J.R. wrote:
Collin wrote:92 puts him among the most aerobically talented individuals of all time, far more talented than Hall, Ritz, or any of our other marathoners.
VO2 is a measure of O2 consumption, not performance.
That's why I said that he's more talented, not that he's run faster.
There's not one shred of evidence that kilian can run a single five minute mile. Once he legitimately breaks that barrier, then we can start talking about him stringing together 26 4:50s.
Collin wrote:
For those of you that think he can't run 5:00 miles very easily, you are unfathomably wrong. Before WS100, part of Kilian's TAPER (a few days before the race) was a hilly 20 miler on roads in San Fran at sub-6 pace. If he had focused his career on the marathon, he would be capable of being the best white guy out there, and I stand by that. Nobody else right is running under, what, 2:08 right now? 92 puts him among the most aerobically talented individuals of all time, far more talented than Hall, Ritz, or any of our other marathoners.
You lose all credibility when you post this crap. Carpenter, reportedly, had a 90+. Many XC skiers have high max VO2s, but it doesn't necessarily translate to running 26.2 miles at sub 5 pace. As I said before, I highly doubt Kilian thinks he could run that fast even if he wanted to focus on the marathon.
george oscar bluth wrote:
And we stand by saying you are an idiot for thinking as much.
Do you realize that 4:10 is not an impressive time for a talented athlete? When I was running in HS, we had a pretty talented soccer player join our team and run a 4:20 on 2 weeks of training and no speed work. Kilian is a once-in-a-generation talent with a ridiculous level of fitness. I can't run a 4:10 because I'm a sucky athlete. You can't run a 4:10 because you're also a sucky athlete. Kilian can because he's possibly the most naturally talented endurance athlete currently competed.
yuiop wrote:
Collin wrote:For those of you that think he can't run 5:00 miles very easily, you are unfathomably wrong. Before WS100, part of Kilian's TAPER (a few days before the race) was a hilly 20 miler on roads in San Fran at sub-6 pace. If he had focused his career on the marathon, he would be capable of being the best white guy out there, and I stand by that. Nobody else right is running under, what, 2:08 right now? 92 puts him among the most aerobically talented individuals of all time, far more talented than Hall, Ritz, or any of our other marathoners.
You lose all credibility when you post this crap. Carpenter, reportedly, had a 90+. Many XC skiers have high max VO2s, but it doesn't necessarily translate to running 26.2 miles at sub 5 pace. As I said before, I highly doubt Kilian thinks he could run that fast even if he wanted to focus on the marathon.
XC skiers are indeed better athletes than runners but it doesn't necessarily have anything to do with VO2 Max.
Collin wrote:
george oscar bluth wrote:And we stand by saying you are an idiot for thinking as much.
Do you realize that 4:10 is not an impressive time for a talented athlete? When I was running in HS, we had a pretty talented soccer player join our team and run a 4:20 on 2 weeks of training and no speed work. Kilian is a once-in-a-generation talent with a ridiculous level of fitness. I can't run a 4:10 because I'm a sucky athlete. You can't run a 4:10 because you're also a sucky athlete. Kilian can because he's possibly the most naturally talented endurance athlete currently competed.
The thing is, and this is the real truth, kilian can't run a 5:10 mile let alone a 4:10 mile. I'm sorry if that gets you all fanboy butt hurt, but that is a fact.
Collin wrote:
george oscar bluth wrote:And we stand by saying you are an idiot for thinking as much.
Do you realize that 4:10 is not an impressive time for a talented athlete? When I was running in HS, we had a pretty talented soccer player join our team and run a 4:20 on 2 weeks of training and no speed work. Kilian is a once-in-a-generation talent with a ridiculous level of fitness. I can't run a 4:10 because I'm a sucky athlete. You can't run a 4:10 because you're also a sucky athlete. Kilian can because he's possibly the most naturally talented endurance athlete currently competed.
You are blowing monkeys out of your butt on that one. Let's see evidence of your 4:10, and let Jornet try one as well.
This is an incredibly stupid "debate". Comparisons across disciplines are impossible. In trying, we're diminishing both athletes. Of course, diminishing Kilian seems to be the goal of many here. He's the best in the world at what he does. "What he does" may well occupy a very small niche within the endurance world, but that's clearly fine with him. Why it's not fine with anyone else, I have no idea.
J.R. wrote:
Collin wrote:92 puts him among the most aerobically talented individuals of all time, far more talented than Hall, Ritz, or any of our other marathoners.
VO2 is a measure of O2 consumption, not performance.
