No further explanation necessary. Just read it again carefully, and pay closer attention to the greater than and less than signs.
It's not debatable. #1 right now is determined by who has the best current titles and the best current form.
Best current titles: Hocker
Best current form: Hocker
#1 right now: Hocker
? Your post clearly does not go through each event in depth and you clearly didn't address any of my points. The fact that you didn't further shows that Hocker has no clear claim to #1 status.
This talk about Cole Hocker being the #1 distance runner is off the back of his 2 mile victory.
However, my general feeling is that the 2 mile field was overrated, especially with the absence of Grant Fisher. He was never going to be seriously challenged in an 8:07 race the way it played out. I actually think the Wannamaker Mile was the harder and more talented race, with Myers, Nuguse, Kessler and Nico. So unless he is racing against those guys, hard to say he is the #1 distance guy.
Grant Fisher - scratched Josh Kerr - first race back after injury, no idea of fitness levels. Parker Wolfe - coming off 10K XC, hadn't put in the sessions. Ky Robinson - doesn't have a strong kick. George Beamish - rarely puts himself in contention to win. Ethan Strand - miler first and foremost. Drew Hunter - journey man. Graham Blanks - decent engine, no kick. Cooper Teare - journey man. Edwin Kurgat - has no speed. Jake Wightman - as we saw in the 2000m, doesn't have the legs for long races.
Top 4 in the mile field:
Myers - a teenager who had to pull out of World XC because of fainting and blackout issues Nuguse - didn't make the World Champs last year, appears to be on the decline (ran almost 2 seconds slower this year than he did last year) Kessler - didn't make the World Champs last year, ran with a calf injury, was literally limping off the track after the race Nico - not a miler, he's primarily a 5k-10k guy
The 2-mile had 4 World Championship gold medalists in the field. The mile had 0.
The 2-mile had the 3k Steeple world champ which nobody cares about really. The rest were either coming back from injury or have no pedigree over 2 miles (Wightman). The mile has always been the premiere event anyways and no race has a significant argument over the other.
? Your post clearly does not go through each event in depth and you clearly didn't address any of my points. The fact that you didn't further shows that Hocker has no clear claim to #1 status.
Alrighty, if it means that much to you, I'll respond to your post.
Compare Kiplimo's wins within the last year to Hocker's by level of competition.
World Championship > World XC Championship
Millrose > Chicago
US Championship > Barcelona Half-Marathon
Hokie Invitational < Buenos Aires Half-Marathon
Hocker's wins are more impressive overall, AND he has the current prestige of being Reigning Olympic Champion, the biggest title of them all, which Kiplimo has never held.
Hocker is #1 right now. Only a hater would maintain otherwise.
You’ll have to explain some of these.
Kiplimo has won I think 4 World XC titles? That is almost exactly as much as Bekele would have won had the event only been every 2-3 years. While he likely isn’t the GOAT, having effectively the same # of titles makes it an extremely impressive achievement, moreso than the 5000m WC. Context matters here.
While Millrose had a better field, the Chicago marathon was finished in a time that is far more impressive than 8:07, and since the Marathon is an Olympic distance, it matters even more. You can’t argue that it is better due to these facts.
The Hokie Invitational? I’m sorry what? Is that where Hocker ran a 4:52 2000m? He ran that against college kids and it was a training run. 58:29 is more impressive as a time in an off distance and he beat a better field than…Cooper Teare.
The fact that this is even debatable makes it even more obvious that Hocker is not the best distance runner in the world.
Kiplimo has won 3 World XC titles, not 4. As I already explained, this year's win is diminished because of the early January timing. Track guys aren't in their best racing shape in early January.
You cannot compare Kiplimo to BEKELE, who routinely won the long XC title the day after the short XC title.
Your comment on Kiplimo's Chicago Marathon time is irrelevant to the point I made about level of competition. I compared the races above on level of competition. Who you beat matters most when you evaluate the quality of a win. The Millrose field was stronger than Chicago, without question.
To recap, judging the level of competition:
World Championship in Tokyo where everyone is at their best > World XC Championship in early January when track guys are in their off season
Millrose > Chicago
US Championship > Barcelona Half-Marathon (this should not require explanation)
Hokie Invitational < Buenos Aires Half-Marathon (the only advantage Kiplimo has)
3 races in the last year with stronger competition for Hocker. Only 1 for Kiplimo.
