Road Racing and Training Thread - Week Ending 9/22/19

AJ - “Hog wild” AND “full progression”—I love it!

You WILL rock in Berlin, my friend.

F42, 5'6"

Goal races:

Des Moines half-marathon 10/20

Philadelphia Marathon 11/24

M: off as usual

Tu: 10 mi easy

W: 10 mi easy

Th: 1 mi E + 8 mi M + 1.5 mi E. Temperature was very perfect for the workout and my legs were not too dull from the 10ers the previous two days. I target 7:45 for M pace right now but after the first mile (which was 7:45) I was feeling pretty good. It was still dark out and I couldn't really just glance down to see my pace so I went more by how it felt than what my watch was saying and the remaining 7 miles in that block were all pretty much 7:40 or better. I was surprised by how good and comfortable 7:40 felt and during the last mile I even got down to 7:35 (though I would have tried to control it better had it not been the last).

F: 10 mi easy. Almost chilly at 48 degrees -- hands actually felt kind of cold. Lake was streaming fog and made it kind of clammy when I had to run through it.

Sa: 10.7 mi easy, but felt less easy than the other 10ers this week. Warmer and humid. Fog just starting to burn off as I got going. Don't want to complain, but after the last couple weeks, it felt unpleasant.

Su: 20 mi long run. Legs were feeling the 50 miles already in them and it got warmer and warmer during the run and a bit steamy too. After 10 miles, really started to go downhill. Last 5 were a grind. Please let this be the last hot and humid day this season!

Total miles this week: ~72. A Monday-Sunday mileage PR.

Going to step it down a little bit this week and also race a "quarter marathon" on Saturday.

Have good weeks, all! Thanks for the continuing encouragement in comments. 2 months to go!

33/dude/5-6/151

"Do you remember the 21st night of September? Love was changing the mind of pretenders while chasing the clouds away..." - Earth, Wind, and Fire

PRs: 2:59:15 (2018), 1:25:54 (2014), 39:54 (2018)

Goals: The Chicago Shakedown in 21 days - PR, have fun

Good week. Mileage PR.

M - 9.5 @ 8:08 w/5 * 25 second hill sprints AM, 4.5 @ 8:13 PM

T - 9.5 total - 3 * 1.5 mile with 400 between (about 2:45) + 800-400-400 - 9:29 - 9:28 - 9:21 (6:18 mile avg) - 2:50 - 84 - 87

W - 6 @ 8:58 AM, 6 @ 8:30 PM

T - 8 @ 8:18

F - 17.5 @ 7:20 overall with 5 up, 10 tempo, 2.5 down - 10 miles in 68:29 - 6:51 avg. 70 degrees and humid. Was thinking this would be a bit slower with me dripping, but it wasn't. With last week's 20 miler falling on Sunday, this run also gave me 89 in 7 days.

Sa - 7 @ 8:30

Su - 10:5 @ 702 - 2 * 2 miles with 3 minutes between, then 3*400, 2*200 - went 12:36 - 12:27 - 84 (had to avoid running into unattended small child on track) - 78 - 79 - 38 - 35. Intended to do 3*2 mile, but didn't get out the door until 9:30, it was 75 and humid and I bargained that I could just run fast after 2, so that's what I did.

78 miles in 10:11. Trumps my previous high of 73. Making progress!

Smoove wrote:

Just popping in - looks like some good weeks all around with the exception of an exploded ankle here or there.

Nothing much to report - foot is feeling pretty good. A little rickety at times, but no discomfort once I get started about my day.

Walked/ran a 2 mile loop from my house 4 days this week, with the run part being 1, 1, 1.4 and 2 miles as I progressed through the week.

Pretty happy with my ability to run 7 weeks after surgery for PF. Bursitis in my hip, which is what has been holding me back more than the foot, is finally subsiding.

Some encouraging progress, Smoove. We are all rooting for you.

slo - That Friday long run is a big boy workout. Strong work and strong week.

