50+ Masters Training and Racing Open Forum

Just checking in, not much to report...

Ran my 2nd & 3rd races of the year the past two weekends. And I was once again blessed with horrible running conditions in both races! Last weeks 20K was a disaster. It was about 28 deg, heavy snow, windy and about an inch brand new slush. My feet were soaked and frozen after just 2 miles. Managed to get thru 6 just under 6:00 pace...then the turnaround came. 6-1/2 miles straight into a freezing cold wind. I lost my will to compete and just wanted to be done. Ended up 7th OA, 1st Masters but embarrassed with my time so I won't post it here..

Friday nights 5K: Again it was cold, about 35 deg. Wind was screaming at 25mph. Fortunately it was mostly a crosswind but still...Geeez. Went 5:26/5:31/5:37 17:05 and won overall. 89.11% AG.

So I'm at the end of my 100 day base building phase. Kind of faded recently but I think I'm in pretty good shape. I'm taking it pretty easy for a few days to give my Achilles and calves a rest.

No race plans other than my HM at the end May. May jump in a low key local race if I'm feeling it...

Have a good one everyone,

Dave

Nice 5k racerdb. WOC, hope you are feeling better soon. I think that it's difficult for us to reconcile ourselves to the fact that any kind of trauma, even what we think is minor surgical trauma, has a lot more impact and takes more recovery time as the years add up.

I had a slow but good mileage week of 53 miles. My hamstrings were so sore from kicking in the finish of Carlsbad that I took Monday off and only ran 3 miles on Tuesday. There was some young guy (teens, early 20s in the wrong race?) running near me in the Carlsbad 5k masters race. About 200yds from the finish he thought he would sprint away from me, but I had a different viewpoint on that. I beat him to the line by about a half-step, but really went to the well to do it. My legs were really dead until Friday when they started feeling better. I promptly undid that with my Saturday run with my son and daughter-in-law. This morning's trail 12 miler was almost a minute a mile slower than the same loop two weeks ago. I kept telling myself as I struggled on the run that as soon as my legs recover I will be fitter.

Badgers really stunk it up last night!! What's the deal with Bo - can he coach at all? Kaminsky should have been given the green light to slash to the goal!!

Free throws choked the red at the end!

WOC, any type of surgery (even minor) is a shock to the body. Give yourself a little "bounce back" time. Then double it! Dave, that 20K sounds like a strength of character exercise. I would have been crying like a little....sprinter! We are strong, we are fast, but I don't think we're necessarily tough. Hurdlers, however are brave. And crazy.

I'm feeling very much like a brave crazy hurdler today. I hooked up with a new friend who is working on becoming a 3-stepping hurdler. She has a coach and he was happy to invite me to participate in their Sunday morning practices. Today was my first one and I had SO MUCH FUN!

This week was pretty good for me. I ran a few miles on Tuesday (just to help shake off a pound or two), did stairs and sprints on Thursday, lifted like a fiend on Friday, coached on Saturday, and hurdled on Sunday. Now I need a nap. I was involved in a freak accident at the gym on Friday (I was unhurt). I was on the glute press machine getting ready to explosively lift the first set and a guy wandered behind me and dropped his towel. He bent down to pick it up just when I pressed backward with my right leg. The pedal hit him on the side of his face and knocked him backwards. He was a younger guy so it didn't knock him out or anything, but it looked like he was going to get a shiner. I felt bad, but he acknowledged he should have looked what was going on instead of diving for his towel.

On that happy note, hope everyone has a great week!

WOC wrote:

Emergency gall bladder surgery on Monday, missed entire week of most anything. Strange, it was laparoscopic so I didn't expect it to knock me around so badly, worst than any of the cancer treatments.

Hope to be back running this week, consider it a 1 week break. Just over a week ago I was cruising along with everything going smoothly. The value of good health!

Have a good week all!

WOC, best of luck on a speedy and full recovery from this one. You are an incredibly inspirational person; I respect your drive and noble goals.

