Modifying the Norwegian approach to lower mileage

Sirpoc is more talented than maybe we realize. His elite cycling background shouldn’t be easily dismissed. He’s running 15:xx for 5K at age 40 but maybe his talent would have had him running 14:10 for 5K at age 24. It might not be the training he’s done but rather his newfound consistency. It’s very easy to go overboard with Daniels. Remember Smoove from these boards? Guy in his early 40s. Ran 15s for 5K using Daniels. Pretty good college runner too. Would love to hear his thoughts on this.

It's a great workout, but using only 100m float rest you can't do them at 5 k pace. If going 5 k pace you need about 60-90 sec easy walk between or a 200m jog. The resttime between the reps is as important as the effort at the reps.

Delicious cope. No wonder you messed it up the first time around. Guy sees someone that is literally faster than him and still thinks to himself "but I'm more talented".

The progress isn't disappointing for the example posted, clear progression he didn't realise until after he posted.

I know what you mean by being comfortable. I read and followed the thread from day 1. Seemed too good to be true for me. But after 9 months following it very religiously and seeing what sirpoc does and why, I am in the camp of being surprised that this really, really works. Obviously you could top it up with some race specific stuff. I don't bother as I'm way faster than i was before. So I'm not going to risk rocking the boat. Not saying it will work for everyone, there isn't a one sized fits all in aerobic sports, but if you follow it as tightly as you can for a significant amount of time, I would be more surprised if people didn't get better than did.

JS, mods don't respect you and keep deleting your threads. I know you read this thread with interest, please join the Strava group as these guys are so clueless they need you.

I'm pulling for you! My fitness is similar to yours but am using these plans for a marathon build and adapting them to longer reps. Keep us updated.

Sirpoc is a beast, but would cycling in off-months also help (i.e. prior to going to running base phase)? I.e. run a marathon in the fall, take 3-4 weeks off but cycle/walk/rest, then start up in December/January with just EZ running and then slowly incorporate the STs?

No. Four (4) weeks of cycling after a marathon? And then slowly incorporating the STs? Sounds like a good way to not really train for most the year. Take 3 days off after the marathon and never stop doing sub threshold.

Fat Jan won't go on Strava, there is nobody to con there and promise the world to. Well maybe Jecht, I feel like he is one of the classic targets of a scammer like fat Jan. But he won't go on the Strava group as he cannot hide behind all his accounts and anonymous lies, he would be too exposed. So you will not see fat Jan on there. Letsrun is his level where he can continue to scam and lie.

Oh agreed. I only meant that, from their perspective when they posted, it was disappointing. And I appreciated someone taking the time to give it a good-faith go and then come back to the thread to share their seemingly contradictory outcome.

I don't know much about running but even I see through JS.

Thanks for clarifying that, seriously. Was just throwing the cycling in there because it seemed like a lower-impact way of getting aerobic in post-Marathon. I was wrong.

Despite his modesty, Sirpoc is definitely in the 90th or perhaps even 95-99th percentile(for a male), talent wise. He's also built a big engine through cycling. If an average Joe or even a person with a modicum of talent does what he does and expects a similar gain/progression, they would be off for an unpleasant surprise. lol

I think a big part of the “no talent” conversation in running is that people don’t seem to get that there are different “talents” in running. Usually people only talk about talent in terms of raw speed or what they can run off little/no training. “Oh I can’t even break 60 for a 400, I’ve got no talent.” Or “he ran sub16 a month after taking up the sport, he’s so talented.”

Being durable enough to train at a high level consistently is also a huge (and arguably more important) talent. My old neighbor was an 8:50 steepler in college, said he had zero talent he “just ran 100mpw for four years and never get hurt”

By all means take as much rest as needed after a marathon, but planning out four weeks of cycling is just too much. Pretty sure even the guys who run 100 milers don't take that much time off. You'll be fine a week after unless the marathon goes super bad. One week off + one week of easy running and back on track.

I still can’t get over how many people say they’ve tried the X factor and then drop it because it has only hurt them. I thought it would be essential. Clearly, it’s not. Just do some strides and hill sprints if you want low cost speed.

LRC is actually helpful sometimes! 1 week sounds reasonable. 3:19:59 or bust. Have a good day!

You do? And what do you see then? Why don't you jump on my Dancan train for some months and I will coach you for free to improvement you have never seen before.I never scam any runners like some stalkers of me want to make it look like. Besides I'm not fat and just a few kilos over my ideal weight. 🇸🇪🧙🏼‍♂️🇸🇪

Magic coaching

Your “as much rest as needed point” is great. Your criticism of “four weeks of cycling” is spot-on. But there are lots of runners who are not “back on track” with workouts in the third post-marathon week. And your reply is to a masters runner. Many available plans have a return to regular mileage (not peak) around the fourth week and have workouts introduced after a full 3-5 weeks out. Why would you encourage someone to compress that time?

Sure, some people can handle that just fine, but unless you know exactly who you’re talking to, consider going with the “less is more” approach.