GT - Congrats on the calendar week mileage PR. Although it looks like RRR has his “for real” game face on and has upped you in mileage along with strong quality. Sounds like you already have an answer planned for next week…

RRR - Lots of volume in the traces of the southern swampy summer. Once you get the cooler autumn weather, I expect the quality paces to really pick up. RRR v. GT is a legitimate "Thrilla in Manilla" type matchup in the works. "Lookin' for Vindy in Indy."

Pappy - Really glad to see you getting the volume up. Don’t worry about the weight. Mine typically stays set for the first 5 to 6 weeks that I up the volume. Then one week, boom. Metabolism catches up and the pounds start shedding. You are making great progress.

JQ - Not much to add that hasn’t already been said. Keep doing what you are doing. Like...Exactly what you are doing. I know you put in a lot of time and work, but the manner in which you do it makes it look effortless. I know that it’s not. Your improvement is the result of all of the time you have dedicated to your craft with balanced, intelligent training.

Niceguy - Welcome back. Training is looking right where you want it to be right now.

rucker - Lots of well-rounded fitness in there.

Guy - Bummer on the ankle, but glad to hear it sounds like its getting better. Three weeks is plenty of time to get things right before the HM.

AJ - You have put in a valiant block of training. I’m really pulling for a big result for you in Berlin. Safe travels. You know what you gotta do on race day. Thanks for the well-wishes, the knee has been holding up beautifully. I’m hoping I can replicate, on a smaller scale, how successfully that you have quickly built yourself for your marathon.

Thoughtsleader - I hope you feel better from your cold. Some unsolicited advice? You may want to try more balance throughout the week than throwing so much into the weekly long run. In fact, I might advise against an aggressive taper in your case - you may benefit more by keeping volume closer to max mileage, with a cut back mostly in the weekly long run.

OR - Remain patient and let that hammy heal 100%. Your fitness is already high because of your consistent weekly volume. And we know from your HM in August that your race fitness is strong. We want to be physically ready to hit the last 4 to 6 weeks of this cycle hard before the taper.

Sub17 - Well done.

3283823 - Feel better, man.

Smoove - Glad to hear the continued progress. It will be amazing in the early spring when you are back to racing low/sub 16:00 5ks.

drcrusher - Really strong running from you. Remind me again, sub-3:20 is the goal? 70+ miles in singles in 6 days is no joke.

RGW - Damn, man. Seriously stepping up your game. Loving all these weekly mileage PRs this week.

Waiting on results from yesterday before posting my week...

SC - Nice quarters and tempo. I think OR would approve of that a a flyer. Paces don’t seem slow to me, but I guess I had trouble mentally referencing them in metric.

Slo - The k’s and the 4x2 look good, but that 15k E + 20k M is really strong.

GT - Maybe none of the sessions quite clicked, but the overall week looks good, especially the volume.

RRR - Heck of a lot of volume. What’s the most you’ve done before?

Pappy - Nice seeing you build back in the running. Weight will eventually fall off.

JQ - Great workout on Tuesday.

NG - Great M pace run. I don’t do a ton of that, but all the T pace work sure sets up running M pace.

Rucker - Love those single track trails, but can’t run them fast. Still pretty good mileage, plus extra volume cycling.

GB - Ouch! Sounds like you didn’t do anything too serious to it.

TL - Nice 21 miler.

AJ - It’ll be different without Rupp to chase, but go tear it up in Berlin.

OR - Hope the hammy is back to normal. Those super hilly 20s are great for building strong legs.

Sub17 - Congrats on hitting that goal!

3283823 - Tough break. At least the knee will make sure you’re fully recovered from the dengue.

Smoove - Nice progression. Looks like the recovery is coming along nicely.

drcrusher - Congrats on another mileage PR. Love those cool mornings where the legs feel good and the miles just fly by.

RGMW - Nice volume. Time to start tapering?

Sub 6 - downhill or not, that's a damn impressive double. Your mileage has been to observe. I'm going hard for another week - 65-70 miles with 2 workouts / a 20 miler then I'll start tapering. I suppose this upcoming week will still be an overall mileage reduction of 10-15%.

