Truths/Myths about running in college?

The way I run it, is group A will get run more than B, and C, for obvious reasons. They can, because they can do it.

How I get group B (for example, same as C) to get up closer to group A is the TYPE of workout. If they aren't complaining of any issues, I will have them do (for example) speed workouts (track workouts) or tempos higher than they typically do. But err on the side of safety not to hurt anyone. Same with group C.

As soon as they start complaining, I move down a notch (and I mean a notch, not completely let them off). I typically do this by adjusting their mile pace times or if I'm doing a track workout with them, their 400 times, by X number of laps.

Now if it's just a single person, I can move them within the groups accordingly. So if someone from group A tells me straight up they can't do group A's workout, I will move them to B. Likewise, if the athlete and I see it is possible to move from group B to A, I will move them, and closely monitor their performance and what they tell me.

Again, what helps is having someone there with them. I typically go out with the B and C groups and run with them, and do the workout with them. This way, they know EXACTLY what they are doing. Basically someone with authority over the workout is there with them. They appreciate it too!

The A, B, and C groups will all get a great workout in, and they all improve drastically from the start to finish of the season, barring any fatal injuries (eg. stupidity/showoffs).

Been doing this for a while, and with 98% success, minimal injuries. This is my FIRST semester in 10 years where 30 runners successfully completed all races without injury with all of them agreeing upon positive success. I must be doing something correct with my coaching career.

A lot of it helps that I run with them, and I instill communication. I hear a lot when we go out for 8-10 miles. A lot of people's inner feelings come out, especially when their teammates are around. Sometimes they joke with me, ahh, the coach has to hear this.... but I find all of it interesting. If I need to, I put my $0.02 in.

The amount of time I spend on my program is 110%. I don't do any less. Also, if I see something, I act upon it immediately.

I enjoy doing it, and wouldn't trade it for anything else. I love coaching and they love me. We are a tight knit family.

Like I said, there are a lot of other teams that they wish their coach would go run with them. I guess it's far and few between nowadays.

What are you talking about? I travelled nearly every week during track season normally leaving Wednesday afternoon and returning home at midnight Saturday. Distance runners at a D1 school miss more class than any other athlete because you compete all fall, winter, and spring.

Another thing I forgot, I also assign the team captain to monitor and report back to me what their thoughts are of the workouts, and what they believe their teammates think.

Again, it's all about the communication circle, and actually seeing and being involved in everything.

I've gotten ~35-38 min 8K times down to 29's and flat 30's for a lot of folks. I really noticed it this year.

It's all about the approach and being there with them. I've been through two types of coaches:

1. Ones that tell you go and run 15 miles and come back.

2. Ones that are like me, and focus on the workouts, and are there with you at every step of the game.

I prefer #2, so I preach #2...

Hope this helps...

Former D1 Runner For Real wrote:

What are you talking about? I travelled nearly every week during track season normally leaving Wednesday afternoon and returning home at midnight Saturday. Distance runners at a D1 school miss more class than any other athlete because you compete all fall, winter, and spring.

Lol, he must not have been on the travel team.

LoneStarXC wrote:

Former D1 Runner For Real wrote:

What are you talking about? I travelled nearly every week during track season normally leaving Wednesday afternoon and returning home at midnight Saturday. Distance runners at a D1 school miss more class than any other athlete because you compete all fall, winter, and spring.

Lol, he must not have been on the travel team.

That doesn't happen at DIII, that's why. DIII focuses on education, versus other "priorities", and I'll leave it at that.

manualf150 wrote:

LoneStarXC wrote:

Lol, he must not have been on the travel team.

That doesn't happen at DIII, that's why. DIII focuses on education, versus other "priorities", and I'll leave it at that.

I was at a D1 school on a shoestring budget, so 90 percent of our meets were leave Saturday morning, return Saturday night. Often, our only overnight trip of the season was the conference meet. Most invitational meets were more or less local.

This was for two reasons: our athletic department was perpetually broke, and our coach was fanatical about us not missing class. Even on meets when we left on Friday, coach would schedule our departure after our last athlete's class ended.

Not all D1 teams go jet setting around the country. I feel sorry for you if you really missed half your classes every week. Why even be in college?

Some guy the fake one wrote:

manualf150 wrote:

That doesn't happen at DIII, that's why. DIII focuses on education, versus other "priorities", and I'll leave it at that.

