Brah brah stop asking silly hypotheticals that will never happen.
Brah brah stop asking silly hypotheticals that will never happen.
Interesting product idea would be a mask with a tank of O2 the size of an aerosol can you put on to run the last mile of 5k
Hounddogharrier wrote:
At sea level the atmosphere has 20.9 % oxygen. At 10,000 feet the atmosphere is only 13% and times slow considerably. I wonder how fast the 5k could be run by an elite athlete breathing 100% oxygen. Perhaps a streamlined oxygen tank or oxygen through a hose from a bike with a tank staying next to the runner?
You must also think the oxygen tanks on the sidelines of NFL games do something meaningful to someone who has no underlying health conditions.
They'd be dead in a minute. Pure oxygen is poisonous.
Well the nfl seems to think they’re working
the profit wrote:
Runningart2004 wrote:
Here's a start:
https://www.businesswire.com/news/home/20180423006304/en/Luxfer-ECLIPSE™-World’s-Lightest-weight-SCBA-Cylinder-FirefighterWith the standard 4500 psi you're getting 30-45 min of air time......and that's just walking around and doing some work in a Level A or Level B.
Alan
Alan , how much do those packs weigh?
Those specific bottles? No clue. The typical aluminum bottle is roughly 20lbs. The typical composite is under 10lbs. Then you have the harness, regulator, face piece, etc.
So let's say 20-30bs for an aluminum setup or 10-20lbs for a composite.
But, thats for 4500 psi which you'll be using WHILE RUNNING and the mask will likely break seal and I give ya about 10min tops before you are out of air running at competitive speeds.
Wait!! Maybe you can do a hot bottle swap mid race?!?
We did some light jogging/airborne shuffle in SCBA once....lasted maybe 15-20min before the alarms went off.
Alan
If running at elevation is more difficult b/c of the air pressure gradient/blood diffusion/muscle uptake and not the O2 levels in the air then I'll admit I learned something new today. But then A, why does the NFL use O2 tanks? B, why do they sell cans of breathable oxygen at ski resorts?And C, I found this online: At high elevation, the reduction in oxygen causes the capillaries in the body to dilate and leak fluid until acclimatized. In short, this causes a laundry list of possible symptoms: shortness of breath, headaches, dizziness, lethargy, decreased appetite, nausea, fever and sleeplessness
electron1661 wrote:
If running at elevation is more difficult b/c of the air pressure gradient/blood diffusion/muscle uptake and not the O2 levels in the air then I'll admit I learned something new today. But then A, why does the NFL use O2 tanks? B, why do they sell cans of breathable oxygen at ski resorts?And C, I found this online: At high elevation, the reduction in oxygen causes the capillaries in the body to dilate and leak fluid until acclimatized. In short, this causes a laundry list of possible symptoms: shortness of breath, headaches, dizziness, lethargy, decreased appetite, nausea, fever and sleeplessness
The same proportion of inspired air (~21%) is oxygen at both sea level and altitude. However, the partial pressure of oxygen is lower due to the lower total partial pressure. At sea level, air pressure is 760mmHg and thus partial pressure of oxygen is 0.21*760 or about 160mmHg. As air pressure falls at altitude, this drops. However, by breathing in oxygen, we are increasing the partial pressure of oxygen not by increasing air pressure but by increasing the proportion of air inspired that is oxygen. For example, breathing 50% oxygen at sea level, the partial pressure of oxygen is 0.50*760 or 380mmHg.
As far as capillary dilatation, I am not too familiar with high altitude physiology beyond respiratory physiology. I can say that yes high altitude causes problems such as HAPE and HACE that as far as I know are not well-understood but are caused by fluid leakage in the brain and lungs.
Hounddogharrier wrote:
At sea level the atmosphere has 20.9 % oxygen. At 10,000 feet the atmosphere is only 13% and times slow considerably. I wonder how fast the 5k could be run by an elite athlete breathing 100% oxygen. Perhaps a streamlined oxygen tank or oxygen through a hose from a bike with a tank staying next to the runner?
Oxygen content at 10000 feet is the same as at sea level; the atmospheric pressure however is lower which impairs oxygenation. I am surprised by the results of the study cited below because in a normal person increasing FiO2 (proportion of inspired air that is oxygen) will only slightly improve oxygenation. This is because hemoglobin saturates very quickly to 98+% in healthy people. Increasing oxygen will not saturate hemoglobin beyond 100% as this is impossible. Additional oxygen will dissolve in the blood and be delivered to tissues; however, hemoglobin's carrying capacity for oxygen is far higher than serum and the additional serum saturation will add only a small amount of extra oxygen.
