Can anyone please explain me how I can calculate and track CTL ? I want to track my progression for all the upcoming summer ! Thanks !
I plan to leave Trainingpeaks this autumn, because it is not hard maths: 1 km running = 7 TSS (TSS ends up being CTL in the spreadsheet), 1 km = 7 TSS even applies for walking, if you run hard it is a little bit more, slow walks can be 4 but you get the idea, cycling 1 km = 2 TSS swimming = 2 TSS for 100 m, strength training not HIT or circle training but not lang pauses = 0.6 TSS a minute. So, you but the TSS in a spreadsheet, if you end up with 490 TSS for the week, it is 490/7 = 70 CTL.
It's not perfect but TSS is as close to a power metric for running as you can get. I tried using a Stryd pod and it kept falling off. I gave up and decided to just run by time and not worry as much about the theoretical power metric. Maybe some have it mastered better than me!
I plan to leave Trainingpeaks this autumn, because it is not hard maths: 1 km running = 7 TSS (TSS ends up being CTL in the spreadsheet), 1 km = 7 TSS even applies for walking, if you run hard it is a little bit more, slow walks can be 4 but you get the idea, cycling 1 km = 2 TSS swimming = 2 TSS for 100 m, strength training not HIT or circle training but not lang pauses = 0.6 TSS a minute. So, you but the TSS in a spreadsheet, if you end up with 490 TSS for the week, it is 490/7 = 70 CTL.
I'm a fan of DIY, especially when you have the data and interest. How is it you are coming to 7 TSS per km though?
TSS is a function of your time running, your speed, and your “FTP” (lactate threshold) speed. Why use an estimate like 7 TSS per kilometer when you could just calculate it with those values?
It's not perfect but TSS is as close to a power metric for running as you can get. I tried using a Stryd pod and it kept falling off. I gave up and decided to just run by time and not worry as much about the theoretical power metric. Maybe some have it mastered better than me!
How important is it to switch between 10x 3 min, 5 x 6 min, and 3x10 min throughout the week? Don’t you get the same load from each of those workouts? Assuming boredom isn’t an issue, wouldn’t you have the same results doing 10 x 3 min on Tue, Thur, and Sat?
Know point of a lot of sirpoc's training is about maxing CTL for hours trained and calcs based on biking but anyone do training w/o these metrics? Personally don't have Stryd pod, HR monitor, or anything other than watch with pace and like to keep things simple w/o lots of data. Maybe defeats purpose of training or makes tough to keep efforts/training load under control but would love to hear about implementing training without getting into weeds of metrics that would be new for me.
Know point of a lot of sirpoc's training is about maxing CTL for hours trained and calcs based on biking but anyone do training w/o these metrics? Personally don't have Stryd pod, HR monitor, or anything other than watch with pace and like to keep things simple w/o lots of data. Maybe defeats purpose of training or makes tough to keep efforts/training load under control but would love to hear about implementing training without getting into weeds of metrics that would be new for me.
MoVB
The point of this training is consistency and the most time at the highest intensity you can sustain long-term. Gotta track that workload somehow.
You can run the same route(s) weekly and you only need to adjust the daily pace based on whether you're doing easy or subthreshold that day. I wouldn't even try to get super close to threshold at first and just run all the sub-t days at 40-60 minutes straight low sub-t (no rests) and see how you manage. Increase intensity as you get a feel for things.
Know point of a lot of sirpoc's training is about maxing CTL for hours trained and calcs based on biking but anyone do training w/o these metrics? Personally don't have Stryd pod, HR monitor, or anything other than watch with pace and like to keep things simple w/o lots of data. Maybe defeats purpose of training or makes tough to keep efforts/training load under control but would love to hear about implementing training without getting into weeds of metrics that would be new for me.
MoVB
There’s a spreadsheet in the strava group that ties everything to pace targets based on a recent race/time trial result.
I’ve used that as my guide. Zero lactate strips, zero HR readings, zero stryd. Just set the spreadsheet's paces on my watch and run in circles around a semi-flat loop. Boring by design, but effective
They are not the same load if you do them at different paces. The 3 min reps are done faster than the 10 min reps so have a different load. This is magnified by the ^ 3.5 in the equation.
They are not the same load if you do them at different paces. The 3 min reps are done faster than the 10 min reps so have a different load. This is magnified by the ^ 3.5 in the equation.