It's a measure of 02 consumption while performing.
Cultural wars wrote:
Collin wrote:Do you realize that 4:10 is not an impressive time for a talented athlete? When I was running in HS, we had a pretty talented soccer player join our team and run a 4:20 on 2 weeks of training and no speed work. Kilian is a once-in-a-generation talent with a ridiculous level of fitness. I can't run a 4:10 because I'm a sucky athlete. You can't run a 4:10 because you're also a sucky athlete. Kilian can because he's possibly the most naturally talented endurance athlete currently competed.
You are blowing monkeys out of your butt on that one. Let's see evidence of your 4:10, and let Jornet try one as well.
Are you not capable of reading?
No record in ultra running is impressive simply for the fact that there are not a lot of people doing it. It is self destructive and a lifestyle for OCD types that never had the fast twitch muscles to be good at any reasonable distance. They just kept training for longer distances so that there would be fewer competitors so that there might be a chance that they might be considered good at something. There is really no way to be good at ultra running and maintain a healthy balance in ones life.
Many ultra runners don't accumulate any more mileage than a typical 10km-Marathon runner.
Certainly less time than a triathlete.
Why the heck would anyone need a 92 VO2 to walk 15 minute miles?
joedirt wrote:
There is really no way to be good at ultra running and maintain a healthy balance in ones life.
In all fairness, this is true for all distances.
Captain Oblivious wrote:
J.R. wrote:VO2 is a measure of O2 consumption, not performance.
It's a measure of 02 consumption while performing.
It is not a measure of how well one's performing.
Collin wrote:
J.R. wrote:VO2 is a measure of O2 consumption, not performance.
That's why I said that he's more talented, not that he's run faster.
VO2 is not a measure of talent.
J.R. wrote:
Collin wrote:That's why I said that he's more talented, not that he's run faster.
VO2 is not a measure of talent.
It's almost certainly the best physiological measure of maximum capacity for aerobic racing.
Collin wrote:
It's almost certainly the best physiological measure of maximum capacity for aerobic racing.
It's a good measure of inefficiency, and useful for using ambiguous terms that don't have any relevance to performance.
spade detector wrote:
do you climb? wrote:Ok. Fine. You can't be badass by running fast for long distances on a flat circle. Sorry. Look at the stuff Kilian's done on youtube. Kilian's doing a very good job at what he does. Height alone doesn't make something challenging. People have done that already. He's doing things in a new way. Look at him going up and down Matterhorn and Mont Blanc. Look at what he does on his skis.
Lol right. Kouros and Messner are definitely both more badass. Kilian is a tweener.
If ole boy is too good for running on tracks and roads, then he should at least have the balls to go full bore and do something really challenging. At the moment he's just hovering at half jogger, half alpinist.
Look, there is a reason why Jornet is getting attention. It's because he does what he does well. Kilian Jornet is a world champion ski mountaineer. You could say he's pushing the limits of ski mountaineering. Bringing fast ski mountaineering/running to the highest mountains. If he only stayed with ski mountaineering, who would know about him?
If he only focused on running like Kouros (how many know about him?) or only focused on climbing 8000m peaks like Messner (do you know off hand the names of other guys who completed all the peaks) he wouldn't be talked about.
Messner. If you wanted to be more credible, you could have thrown out the name of a more relevant climber. Many people have climbed all 8000m peaks. Are they all household names? No. Messner just got there first and he deserves credit for that. There have been many climbers who are better than Messner. Even he used fixed ropes for some of the 8000m peaks. If Jornet wanted and if he was more suicidal/irresponsible (Jornet already lost a climbing partner. Messner lost toes and a brother), he could easily climb all 14 without bottled oxygen. He has the capability. Messner isn't the same athlete that Jornet is. Messner couldn't do what Jornet is doing.
What would climbing all 8000m peaks do for Jornet? Nothing. Who knows the name of the other guy who climbed them without bottled oxygen? Basically nobody. It would take years (you can only climb max two or three a year), and tons of money basically and it would get him nothing.
Even guys who are basically the best at real technical mountain climbing fast and in good style like Ueli Steck (whose ambition is to climb hard technical routes fast) don't get as much attention as Jornet is getting. Ueli Steck has said can you imagine what I would do if I had the physique of Kilian.
J.R. wrote:
Collin wrote:It's almost certainly the best physiological measure of maximum capacity for aerobic racing.
It's a good measure of inefficiency, and useful for using ambiguous terms that don't have any relevance to performance.
Translation: Usually someone in the medical field administers the test so it must be wrong and possibly even life threatening.