AND Hocker has the crown of Reigning Olympic Champion, which trumps anything Kiplimo has ever done.
Kiplimo has won I think 4 World XC titles? That is almost exactly as much as Bekele would have won had the event only been every 2-3 years. While he likely isn’t the GOAT, having effectively the same # of titles makes it an extremely impressive achievement, moreso than the 5000m WC. Context matters here.
While Millrose had a better field, the Chicago marathon was finished in a time that is far more impressive than 8:07, and since the Marathon is an Olympic distance, it matters even more. You can’t argue that it is better due to these facts.
The Hokie Invitational? I’m sorry what? Is that where Hocker ran a 4:52 2000m? He ran that against college kids and it was a training run. 58:29 is more impressive as a time in an off distance and he beat a better field than…Cooper Teare.
The fact that this is even debatable makes it even more obvious that Hocker is not the best distance runner in the world.
Kiplimo has won 3 World XC titles, not 4. As I already explained, this year's win is diminished because of the early January timing. Track guys aren't in their best racing shape in early January.
You cannot compare Kiplimo to BEKELE, who routinely won the long XC title the day after the short XC title.
Your comment on Kiplimo's Chicago Marathon time is irrelevant to the point I made about level of competition. I compared the races above on level of competition. Who you beat matters most when you evaluate the quality of a win. The Millrose field was stronger than Chicago, without question.
To recap, judging the level of competition:
World Championship in Tokyo where everyone is at their best > World XC Championship in early January when track guys are in their off season
Millrose > Chicago
US Championship > Barcelona Half-Marathon (this should not require explanation)
Hokie Invitational < Buenos Aires Half-Marathon (the only advantage Kiplimo has)
3 races in the last year with stronger competition for Hocker. Only 1 for Kiplimo.
AND Hocker has the crown of Reigning Olympic Champion, which trumps anything Kiplimo has ever done.
Hocker is #1.
DuPlantis makes a mockery of the claim that Hocker is number one at anything.
DuPlantis makes a mockery of the claim that Hocker is number one at anything.
Your comment is dumb. We're talking about distance running.
That is the point. DuPlantis shows the weakness of the claim that a runner you say is number one in his sport loses more than he wins and has no world records. A pretty low bar you set there for "number one". DuPlantis would clear it on one leg.
Your comment is dumb. We're talking about distance running.
That is the point. DuPlantis shows the weakness of the claim that a runner you say is number one in his sport loses more than he wins and has no world records. A pretty low bar you set there for "number one". DuPlantis would clear it on one leg.
Your point is stupid because Mondo isn't a distance runner. Unless you think he can beat Hocker in a distance race, Mondo is completely irrelevant to this thread.
The 2-mile had the 3k Steeple world champ which nobody cares about really. The rest were either coming back from injury or have no pedigree over 2 miles (Wightman). The mile has always been the premiere event anyways and no race has a significant argument over the other.
This.
The two-mile was "stacked" with washed names.
Kerr is clearly not back from injury. Putting on a brave face and making appearances.
Wightman ran a slow college time, half a lap behind the race.
The Mile had the 3-time champion, and also the guy who just broke the 2000m WR running faster than Hocker could.
Big DUCK by Hocker to run an 8:07 two-mile when there was a competitive 3:47 mile in the same meet.
Kiplimo has won I think 4 World XC titles? That is almost exactly as much as Bekele would have won had the event only been every 2-3 years. While he likely isn’t the GOAT, having effectively the same # of titles makes it an extremely impressive achievement, moreso than the 5000m WC. Context matters here.
While Millrose had a better field, the Chicago marathon was finished in a time that is far more impressive than 8:07, and since the Marathon is an Olympic distance, it matters even more. You can’t argue that it is better due to these facts.
The Hokie Invitational? I’m sorry what? Is that where Hocker ran a 4:52 2000m? He ran that against college kids and it was a training run. 58:29 is more impressive as a time in an off distance and he beat a better field than…Cooper Teare.
The fact that this is even debatable makes it even more obvious that Hocker is not the best distance runner in the world.