Praying for good healing, WOC. I concur with Spikez, grant yourself the space to recover well.

Racerdb, I wondered if anyone was racing last Saturday in the upper Midwest. There was a HM here in Lexington on that Saturday, and us folks that opted to go down to Knoxville felt we got lucky with our choice. Those that ran the "Run the Bluegrass" HM said it got pretty cold and wet by the end. Can't imagine what it was like further north! Good on ya for toughing it out! And an excellent followup 5K this weekend!

Well, I'm having a hell of a time this year. In February, my left calf started to cramp during a run, so I stopped and walked in, thinking I was being smart. But the cramp wouldn't go away and I couldn't run for more than 90 seconds, so I took 4 weeks off and ran in the pool. Then I started with 2 min. jogs/1 min. walks on St. Patrick's Day and all was good. I worked my way up for 3 min. runs the first week and was able to do the running part pretty damn quickly. The 2nd week, I worked up to 10 x 5 min. run/1 min. jog. And then, last Sunday, on about the 8th one, it cramped up again! Back to square one. ;( I tried jogging Monday, but quickly figured out that it wasn't going to work, so back in the pool. ARGH.

Since I know I didn't tear the muscle and it was taking so long for it to "heal", I knew that it had to be something else. At first, I thought it was caused by dehydration. I'd gotten violently ill in January, flew to Boulder in February - and I hurt the calf the next day. But even though I felt I was plenty hydrated - my body still acted like it wasn't - dry chapped lips, itchy skin (though that could have been the chlorine), headaches. After some research - on line and into my own eating, I think it's that I was very low on magnesium and potassium (and probably calcium, too). So, I started taking that earlier this week and today, my calf felt pretty good - good enough to try a few running steps in my walk (the pool doesn't open until 1 pm on Sunday).

Towards the end of my walk, however, I turned my right ankle and completely lost my balance - staggering and unable to hold myself up - although I felt gently. I finished the walk with little pain, but later, my ankle started to really hurt and swell (it's been iced and wrapped). So GREAT - I probably could have started the walk/jog thing again, but now I have to deal with a twisted ankle!! More pool time. ugh. I've been there practically every day for 6 weeks.

I feel like I'm completely falling apart. I really do think the underlying issue with the calf may be the vitamin/mineral issue, combined with peri-menopause/hormones, but the ankle thing seems more random (although lack of balance is also a sign of internal troubles). I do have to get screened for a blood clot, too, I guess, even though my flight wasn't very long.

Ugh.

Get well soon WOC. Keep hitting those SW Virgina hills Rtype. Very nice 5k Dave.

I hit 34 miles for the week including 2 7 milers at 7600ft and 19 degrees visiting my son at Adams State. Have a looooong way to go before feeling like a runner again but I'm motivated.

Good week y'all.

KP

Sounds serious and complicated. I would still say a muscle tear is more likely than the other things you mentioned. If mineral deficiency or dehydration then you would sometimes (at least once, right?) get cramping in other muscles. Blood clot is possible, I am no expert but I question whether it would hang on for so long.

I am still getting the left calf cramps but only during Yoga. Mine I am sure is a tear or chronic tightness or both. In Yoga we spend so much of our time internally focused that I can now predict the cramp before it happens! I can actually feel a "pre-cramp" cramping sensation and just making a slight adjustment in the effort level in my left calf will ward it off. Examples of adjustments: vinyasa jump through to sitting with my left leg crossed outside of my right; full lotus left leg crossed first, then the right leg; shoulder-stand and head-stand feet dorsi-flexed instead of plantar-flexed.

Balance in my experience is even more complicated, I could go on forever. As you say it might be random, I would just wait to see if it recurs.

Here's some 5K advice:

Wow...Where did you find that? That's from the old Hal Higdon message board I used to belong to. And times have changed since then...I can no longer do two workouts during the week and a long run.

Dave

I used to lurk there, but they closed the backdoor I was using to get in. I have a feeling gretehund will be able to handle the workouts.