Running okay but then again nothing great. In other words got the work done this week, although parts weren't pretty.

M - 5.6 mile recovery

T - 8.8 miles with 2X5K tempo AM. Pace off 8-9 seconds a mile from 2018 and early this year on same/similar course. Has 180' gain going out (6:38) and same going back (6:24). I fell asleep or something on the 2nd to last mile. Otherwise, felt pretty good. 3.5 easy PM

W - 6.9 mile trail run (just over an hour), had a 600' climb

Th - 4.3 AM (allergies again), 5.8 PM, kind of hot in the city so drove up to 8000' for the run and got some good hill work, another 600 or so.

F - Meltdown, 2019. Mostly post workout. I slept in due to allergies and had to do the run over lunch (11 AM). My app said temp of 74, and would climb to 80. Well it was actually 81 when I started, going up to 84. I did the workout (reps of 2-4 minutes with about 1 min recovery, 20 minutes of faster running, again off pace 5-6 seconds/mile but with heat that's expected) and jogged back. I showered (fairly cool water) but couldn't stop sweating for 20 more minutes, then chilled, nauseous, and groggy for the rest of the day. I'm taking sick leave for that part because couldn't even function for 3 hours post-workout.

S - 7.1 tired. 3.1 later, felt ok.

S - 14, felt good, 7:48/mile, climbing 700 feet and back (gradual for 6, then the last mile gets steep)

67.5, plan 65-70 for next week.

Have a good week

The Stone Cutter wrote:

drcrusher - Really strong running from you. Remind me again, sub-3:20 is the goal? 70+ miles in singles in 6 days is no joke.

I don't know if I did say what my goal is. My lifetime PR is 3:22-high and I ran that in my first marathon at Philadelphia in 2004. I'm hoping that I can break that by whatever margin happens. (I'd be over the moon if I ended up sub-3:20.) I came close in a race in fall 2012, just 7 seconds slower than my PR and since then I've had only one day I'd call really good for me (3:24), every other race has been OK (most between 3:30 and 3:25) but I always felt like I left a couple/three minutes on the table as it was usually a little too warm or I had only an average training season, and a couple were downright too hot on the day (those were 3:30+ and I was wrecked). Hoping for the jackpot combo of training paying off and good weather this fall. I'll be 43 on race day and I fear that the time for PR'ing again may be getting short, so I'm really committing to having the best buildup that I can. This 70-mile week stuff is an experiment for me.

And...getting around to shout outs.

Stone - thanks for doing it in miles - I was one who was struggling with the math. Curious - why the walk recoveries for the 400s? That strikes me as more of a 800/1500 type of workout, but perhaps I'm mistaken (especially since I know very little about 800/1500 training). Eager to see what the big girl workouts are for Mrs. Stone.

Slo-twitch - massive, strong week. As for 15-16 miles at MP in training, I agree that it's a good indicator, and I also agree that for some athletes (including myself), doing that workout means leaving one's race in training.

Gordon Tremesko - 2Ks are hard...just something about that fifth lap

RRR - that is solid. Good to see.

Pappy - hope you kick the cold soon!

Jot Quill - you are a machine! I was in NYC and running on the West Side on Tuesday morning - I wondered if we'd do a Strava Fly-by, but apparently not.

Niceguy542007 - All of my tempo work is that way - on the edge. I work my way up to that edge (which differs depending on the day) and then hover just below it for the workout.

rucker - I think time on feet is worth a lot.

Guy Broman - I really hope the ankle clears quickly.

ThoughtsLeader - it sucks to be sick, but better now than during the race.

Angry Johnny - You look like a coiled spring, ready to fire in Berlin.

Outside Runner - I hope the hammy continues to improve.

Sub17Achieved - congratulations! That's awesome. I'm a big fan of the "do your best and what happens happens approach to racing"

3283823 - hope things improve for you.

Smoove - thanks for checking in - I'm heartened by your progress.

drcrusher - great week. I agree that Sunday got hot at the end. But...you got the miles in.