O2 content is not the same. Air density at sea level is 1.225 kg/m3, while at 2000m it is 1.007 kg/m3.
Also, I thought that a huge limiting factor was blood ph. Rejection of CO2 into the atmosphere also requires a pressure gradient, thus it would depend on what happened to CO2 partial pressure as O2 partial pressure was elevated.
I know there’s mot much CO2 in air (0.0350 mole %), but would reducing it make any significant difference to blood ph?
Hounddogharrier wrote:
Well the nfl seems to think they’re working
Wait until you find out about how swinging a weighted bat before going to the plate actually decreases bat speeds.
Unfortunately, tradition is tradition a lot of the time.
Sprintgeezer wrote:
O2 content is not the same. Air density at sea level is 1.225 kg/m3, while at 2000m it is 1.007 kg/m3.
Also, I thought that a huge limiting factor was blood ph. Rejection of CO2 into the atmosphere also requires a pressure gradient, thus it would depend on what happened to CO2 partial pressure as O2 partial pressure was elevated.
I know there’s mot much CO2 in air (0.0350 mole %), but would reducing it make any significant difference to blood ph?
The proportion of the atmosphere that is O2 is constant at 20.9% at sea level or altitude. The lower air density at altitude that you mentioned is a function of or the cause of the lower atmospheric pressure at altitude that is in turn responsible for the lower partial pressure of oxygen at altitude. I strongly doubt that changing the CO2 content in air would have a significant effect on blood in any way because the partial pressure of CO2 in venous blood is about 40 mmHg. The partial pressure of CO2 in air is only about 0.3 mmHg as only about 0.04% of air is composed of CO2 (760*0.0004). Thus, changing the atmospheric CO2 would have minimal effect on blood CO2 unless it was changed by multiple orders of magnitude.
lk
It’s SIMPLE . Provide oxygen and wear an outfit around the chest and diaphragm that lowers atmospheric pressure .
michael furey wrote:
Sprintgeezer wrote:
O2 content is not the same. Air density at sea level is 1.225 kg/m3, while at 2000m it is 1.007 kg/m3.
Also, I thought that a huge limiting factor was blood ph. Rejection of CO2 into the atmosphere also requires a pressure gradient, thus it would depend on what happened to CO2 partial pressure as O2 partial pressure was elevated.
I know there’s mot much CO2 in air (0.0350 mole %), but would reducing it make any significant difference to blood ph?
The proportion of the atmosphere that is O2 is constant at 20.9% at sea level or altitude. The lower air density at altitude that you mentioned is a function of or the cause of the lower atmospheric pressure at altitude that is in turn responsible for the lower partial pressure of oxygen at altitude. I strongly doubt that changing the CO2 content in air would have a significant effect on blood in any way because the partial pressure of CO2 in venous blood is about 40 mmHg. The partial pressure of CO2 in air is only about 0.3 mmHg as only about 0.04% of air is composed of CO2 (760*0.0004). Thus, changing the atmospheric CO2 would have minimal effect on blood CO2 unless it was changed by multiple orders of magnitude.
Technically there are more molecules of oxygen at sea level because the air is more dense. It's still 20.9% but it's 20.9% of a larger number.
But it still doesn't matter with respect to the original question for reasons we already stated.
Oxygen delivery to the blood is almost 100% at barometric pressure, so increasing oxygen content in the air wouldn't improve performance that much. You need a faster way to deliver the oxygen to the tissues, not the oxygen to the blood.
sciencegirl wrote:
Oxygen delivery to the blood is almost 100% at barometric pressure, so increasing oxygen content in the air wouldn't improve performance that much...
Hemoglobin saturation is clearly lower than the rest value of 98-99 % during heavy exercise and closer to 90 % in many well-trained athletes, therefore breathing oxygen-rich air tends to enhance Vo2Max/performance.
Aragon wrote:
sciencegirl wrote:
Oxygen delivery to the blood is almost 100% at barometric pressure, so increasing oxygen content in the air wouldn't improve performance that much...
Hemoglobin saturation is clearly lower than the rest value of 98-99 % during heavy exercise and closer to 90 % in many well-trained athletes, therefore breathing oxygen-rich air tends to enhance Vo2Max/performance.
Fake news
Here some "fake news" to you:
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/2745310/
This has been well-known since the mid-1960 when Lorell B. Rowell researched the topic.
And it is true that the venous blood returning from the periphery has even relatively large oxygen content (15-20 %), which is explained mostly by not all blood flowing to the working muscles but having other functions in the body and never releasing the oxygen.