Kiplimo has won 3 World XC titles, not 4. As I already explained, this year's win is diminished because of the early January timing. Track guys aren't in their best racing shape in early January.
You cannot compare Kiplimo to BEKELE, who routinely won the long XC title the day after the short XC title.
Your comment on Kiplimo's Chicago Marathon time is irrelevant to the point I made about level of competition. I compared the races above on level of competition. Who you beat matters most when you evaluate the quality of a win. The Millrose field was stronger than Chicago, without question.
To recap, judging the level of competition:
World Championship in Tokyo where everyone is at their best > World XC Championship in early January when track guys are in their off season
Millrose > Chicago
US Championship > Barcelona Half-Marathon (this should not require explanation)
Hokie Invitational < Buenos Aires Half-Marathon (the only advantage Kiplimo has)
3 races in the last year with stronger competition for Hocker. Only 1 for Kiplimo.
AND Hocker has the crown of Reigning Olympic Champion, which trumps anything Kiplimo has ever done.
Hocker is #1.
Level of competition is not the #1 determinant, as I showed. If it was, then no WR race would matter. Times also matter and Kiplimo was far better in that aspect. Trying to argue one was better than the other is futile. Also, your point on World XC being held in January has no bearing on Kiplimo’s race. Which track athlete, were it held in March, would challenge Kiplimo? He is simply the greatest XC runner since Bekele and almost as good as him factoring in how many championships there have been the last 7 years.
That is the point. DuPlantis shows the weakness of the claim that a runner you say is number one in his sport loses more than he wins and has no world records. A pretty low bar you set there for "number one". DuPlantis would clear it on one leg.
Your point is stupid because Mondo isn't a distance runner. Unless you think he can beat Hocker in a distance race, Mondo is completely irrelevant to this thread.
Here's what's relevant:
Kiplimo hasn't had a road race finish lower than second IN HIS LIFE.
Kiplimo ran 56:42 in 2025.
Kiplimo just won the biggest fall marathon in 2025.
Kiplimo then turned around and beat the winner of WC 10,000 in a 10k XC race, winning world XC.
Hocker... entered a concierge paced two-mile against has-been and never-was runners, and was too weak to go with his own personally selected pace. He hasn't run an impressive time since his 7:23 in Jan 2025... six seconds of the WR while Kiplimo is a WR breaker.
this year's win is diminished because of the early January timing. Track guys aren't in their best racing shape in early January.
Wow.
True idiocy here.
You say "track guys aren't in their best racing shape in early January"... exactly what shape do you think a marathoner is in, 3 months after one marathon and three months before another?
The fact that A MARATHONER was able to torch them all, three months out from a marathon, shows who's boss.
Kiplimo came down in distance, to a quarter of his specialty distance, and he beat the "World 10,000m Champion" in a 10k race. Easilly.
Because many World Championship wins are... jokes.
Gressier taking WC gold in 28:55 is an embarrassment. "Titles" LOLOLOL. If that were meaningful, the title-holder wouldn't get exposed when he raced the big boys.
The track 5,000 and 10,000 has become a "special" Olympics for runners too slow for the 1500, and too weak for true distance racing where the big dogs all go: the road marathon. Gressier, Young, Fisher, none of these people will ever run a 2:02 marathon.
And Hocker will never win a 1500 title again. He ran 3:27 once, having never broken 3:30.5 (suspicious much?), which is still his only lifetime sub-3:29.5. Too slow for the 1500, too weak for the roads, he should enjoy his niche hiding in the track 5,000 and also try the 10,000, which doesn't really interest most African runners and their agents.
Also, your point on World XC being held in January has no bearing on Kiplimo’s race. Which track athlete, were it held in March, would challenge Kiplimo?
Nobody, of course!
It is hilarious to suggest that if only World XC were in the summer, the "track guys" like 5/10 track "World Champions" Cole Hocker and Jimmy Gressier could take down Kiplimo.
😂😂😂😂😂
He literally beat "World Champion" Gressier by 1 minute and 18 seconds. 'But but but it was January, Gressier just wasn't race-sharp...' 🤡
"World Champion" Hocker would have been further back still, or another of his DNFs.
The 2-mile had 4 World Championship gold medalists in the field. The mile had 0.
