations. It's an age old ploy and isn't fooling anyone.
Beyer doped. End of. It doesn't matter whether it were steroids, blood transfusions (which actually weren't illegal at the time) or anything else. His name is on an official document created by his own government. There is no hiding from that.
I would bet good money that Straub would have been doing both while Beyer probably was doing both, given his one off performance, this makes sense.
+1
I like Moroccan Runners wrote:
Coevett wrote:
Well I just hope none of you guys defending Aouita and East German dopers are in any way, shape, or form involved with track and field.
C'mon...that's nonsense and unfair! Because I and others like Aouita as an athlete we're defending him? And defending him of what? Your own personal suspicion that he's a doper? There's no proof - nothing even mentioned on his Wikipedia site.
You're undermining his accomplishments as arguably the most versatile distance runner ever. You're obsessed with smearing Aouita and obfuscating his place in the history of world class distance running. And what's irrational on your part is you will aggressively condemn & criticize anyone who suspects Coe or any other British mid-d runner of using PEDs, but yet you accuse Aouita of doping condemning as an evil person or something...and expect everyone to support your position or they're "defending" him.
Aouita was a great talent with his blend of raw speed & endurance. He trained very hard and interestingly was self-coached. He laid it on the line when showed up to race. You knew Aouita left everything out on the track and never made excuses. Even your impeccable hero Coe had a few nice things to say about Aouita in this interesting review of his training & accomplishments:
https://www.runnerstribe.com/features/special-methods-training-said-aouita/
Haha, you're an even bigger moron than the 'detailsareimportant' guy. Aouita must be innocent because there is nothing on his Wikipedia page. But thanks for reminding me - I keep meaning to change that. It is a disgrace that his Wikipedia doesn't at least mention the Australian coaching scandal where he pressured a number of athletes to take HGH.
You actually said earlier in this threat that 'everybody is dirty'. That's why you and 'detailsareimportant' shouldn't be anywhere near track and field. Although especially that moron who defended Beyer's coach feeding 13 year old girls illegal drugs that caused heart failure in one of them.
Yankee wrote:
Lay off the recreational drugs wrote:
While it is fair at least to question the success of the 1980s Brits, there is one person that no one here doubts is dodgy and that is Said Aouita. Except for you of course.
What's with all this "dodgy" stuff? You Brits are weird with your strange lingo. According to ruler of this thread it is not fair nor appropriate to "question the success of the 80s Brits."
You can slander Coe all you like (at the risk of a possible law suit from him) with not even any circumstantial evidence, speaking for myself what is annoying me in this thread is the utter stupidity and immorality of certain people who are claiming that 'Coe was dirty' but athletes directly connected with drugs controversy such as Beyer and Aouita were clean.
Coevett wrote:
Yankee wrote:
What's with all this "dodgy" stuff? You Brits are weird with your strange lingo. According to ruler of this thread it is not fair nor appropriate to "question the success of the 80s Brits."
You can slander Coe all you like (at the risk of a possible law suit from him) with not even any circumstantial evidence, speaking for myself what is annoying me in this thread is the utter stupidity and immorality of certain people who are claiming that 'Coe was dirty' but athletes directly connected with drugs controversy such as Beyer and Aouita were clean.
Where did I slander Coe? Where did I say he used PEDs? I was jumping a post in response to "Lay off the recreational drugs." My point, if you would closey read the post, is a) you seem to be ruler (translation: controller) of this thread and all Coe related threads, and b) "Lay off the recreational drugs" states "While it is fair at least to question the success of the 1980s Brits," my response is if anyone was to do that then you feel it's not appropriate.
OTOH, there's this thread a about year and half go where some posters believe he was blood doping and that it was unlikely he was clean giving their reason for believing so. In going through the posts, I don't see you attacking posters like you do here (unless you're posting under a different user name or not active back then). Read the posts for yourself - there are some hostile responses...maybe you were posting under a different handle?
http://www.letsrun.com/forum/flat_read.php?thread=6985614&page=4Yankee wrote:
Coevett wrote:
You can slander Coe all you like (at the risk of a possible law suit from him) with not even any circumstantial evidence, speaking for myself what is annoying me in this thread is the utter stupidity and immorality of certain people who are claiming that 'Coe was dirty' but athletes directly connected with drugs controversy such as Beyer and Aouita were clean.
Where did I slander Coe? Where did I say he used PEDs? I was jumping a post in response to "Lay off the recreational drugs." My point, if you would closey read the post, is a) you seem to be ruler (translation: controller) of this thread and all Coe related threads, and b) "Lay off the recreational drugs" states "While it is fair at least to question the success of the 1980s Brits," my response is if anyone was to do that then you feel it's not appropriate.
"the ruler of this thread". Learn to speak English like an adult please.
You said that anyone should be able to attribute Coe, Cram, Ovett's success to ped use. I simply replied that sure, of course you can. Just try to use some semblance of argument and don't meanwhile defend confirmed dopers.