Wow MG, I had no idea you'd had this kind of start to the year. If calf massages and electrolyte drinks aren't doing the trick, seems to me a trip to a seasoned professional for some blood work, etc. might be in order (says the guy who is always so reluctant to go see a doctor.) Hope that you can get it figured out soon!

What lucKY said. Get checked out by a doc, blood-work, etc. Can't hurt.

Happy to see my friend, and well regarded masters runner, Don Coffman back on the roads. He's had a few setbacks in recent years, but 20:41 @71 (86.3% age grade) suggests he's getting back to his usual fast self.

http://www.johnsrunwalkshop.com/2014_results/2014_lionsrunforsight5K_results.pdf

BTW: I know this course, it's honest, and not an easy one with a couple of decent climbs. It's on the roads at Masterson Station Park where the USATF Club Cross was held.

And did anyone read the profile on Tom McCormack in Running Times?

http://www.runnersworld.com/masters-profiles/tom-mccormack-is-swift-at-60

Talk about hammering out the miles! Sheesh!

lucKY2b wrote:

http://www.runnersworld.com/masters-profiles/tom-mccormack-is-swift-at-60

Talk about hammering out the miles! Sheesh!

Whatever works, right? But you got to wonder what times he could run with easier easy days, and harder hard days? And maybe a long run? His race times aren't much faster than his training times.

Not to say his times aren't noteworthy!!! But could there be more with 'smarter training' and recovery between workouts?

Dave

racerdb wrote:

lucKY2b wrote:http://www.runnersworld.com/masters-profiles/tom-mccormack-is-swift-at-60

Talk about hammering out the miles! Sheesh!

Whatever works, right? But you got to wonder what times he could run with easier easy days, and harder hard days? And maybe a long run? His race times aren't much faster than his training times.

Not to say his times aren't noteworthy!!! But could there be more with 'smarter training' and recovery between workouts?

Dave

former sub 4 man from the days that sub 4 was actually impressive. i am 40 pounds over my racing weight, and just turned 50 last month. my wife (who is still fit and an avid runner) bet me a dinner for her...and a well, uh, you know what for me were i able to break 60 sec at our state age group champs. my son will be running there anyway. i need a bit of help regarding suggestions on how to go about doing this. that's basically 8 weeks away...any ideas on how to even start?

old and chunky wrote:

former sub 4 man from the days that sub 4 was actually impressive. i am 40 pounds over my racing weight, and just turned 50 last month. my wife (who is still fit and an avid runner) bet me a dinner for her...and a well, uh, you know what for me were i able to break 60 sec at our state age group champs. my son will be running there anyway. i need a bit of help regarding suggestions on how to go about doing this. that's basically 8 weeks away...any ideas on how to even start?

Your past suggests you know how to train.

You came to the right place. Lots of support advice interest in what you are trying to do.

MGI your wife is trying to get you to change your lifestyle so take her advice.

So what would I do assuming 40 lbs over race weight and assuming some but not much fitness:

Schedule a stress test ASAP call this a disclaimer but in fact this was what I did when I started competitive masters running.

Plan A

I would get a one year and two month extension.

Make a nice plan to safely get fit and thin.

Plan B

LIFT.

Weeks 1,2,3 and 4

If it were a do or die kinda deal HILLS HILLS and more HILLS along with lots of walking 5 to 10 per day divided before and after hills on the hill days. Try and lose some weight maybe go caveman diet for some quick weight loss.

Your legs should be stronger after 12 hill sessions so now we can go to the track.

Weeks 5 and 6

swap out 2 of the 3 hill workout days for the track.

-Accelerations with slow walk recovery.

or

-Comfortable mixing speed instead of accelerations. Sprint fartlek where the speed and duration are determined by feel.

As part of either workout do time some flying start stuff 100/200/300/400 but NOT all out.

Keep walking for fitness , recovery and weight loss.

Week 7

Controlled time trial not all out but close enough to see if you are in the ball park.

With your talent and background you just might make it.