I was at a D1 school on a shoestring budget, so 90 percent of our meets were leave Saturday morning, return Saturday night. Often, our only overnight trip of the season was the conference meet. Most invitational meets were more or less local.

This was for two reasons: our athletic department was perpetually broke, and our coach was fanatical about us not missing class. Even on meets when we left on Friday, coach would schedule our departure after our last athlete's class ended.

Not all D1 teams go jet setting around the country. I feel sorry for you if you really missed half your classes every week. Why even be in college?

I'm guessing you went to college 20+ years ago. I ran on a D1 team in the 90s, and you pretty much described my experience.

Today, even "broke" athletic departments send their track teams all over the country. The way they do it today, I would discourage an academically serious student from running at the D1 level.

I am starting to think that this site is dominated by former D3 runners who have no idea how few scholarships exist for D1 runners and how tough it is to manage the schedule of a D1 runner and student. For the poster who says that D3 focuses on education, think about how much more impressive it is for a D1 runner to graduate with a 3.0 GPA in engineering now that you know how much class time he missed as compared to a D3 guy with his 3.5 in some liberal arts field when he never missed a class. The D1 guy is up half the night on Sunday, Monday, and Tuesday to complete assignments and make up missed exams.

This is the outdoor schedule for Indiana who is an average P5 team in central USA. Most of these meets are attended by all of the major D1 universities.

Mar 22 (Fri) Mar 23 (Sat) at

Sun Devil Invitational

Tempe, Ariz.

Mar 28 (Thu) Mar 30 (Sat) at

Texas Relays

Austin, Texas

Mar 28 (Thu) Mar 30 (Sat) at

Florida Relays

Gainesville, Fla.

Mar 29 (Fri) Mar 30 (Sat) at

Stanford Invitational

Stanford, Calif.

Apr 5 (Fri) Apr 6 (Sat) at

Spec Towns Invite

Athens, GA

Apr 12 (Fri) Apr 13 (Sat) at

Tennessee Relays

Knoxville, Tenn.

Apr 19 (Fri) Apr 20 (Sat) at

Cardinal Classic

Stanford, CA

Apr 19 (Fri) Apr 20 (Sat) at

War Eagle Invite

Auburn, Ala.

Apr 25 (Thu) Apr 27 (Sat) at

Penn Relays

Philadelphia, PA

May 3 (Fri)

Billy Hayes Invitational

Bloomington, Ind.

May 10 (Fri) May 12 (Sun) at

Big Ten Championships

Iowa City, Iowa

May 23 (Thu) May 25 (Sat) at

NCAA East Preliminary Round

Tampa, Fla.

Jun 6 (Thu) Jun 8 (Sat) at

NCAA Championships

Austin, Texas

I see where you are coming from in terms of "managing" work loads.

However, what gain is it from missing all those hours of classes? Why even go to school? Why not just take all online classes? Isn't that the point of going to school? I haven't been able to figure that out or else I'm missing something.

I've been on quite a few hiring committees in my lifetime, and the last thing I need is some DI scholar that can manage work loads. Albeit, anyone can be forced to manage workloads, no doubt. The major problem I find with those types of people, is they can't produce quality work OR they don't have the skills necessary for the workforce. Unfortunately, the best folks I find are usually come from DII or DIII schools, rarely DI.

I tell this to everyone - it don't matter what school you go to, it's all in the person's desire as to what THEY want to do with their life. A lot of times a chintzy piece of paper means absolutely nothing. At the end of the day, there are times when I hire folks with HSD/GED to replace someone that went to a DI school. It's embarrassing, but at the end of the day, some folks are just better producers when they have no degree or a minimal degree.

I'll give you an example, a couple years ago, I was hiring for a programmer analyst position for my main job. We had all walks of life, all kind of folks coming out of the wood works. Me and my search committee came down to 3 people. 1st one was a graduate of a small community college out in Colorado. 2nd was a graduate from Cornell. 3rd only had a HS diploma and was trying to finish their BS at a local college (DIII), but ran a small business related to the field for x number of years. It was a tough decision. All 3 people were qualified in my eyes. After doing a phone screening, we narrowed it down to the 2nd and 3rd candidate. Because the 2nd candidate met the degree requirements for the job (less actual job experience), we went with the Cornell candidate.