The two-mile was won in 8:07. The mile was won in 3:47. 😂
Let's look at the three world champs Hocker raced:
- Kerr (WC 1500 three years ago) - clearly still dealing with injury. Withdrawing from races, talking about WRs, running nothing fast.
- Beamish (WC steeple) - With lifetime PBs of 3:34, 7:34 and 8:05, this is the guy who literally proves the steeple is for runners too slow for the real races. This unimpressive 8:07 race was actually fast for him.
(Pop quiz: How far back do you need to go to find a steeple win slower than Beamish's 8:33.8? THERE WASN'T ONE, EVER. NOT ONCE SINCE THE EVENT WAS ADDED TO THE WC IN 1983 HAS SOMEONE "WON" A WC SO SLOWLY. And the last Olympic win slower than that was 8:34.3 in 1960, which Beamish barely beat.)
- Wightman (WC four years ago) - Hasn't broken 3:31 in four years. 7:44 3000m in 2025, pretty slow but better than the 8:20 DFL against Hocker. You can't point to him as "strong competition" when he's irrelevant to the race half a lap back lol.
INJURED, SLOW, WASHED.
THE IDEA THAT THESE BEATING GUYS IS MORE IMPRESSIVE THAN A INDOOR MILE WITH FOUR GUYS GOING 3:47-3:48.😂
Also, your point on World XC being held in January has no bearing on Kiplimo’s race. Which track athlete, were it held in March, would challenge Kiplimo?
Nobody, of course!
It is hilarious to suggest that if only World XC were in the summer, the "track guys" like 5/10 track "World Champions" Cole Hocker and Jimmy Gressier could take down Kiplimo.
😂😂😂😂😂
He literally beat "World Champion" Gressier by 1 minute and 18 seconds. 'But but but it was January, Gressier just wasn't race-sharp...' 🤡
"World Champion" Hocker would have been further back still, or another of his DNFs.
He won the world championship 5k. Why are you putting world champion in quotations?
He won the world championship 5k. Why are you putting world champion in quotations?
If someone is going to laughably diminish Kiplimo's devastating third World Championship in XC...
Let's talk about the fact that 2025 track WC wins included a 28:55 10,000 and an 8:33 steeple (both the slowest in the history of the WC, which goes back to 1983). Not to mention a 5000m winner with a 12:57 PB
Look. If someone wants to rank WC titles, they can do that.
But when "champions" come from the track to XC get destroyed by road runners like Kiplimo, it's ridiculous to assert that the dominant road runners are "ducking" the track.
He won the world championship 5k. Why are you putting world champion in quotations?
If someone is going to laughably diminish Kiplimo's devastating third World Championship in XC...
Let's talk about the fact that 2025 track WC wins included a 28:55 10,000 and an 8:33 steeple (both the slowest in the history of the WC, which goes back to 1983). Not to mention a 5000m winner with a 12:57 PB
Look. If someone wants to rank WC titles, they can do that.
But when "champions" come from the track to XC get destroyed by road runners like Kiplimo, it's ridiculous to assert that the dominant road runners are "ducking" the track.
Hope that helps you to understand! 🧠
I agree that Kiplimo could be very competitive on the track and is not at all ducking people. The thing is, you could’ve just said that without trying to diminish the people who won the world championship races by putting the word champions in quotations. A champion is someone who wins a championship; it’s pretty clear-cut. There’s nothing in the definition that says the championship needs to be contested a particular way for the winner to be legitimate. Sorry if you don’t like the way they won. But you need to admit they’re the champs and stop making a complete fool of yourself.
I agree that Kiplimo could be very competitive on the track and is not at all ducking people. The thing is, you could’ve just said that without trying to diminish the people who won the world championship races by putting the word champions in quotations. A champion is someone who wins a championship; it’s pretty clear-cut. There’s nothing in the definition that says the championship needs to be contested a particular way for the winner to be legitimate. Sorry if you don’t like the way they won. But you need to admit they’re the champs and stop making a complete fool of yourself.
Sure, people sometimes fail to detect sarcasm, satire and irony online.
But they are great fun.
And 13 pages into a discussion with a bad-faith poster who argues 'the World XC Championships don't matter if they were in January and if Grant Fisher didn't run them and if the sun was shining' ... I am quite comfortable with ridiculing that idea and making comparisons to what one could say about certain track WCs.