The story you linked about Coe seems pretty absurd to me, and is in no way the same category as, for example, Beyer's coach being convicted of supplying illegal drugs to 13 year old athletes, or Aouita being chased out of Australia after accusations of pressurizing athletes to take PEDs.
Coe pulled out of the Helsinki Games because it was obvious something was wrong with him and he didn't have a chance to medal. He was subsequently diagnosed with the blood disorder.
Learn to weigh evidence.
Coevett wrote:
casual obsever wrote:
Rainbows and unicorns...
It's not that your theory - that British mid-distance runners were especially clean, even in the 80s - is hard to understand. It is rather that it is absurd. Neither are Brits especially honest, nor do mid-distance not benefit from doping.
It's only absurd if you start with the far more absurd assumption that every athlete on Earth dopes, equally in all places in all times. All the arguments presented for that assumptions so far have been pathetic.
Brits are more honest than most, and certainly more honest than Moroccans or Kenyans. You have to have your a** in your head to think otherwise. Mid-distance events do not benefit as much from doping as other events, with 800m benefiting the least. Ventihole's argument that '400m guys benefit from steroids, 5000m guys benefit from EPO, therefore mid-distance benefits twice as much as either as it falls between the two is utterly absurd. It's a bit like arguing that because AfroAmericans dominate the sprints, and East Africans dominate long distance that white runners should be even less likely to be able to compete in the 800/1500 as these events fall between sprints and long distance and should therefore be dominated by BOTH AfroAmericans AND East Africans!
In a recent corruption index GB placed 10th and Morocco was 90th with Kenya 145th.
Here's someone giving their opinion on British mid-d runners that you don't like (imagine that). And Brits "are more honest than most?" Lol...I'm sure my Irish ancestors from County Antrim would really agree with that statement
Haha, "blood disorder"?
Sounds like a transfusion gone wrong.
Sounds like terminology we now hear in cycling.
I would not put anything past the golden child of track in the steroid era.
lkgkj wrote:
Haha, "blood disorder"?
Sounds like a transfusion gone wrong.
Sounds like terminology we now hear in cycling.
I would not put anything past the golden child of track in the steroid era.
Haha, you buried Covett again. The ruler of this thread is now 6 feet under.
He wont answer the question for the nth time - 'How could Beyer cheat when he's a Maths teacher?' Beyer didn't give those kids illegal drugs, his coach did. And did any of them die? NO!
Coe fan bois make me puke. Brits were as dirty as the East Germans, and less dirty than Aouita or it would say on his Wikipedia that he was juiced to the gills.
lkgkj wrote:
Haha, "blood disorder"?
Sounds like a transfusion gone wrong.
Sounds like terminology we now hear in cycling.
I would not put anything past the golden child of track in the steroid era.
Name one other person who has had this problem out of all the people who were blood doping. If you did get a problem it would be sepsis (blood poisoning) and would require hospital treatment.If you survived it though it is not going to keep you out for months
Thanks, Doctor, trying to cover up for Coe.
Coe fits the "all Olympians are sick as hell" theory we see now... they are all asthmatics, have blood disorders, need transfusions, etc.
I am sure he would have tested positive for tainted meat back in the day if it was an excuse. Listen, don't you all realize Coe is the protected class in the sport? He should be expelled from the IAAF but pulled all strings possible to retain his position although he is the most corrupt human alive.
If you cheat in business, mighty easy to cheat while an athlete.
Coevett wrote:
You said that anyone should be able to attribute Coe, Cram, Ovett's success to ped use. I simply replied that sure, of course you can. Just try to use some semblance of argument and don't meanwhile defend confirmed dopers.
Huh? Where did I say that?
Coevett wrote:
The story you linked about Coe seems pretty absurd to me, and is in no way the same category as, for example, Beyer's coach being convicted of supplying illegal drugs to 13 year old athletes, or Aouita being chased out of Australia after accusations of pressurizing athletes to take PEDs.
I linked it from someone's post on this thread because I thought, given that Coe was topic of conversation, you'd be very active on it...I guess not.
Coevett wrote:
Coe pulled out of the Helsinki Games because it was obvious something was wrong with him and he didn't have a chance to medal. He was subsequently diagnosed with the blood disorder. Learn to weigh evidence.
FFS, I wasn't the OP of the thread...go bump it and tell him!
Coevett wrote:
"the ruler of this thread". Learn to speak English like an adult please.
Ridiculous remark pertaining to an informal discussion forum! FFS, I'm typing fast on a small smartphone while doing some other things. But since you want to be a jerk about something so trivial (I have bookmarked these links just for these special occasions. Lol):
https://www.sciencealert.com/people-who-pick-up-grammar-mistakes-jerks-scientists-findhttp://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-3515520/Are-grammar-Nazi-Language-pedants-likely-introverted-disagreeable.htmlkajsdklj wrote:
Thanks, Doctor, trying to cover up for Coe.
Coe fits the "all Olympians are sick as hell" theory we see now... they are all asthmatics, have blood disorders, need transfusions, etc.
I am sure he would have tested positive for tainted meat back in the day if it was an excuse. Listen, don't you all realize Coe is the protected class in the sport? He should be expelled from the IAAF but pulled all strings possible to retain his position although he is the most corrupt human alive.