Also, you write: "I fear that the time for PR'ing again may be getting short" - trust me, I get that. But I also think that we have to be open minded, and that we may have longer than we think. At least that's what I keep telling myself.

RunGuy Midwest - that is a big week and bodes well.

Sub-6:00 - are you looking for the Clarendon Day results? I found them here (took some digging) -

https://www.zippyreg.com/results/live/index.php?ID=50

Coyote Montane - the hay fever's been awful in my area. Hopefully it clears for you soon.

As for me....

Female, 45, 5'4", 105

PRs 5:25/18:51/38:56/1:02:28/1:24:22/2:57:42

Goal races: Columbus Half-Marathon, Indianapolis Monumental Marathon

Goal times: 18:30 for 5K, 1:23:xx for half, sub-2:55 for full

"I lack a pithy quote" - me.

60 miles, 2 hours of pool-running, and 1000 yards of swimming

M: Off. (business trip to NYC)

T: 10 miles easy (8:25)* plus upper body weights/core. (* - Garmin was wonky, so this was probably slightly slower and shorter than reported).

W: 14 miles, including 3x2 miles in 12:37 (6:19/6:18), 12:34 (6:24/6:10) and 12:23 (6:13/6:10); half-mile recoveries of 5:30 after the first and 4:30 after the second (included some shoe re-tying between each rep for which I didn't pause my watch). Followed with leg strengthwork and 500 yards recovery swimming.

Th: DIY yoga and 2 hours of pool-running

F: 8 miles very easy (8:55), upper body weights and core, then 4 miles very easy (8:36) plus drills and strides.

Sa: 17 miles, including 2x5 miles in 33:24 (6:41 pace) and 33:02 (6:36 pace) with one mile float in 7:35 in between. Followed with leg strengthwork and 500 yards recovery swimming.

Su: 4 miles very easy (8:55), yoga, and then 3 miles very easy (8:40).

Monday I left home at 5:15 am to hop on the train to NYC, where the work day ran until 9:15 pm. So...nothing that day.

Tuesday's run was in NYC - hence the Garmin note. I usually map out my runs and correct the distance to get accurate stats, but just couldn't be bothered this time. I figured it was close enough to 10 miles.

I was really happy with the Wednesday and Saturday workouts. Both felt controlled and like I could have gone further, though my legs were tired at the end of the Saturday run.

I feel like I have the aerobic fitness for my goal of sub-2:55 - I just need a bit more mileage for strength. The trick over the next few weeks is to not get greedy - I need to train consistently to get enough strength for miles 20-26, but I don't need to do anything spectacular or take risks, and I need to remember that and not get greedy.

darkwave - Thanks for finding the results! I’d been refreshing the event website and Athlinks. Nice 2x5 workout.

—————————

M35, 5’10”, under 160

2019 bests:

5k - 16:01

Boston- 2:30:21

“I’m not a nerd. I’m a jock who’s too cool for sports.” -Bart Simpson

Upcoming:

10/6 - 5k

10/13 - Chicago (3 weeks)

Mo: AM - 10 @ “5:37” + 1E*; PM - 5 @ 8:49

Tu: AM - 10 @ 8:24; PM - 5 @ 8:37

We: AM - 10 @ 7:23; PM - 5 @ 7:46

Th: AM - 3E, 6400m in 21:24 (5:26, 5:24, 5:19, 5:15), 3E (cool 61 + 52); PM - 5 @ 7:30

Fr: 10 @ 8:17

Sa: 3E + 5k + 3 jog / 45’ + 10k + 2 jog, 17 total**

Su: 12 @ 8:50

Total: 100 miles (last time this decade?)

*Splits: 5:51, 5:36, 5:44, 5:39, 5:41, 5:34, 5:31, 5:33, 5:30, 5:27. Timed with the Garmin (so maybe add 4”/mile). Legs felt fresh and quickly decided to do a long tempo. Okay weather (70 + 66), on a bike trail with no real hills. Should have done a warmup, bashed the lower legs a bit without one.