BIG mistake. We had to get rid of them after 4 months, to the point where I almost lost my job because of the little weasel. We then opened the search back up, and had to find 3 new candidates. Almost the same folks reapplied. This time we went with the person that just had their HS diploma and was working on their BS. Best person we could've ever hired. Time management, knew the job, great customer relations, etc. Now the person has their BS (we even paid for it), and they are making more than what they expected with LESS stress of owning a business. Plus they are quite pleasant to work with.

Sad thing is, I see this all the time. Folks go to college, pay big bucks, and are left hanging if they "don't get it" or expect to get a job because they went to some DI college (or any college for that regard). So when people mention DI or DII or DIII, it's just school to me. Don't mean a hill of beans, whether you have a GED or a PHD.

I'm glad I went to a DIII school, and I'm very proud of it. I got a real education, and a great paying job. Or another way to say it: "I'm a satisfied customer." (Which you rarely hear about going to college...)

Don t expect to be a star right away either scholarship or especially a walk on.

You lost me. I would love the employee who was able to do well in college when they had a limited amount of time to study and complete assignments. Most college kids have so much time on their hands that they have a tough time being in a job for 8 hours straight with daily deadlines. As far as choosing online classes, that is not an option. Run D1 and major in something real like premed or engineering and you have to take real classes.

Hiring a D2 kid is insane unless from Colorado mines. Average ACT at Adams is 19. Those are the kids who are cheating on high school tests and paying to get assignments done. 19 means you can’t spell or add or pretty much do anything productive. Most d3 kids are so sheltered by attending some school in a small town that has 1000 students where every professor knows your name and does not allow you to fail. That is the selling point that most of those schools make.

I work with runners at a different Big 10 university. Our schedule is almost identical to that. The sprinters travel like crazy. Hitting basically all those meets unless they overlap.

The distance runners are lucky if they get to go to 2 meets. Many don't travel even once.

I went through results from most of the Big 10 teams last year and nearly all had their distance guys running at all of these meets. I didn’t bother looking at the bottom 2 distance programs so you must be at one of those which would make sense because 14:30 guys can’t get into some of the big meets.

From a former athlete:

1) you might not improve in college

2) push for answers from the doctors, athletic trainers, and coaches if you continually get injured --be proactive, get second opinions.

3) have a life/interests outside of running

That advice is good for the average, injured guy. Advice for the elite runner who wants to go pro is to put everything you have into your running.

Former D1 Runner For Real wrote:

What are you talking about? I travelled nearly every week during track season normally leaving Wednesday afternoon and returning home at midnight Saturday. Distance runners at a D1 school miss more class than any other athlete because you compete all fall, winter, and spring.

This. On the road Wednesday morning and back on Sunday night.

I ran D1 in college and made significant gains in my primary events which were 1500-5k with some 800s as well. My program has gotten a new coach since I left.

I feel like there’s no reason why a track athlete shouldn’t be able to keep up with their studies if they are focusing on that as well. Classes will take up about 10-20 hours a week depending on courseload.

My team only formally met for practice 4 days a week (workout days and long run); the other days were on our own which provided us with flexibility on scheduling runs and classes. That may be different than other athletes’ experiences.

The thread has strayed a bit from the original post. Wow, that almost never happens!

I'm the coach at a small NAIA school in the Midwest. We just completed our first season of cross. Despite every high school kid's opinion that they need to run DI or a good DII, there are quality athletes at every level. And because of the lower levels, there is a place for ANYBODY who wants to run in college. A really important character to me as I recruit is whether the kid really loves running and has aspirations to improve. Having run for over 40 years, I get a pretty good sense of that but on the other hand, I couldn't be as choosy with a first year program so I signed some kids who didn't quite fit my model. They still did ok. I also want kids who have demonstrated some academic ability in high school. Cross kids are pretty good students.

I'd love to have 10 women and 10 men (a little short of that this year). I have 5 full tuition only scholarships for men and 5 for women to be divided up any way I want (1/4, 1/2, $1000, whatever). I base my scholarships on ability but also on what other kind of aid the student is receiving. I don't have any time standards but most of the guys I talk to are 17:30 +/-. The women's bar is much lower. Many schools in our conference and area have a hard time finding ANY women to fill a roster. While I want every scholarship-receiving athlete to be a contributor, I am not taking away his/her scholarship unless they come to me and just say "I quit." If they come to practice and are making an attempt, that's good enough.

Very few kids are going to run competitively beyond their college careers (outside of road racing). My recommendation would be to find a place that meets your academic and career goals first but one that also challenges you to reach your athletic potential. I think that starts with a coach who is fully engaged in the program.