If you cheat in business, mighty easy to cheat while an athlete.
http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/general/athletics/sebastian-coe-iaaf-corruption-russian-doping-emails-cover-up-a7555216.html
Interesting article.
The one important insight from this thread is the revelation - never before even published on an English language forum or news site - that Olaf Beyer's coach was busted quite recently for feeding 13 year old girls illegal drugs that cause heart failure.
This was in the unified Germany, so it truly beggers belief that the same coach under a Marxist regime that ran the most notorious state sponsored doping program in history would not have been doping Beyer and his other athletes - Jurgen Straub and Jens Peter Herold.
All three cost British medals.
Olaf Beyer - cost Ovett 800m Gold (and the double) and Coe the Silver at the European Championships in 1978.
Jurgen Straub - cost Ovett the Silver medal (and arguably the Gold medal) at the Moscow 1980 Olympics 1500m.
Jens Peter Herold - cost Steve Cram the bronze medal at the 1988 Olympic 1500m.
kajsdklj wrote:
Thanks, Doctor, trying to cover up for Coe.
Coe fits the "all Olympians are sick as hell" theory we see now... they are all asthmatics, have blood disorders, need transfusions, etc.
I am sure he would have tested positive for tainted meat back in the day if it was an excuse. Listen, don't you all realize Coe is the protected class in the sport? He should be expelled from the IAAF but pulled all strings possible to retain his position although he is the most corrupt human alive.
If you cheat in business, mighty easy to cheat while an athlete.
http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/general/athletics/sebastian-coe-iaaf-corruption-russian-doping-emails-cover-up-a7555216.html
Like how you ignore the fact that Coe has been cleared in that case (allegedly misleading the British parliament over his knowledge of Russian doping).
Other than that your whole argument rests on his blood disorder. Yes, athletes do get sick, especially athletes who aren't on peds. Coe was one of the lightest middle-distance guys of that era and often got sick or injured. That's the exact opposite of somebody who is juicing to the gills. It's no coincidence that the 90's athletes NEVER seemed to get injured or ill, and the few times they did, could bounce straight back with a sub 3:30 the very next week.
Wow, Coe covering up for the Russians is weak-sauce.
Lets Be Real Here wrote:
[quote]kajsdklj wrote:
Thanks, Doctor, trying to cover up for Coe.
Coe fits the "all Olympians are sick as hell" theory we see now... they are all asthmatics, have blood disorders, need transfusions, etc.
I am sure he would have tested positive for tainted meat back in the day if it was an excuse. Listen, don't you all realize Coe is the protected class in the sport? He should be expelled from the IAAF but pulled all strings possible to retain his position although he is the most corrupt human alive.
If you cheat in business, mighty easy to cheat while an athlete.
http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/general/athletics/sebastian-coe-iaaf-corruption-russian-doping-emails-cover-up-a7555216.html
Some more Coe and his integrity being questioned -
;lkjl; wrote:
Some more Coe and his integrity being questioned -
http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/general/athletics/sebastian-coe-select-committee-questions-snub-athletics-corruption-scandal-drugs-cheats-a7521876.htmlhttps://www.theguardian.com/sport/2017/jan/10/sebastian-coe-athletics-corruption-undermined-dave-bedfordhttps://www.theguardian.com/sport/2017/feb/01/sebastian-coe-increasing-scrutiny-iaaf-athletics-nick-davies
Oh, left-wing British newspapers trying to bury Tory boy Coe. Well he's still standing a year later.
Over the last few years the left wing media have tried to destroy notable Conservatives as being child abusers, even child murdering Satanic abuse worshippers (Ted Heath, Leon Britton etc).
At worst Coe might have bottled being the one who blew the whistle on Russian doping and then misled the British parliament. The actual Russian whistelblower now needs 24/7 security and a new identity. Coe has more than redeemed himself in having the balls dealing with Russia since then. A s if any of you snowflakes would have done better than him in his position.
Coevett wrote:
Oh, left-wing British newspapers trying to bury Tory boy Coe. Well he's still standing a year later.
Over the last few years the left wing media have tried to destroy notable Conservatives as being child abusers, even child murdering Satanic abuse worshippers (Ted Heath, Leon Britton etc).
At worst Coe might have bottled being the one who blew the whistle on Russian doping and then misled the British parliament. The actual Russian whistelblower now needs 24/7 security and a new identity. Coe has more than redeemed himself in having the balls dealing with Russia since then. A s if any of you snowflakes would have done better than him in his position.
+1.
For someone who supposedly helped cover up Russian positive test results, it's strange he was the only sporting head who stuck to his guns, after most of his critics on here said he wouldn't, and maintained a blanket ban of Russian athletes at the Rio Olympics. It wasn't some ephemeral gesture, because 18 months later the ban is still in place, as the independent integrity unit, which Coe set up, has deemed the Russians still haven't done enough to clean their act up. Not the sort of behaviour of someone wishing to maintain the status quo and who has something to hide in 'helping' the Russians.