—————————

**Race report!

5k (8 a.m, 64 + 58, 68’ ascent / 270’ descent), 15:27, 26th

At the start, felt like one of those indoor 5000s where they try to pack too many runners into one heat. Straight shot down a road with no sharp turns, and the field went out fast. Split 4:47 then made a bit of a move on one of the steeper downhill sections, which may have tweaked something in my right knee. The course levels out a little after 1.5, turning onto a closed freeway, and reaches its lowest level around 2 miles, which I split in 4:51. The third mile (split 5:11) features a turnaround and a slight uphill before another small uphill finish. I ran hard, but didn’t try to wring a kick from my legs. Jogged back uphill and switched from On CloudRush to Nike Streak.

10k (9 a.m., 67 + 58 and sunny, 131’ ascent / 332’ descent), 33:26, 12th

Plenty of faster guys from the 5k were back for the 10k, although I don’t think most were going anywhere near all out. My plan for the 10k was to go out around threshold pace and see how I felt. After the first mile, my position was basically set. A few guys challenged me, but fell off. I reeled in and almost out-kicked one guy, but he passed me back at the end. Splits were 5:16, 5:16, 5:24, 5:24, 5:22, 5:27. Most Garmin splits were right at the mile markers, but mile 3 had me worried as the marker was likely misplaced (took 6:00 to get between 2 and 3).

Double: 48:53, 9th place

Last year my times would’ve placed me 10th in the 5k, 3rd in the 10k, and 1st for the double. Tough fields, but that’s what I’d hoped for.

—————————

I’ve fallen into a few streaks this summer, and two are ending after today:

9 weeks at 100+

72 days with a session of 10+

Right knee is a bit sore after yesterday’s downhill race. Maybe the patellar tendon or a bursa sac got inflamed. I think I’m okay (fingers crossed), but will wait until it’s better before I do a real workout. I think I’ve done this before.

42 M, 5'10 145

Goal Race: CIM

* - indicates treadmill

** -- very hilly

Monday #1: 90 min @ 7:41 (143 bpm)

*Monday #2: 30 min @ 8:49 (126 bpm)

Tuesday - 60 min @ 7:12 (HRM failure)

Wednesday #1 - 80 min @ 8:09 (133 bpm)

**Wednesday #2 - 25 min @ 10:17 (122 bpm)

Thursday - 8 miles @ 6:41 (167 bpm)

Friday - 60 min @ 8:52 (127 bpm)

Saturday - 2 hours @ 6:51 (160 bpm)

*Sunday #1 - 50 min @ 8:47 (122 bpm)

**Sunday #2 - 30 min @10:22 (126 bpm)

Weekly Totals:

Miles - 77.1

Duration - 10:03

Elevation Gain - 2,139 ft

I posted here a lot in 2014/15 when stone cutter ran the thread along with slo-twitch, Hereford, reed, and some others. I was in awe of the talent and work ethic of the posters then, and remain in awe of it now. Some of these workouts, mpw, and race results are totally insane to a plugger like myself and it’s GREAT to see people being rewarded for their hard work and flat out dedication to the sport. I look forward to following you all this fall and hope every one of you attain even your most outlandish goals, LET’S GO.

M26, 147lbs ish, 5'9-5'10

PRs 34:2x, 1:15:2x, 2:50:xx

Goal: Valencia marathon

M: 5mi easy

T: w/u, 5xmile (2 min jog rest) w/ first 3/4 at 10k pace (5:25ish) and last 1/4 at 3k-5k pace (5:00-5:10ish), w/d

W: 7.1mi easy

T: up, 11 miles continuously alternating between MP (6:00/mi) and AT (5:30), down. Avg 5:44/mi, splits: 5:59, 5:33, 6:03, 5:33, 5:55, 5:34, 5:58, 5:31, 5:57, 5:30, 5:27

Fri: off

Sat: 7mi v. easy

Sun: 19mi steady (6:41/mi)

Total: 63mi

I was pretty sure it wouldn't possible for me to finish that thursday workout, so super glad that I did. It's basically 11mi averaging my HM PR pace, and not even at an even pace but alternating every mile, and I felt like I could've gone another couple miles maybe. Makes me feel like the fitness for the marathon is coming.