Please explain that to the mathematically challenged.
There’s a spreadsheet in the strava group that ties everything to pace targets based on a recent race/time trial result.
I’ve used that as my guide. Zero lactate strips, zero HR readings, zero stryd. Just set the spreadsheet's paces on my watch and run in circles around a semi-flat loop. Boring by design, but effective
Appreciate it! Requested to join group and will be interested to see about implementing. Currently just getting back into regular running after break and planning to start incorporating threshold workouts next month, hopefully build up to two a week plus hills by summer end and hold training through fall/winter.
They are not the same load if you do them at different paces. The 3 min reps are done faster than the 10 min reps so have a different load. This is magnified by the ^ 3.5 in the equation.
I thought that they were the same load. The faster pace is offset by the shorter duration of the reps.
They are not the same load if you do them at different paces. The 3 min reps are done faster than the 10 min reps so have a different load. This is magnified by the ^ 3.5 in the equation.
I thought that they were the same load. The faster pace is offset by the shorter duration of the reps.
In principle that's close to it, but the exponent helps account for the difference in stress when running above your Critical Power.
100 RSS = Running at your Critical Power for 60:00. So you can visualize some differences based just on that. If you're running a 30:00 Steady Tempo versus a fartlek of 15 x 1:00 / 1:00 and average the same exact pace (in this example) there would be variability in your running stress from the work done at different training intensities.
I found it incredibly useful in my own training and wish I had it when I did much bigger volume and higher intensity instead of chasing pure mileage as a metric. Also tons of value to help guide managing intensity in a taper.
They are not the same load if you do them at different paces. The 3 min reps are done faster than the 10 min reps so have a different load. This is magnified by the ^ 3.5 in the equation.
I thought that they were the same load. The faster pace is offset by the shorter duration of the reps.
No. The load (TSS) is based on the duration AND the intensity. In the case of 10x3, 5x6 and 3x10, the durations are the same, but the intensities are different. The 10x3 would be run faster which would therefore be run at a higher percentage of Threshold. Thus, the 10x3 would earn a higher TSS. Also, the 3.5 exponent causes any percentage other than 100% to be adjusted to be further from 100%. For example if you ran at 99% of threshold, the 3.5 exponenet would adjust that percent to 96.5%. 101% would be adjusted to 103.5%. 90% would be adjusted to 69.2%.
The advantage to using some kind of data outside of pure pace is to verify, or at least semi-accurately guesstimate, where your LT2 is. Once you know that, you can jump into a 3 ST session workload immediately, no real need to build up to it like you would a real workout.
The disadvantage to using pace based off a race result is that bodies are different and there’s a chance you may hit LT2 before that pace (a number of people have reported that in the Strava group).
To me, the worst case scenario would be spending weeks/months building up to repeats that are too fast to be sustainable but not realizing it because you don’t have a sense for the RPE and you think this is supposed to feel harder than it is, then eventually realizing things aren’t working and having to spend even more time resting and/or dialing it back.
It can’t be stressed enough — overwork is easy to do if you don’t know what we’re doing, because we’re literally talking about a difference of seconds per KM per repeat, and it can really sneak up on you, even intra-workout.
If you must freestyle, then I would take some time to read the descriptions of RPE shared by people who have been doing this a while and confirmed their impressions with measurements. There’s a thread in the Strava group and a few comments in this one as well.
Total rest time is also different (10 x 1 min rest vs 3 x 1 min rest, eg). Not saying you are wrong regarding TSS (I have no clue), but too me it seems clear that pace does not equal intensity.
No. The load (TSS) is based on the duration AND the intensity. In the case of 10x3, 5x6 and 3x10, the durations are the same, but the intensities are different. The 10x3 would be run faster which would therefore be run at a higher percentage of Threshold. Thus, the 10x3 would earn a higher TSS. Also, the 3.5 exponent causes any percentage other than 100% to be adjusted to be further from 100%. For example if you ran at 99% of threshold, the 3.5 exponenet would adjust that percent to 96.5%. 101% would be adjusted to 103.5%. 90% would be adjusted to 69.2%.
If it’s true that the 10 x 3 earns a higher TSS, then why not just do 10 x 3 Tues/Thur/Sat?