36/M/6'/142

Goal: Sub-17 5k... this fall.

My week:

M - 8 at 7:13 - Travel to Charlotte, jammed this in off a plane, before day full of meetings. Hectic.

T - 5 at 7:21 - Just didn't have time for anything else, still in Charlotte, hoped a plane home, but just couldn't double

W - 2 mile WU - Michigan W/O - 2 mile CD - Michigan - 1 mile at 5k, 1 mile tempo, 1200 @ 5k, 1 mile tempo, 800 @ 3k, 1 mile tempo, 400 @ whatever. Splits were 535, 558, 414 (530 pace), 600, 250 (540), 558, 77. This one hurt, think I should have been a bit less aggressive, maybe shooting for 540 pace, but hell, it was still a good workout.

Th - 8 at 714

F - 2 up, 4 tempo at 556, 2 down - Felt fatigued, but made it through

Sa - 6.2 at 719

Su - 12 at 727 - Hamstring was a bit tight today, but can run, and feels better throughout day. So think all is well.

Total - 57.2 miles

A really good week. Think my fitness is pretty much the best it has been in decades. Now, just need to pop in a few races in October and let em fly.

Lots of awesome weeks so far. I'll get to comments. But awesome racing Sub-6, that must have some really stiff competition, but the double race is really impressive.

I'll comment tomorrow when I have a few slower minutes in the office.

Brilliant weeks all around!

That's a really cool race, sub 6! I think I maybe could do a 16:40, 35:00 double but never under 50. Great job!

TL: Heck of a long run. Hope ya feel better.

AJ: Lotta top-notch quote selection this week, but yours edges out Stone's as my favorite for its intensity.

OR: Best of luck with the hammy.

Sub17: Nice work! 10 miles, what a cooldown.

328: Man, can't catch a break. Hoping ya get healthy all around.

Smoove: Wow, 7 weeks seems great. Well wishes for the ongoing recovery.

drcrusher and rgmw: Great weeks, congrats on the mileage PRs in the heat.

CM: Yikes! Do the allergies make the heat effect worse?

Darkwave: Looks like tou weathered the travel well, that Wednesday workout is great.

Sub 6: *long, impressed hayseed whistle* Nice races.

BHV: Grinding away.

DietBacon: Definitely a big workout and a strong long run to go with it.

LR: That week sure looks ready to crush 17.

Drive-by posting here...at work... here's my week... I'll be back to see how we're all doing later...

Male, 51 yo, 5’7”, 129 lbs

Goals: Dec 15 - Taipei Marathon (lottery willing) - sub 3:10

Upcoming Races: Oct 6 - 10k; Nov 3 - HM

Week 13

A difficult week this week. I had a bit of a stomach bug which affected my Wednesday Q and also reduced my mileage for the week. I was feeling better by Friday and I was able to execute Sunday’s Q without any restrictions.

Wednesday Q:

Supposed to be a T workout with a little over 40 minutes of T work. I felt bad at the outset and managed only about 12 minutes before I slowed down and dry-heaved a few times. I didn’t bag it immediately, but I went into E mode. After 5 more minutes at E, I did decided to bring it in, but for some reason, I felt the need to punish myself so on the way back; I hit the uphill very hard...like Strava CR hard. This time the puke got up to the top of my throat. And ended up 5th. But it was a good mental test.

Sunday Q: 1.6km E + 13km M + 1km E (and a drink) + 10km M + 1.3km E

A cooler than usual evening, but still in the 70s. Fall is here. Went out determined to do “marathon effort” rather than “marathon pace” or “marathon HR.” In my mind that is just below my easiest T effort, so that’s the feeling I went for. The first 13km were within spitting distance of a reasonable M performance on a 70 degree day, but the pace relative to perceived effort deteriorated on the back end pretty considerably and HR eventually hit my low T zone (I had that alarm set on my watch). During a race, I would have just kept at the same level of effort, but not in this workout; I eased off a bit right near the end. Bigger picture.