I'm calling you out on this one wrote:
Mo EPO than Mo wrote:
Laura Muir's dirty. You can take that to the bank.
C'mon now...what proof do you have to make such a statement?
IDK if Muir is dirty, but doesn’t she have access to a lot of drugs since she’s a vet?
I don’t think there are any clean WRs. With doping being so rampant, I have a hard time believing that when comparing outliers, the world’s best clean athlete is better than the world’s best drugged athlete.
The clean athlete would have to be even more or a statistical anomaly than they are already are.
In any case, I think it’s funny that whenever these threads start, the LR faithful pull up the all time lists, scroll to the first white person, and declare that the clean WR.
Hshsb wrote:
I don’t think there are any clean WRs. With doping being so rampant, I have a hard time believing that when comparing outliers, the world’s best clean athlete is better than the world’s best drugged athlete.
The clean athlete would have to be even more or a statistical anomaly than they are already are.
In any case, I think it’s funny that whenever these threads start, the LR faithful pull up the all time lists, scroll to the first white person, and declare that the clean WR.
+1 to all of that.
LoneStarXC wrote:
I'm calling you out on this one wrote:
C'mon now...what proof do you have to make such a statement?
IDK if Muir is dirty, but doesn’t she have access to a lot of drugs since she’s a vet?
So what? Just because she's a vet and has access to certain drugs, does that mean she's going to use them as PEDs? Think of all the M.D.s, Physician Assistants, Nurse Practitioners, etc., out there that compete in sports - they have access to drugs, but that doesn't automatically mean they're going to use them in their competitions.
Muir has superb genetics and makes the best of it with extremely hard work...no surprises there.
Average LetsRun poster response:
Any WRs by non-white athletes: Absolutely, 100% doped and dirty! How awful!
WRs by white Europeans or Americans: They definitely were 100% clean, spotless, and pure!
You guys can be so predictable.
casual obsever wrote:
Hshsb wrote:
I don’t think there are any clean WRs. With doping being so rampant, I have a hard time believing that when comparing outliers, the world’s best clean athlete is better than the world’s best drugged athlete.
The clean athlete would have to be even more or a statistical anomaly than they are already are.
In any case, I think it’s funny that whenever these threads start, the LR faithful pull up the all time lists, scroll to the first white person, and declare that the clean WR.
+1 to all of that.
Not even one WR clean?
I don't think they're all dirty and I'm thinking the men's marathon WR is likely clean. The men's marathon times dramatically improved over years passed after the passport was implemented to include Kipchoge's WR this year. The marathon may be one discipline that's least influenced by EPO/transfusions (based on the improved times after the ABP was implemented), which tells me super talented clean guys can compete successfully at that distance.
GoldenMiles wrote:
Average LetsRun poster response:
Any WRs by non-white athletes: Absolutely, 100% doped and dirty! How awful!
WRs by white Europeans or Americans: They definitely were 100% clean, spotless, and pure!
You guys can be so predictable.
Explain any thread on letsrun that is about Lasse Viren?
And to answer the original question, I don’t know. None of us know, unless we’re the athletes themselves who hold the WR. Unlike others on this site, though, I take world records as being clean unless they are proven otherwise. Sometimes I do have my doubts (I won’t say, I’m sure you guys can guess which ones are the obvious ones), but they are still technically the world records, and there’s no proof they aren’t valid. If there was proof, they wouldn’t be WRs any longer.
The Japanese. They just grind it out and don't worry about the PEDs. Doubt Yuki is on anything.
I'm calling you out on this one wrote:
LoneStarXC wrote:
IDK if Muir is dirty, but doesn’t she have access to a lot of drugs since she’s a vet?
So what? Just because she's a vet and has access to certain drugs, does that mean she's going to use them as PEDs? Think of all the M.D.s, Physician Assistants, Nurse Practitioners, etc., out there that compete in sports - they have access to drugs, but that doesn't automatically mean they're going to use them in their competitions.
Muir has superb genetics and makes the best of it with extremely hard work...no surprises there.
All elite runners, have “superb genetics”. Unfortunately, there is so much doping in t&f that it’s like the elites have to be drugged to be competitive against all the other drugged athletes. It’s really sad, actually.
Clean Japs wrote:
The Japanese. They just grind it out and don't worry about the PEDs. Doubt Yuki is on anything.
Yeah, I think Yuki is clean.
Suguru Osako I’m not sure, because he’s with NOP and we all know that AlSal has some shady stuff going on there.
GoldenMiles wrote:
And to answer the original question, I don’t know. None of us know, unless we’re the athletes themselves who hold the WR. Unlike others on this site, though, I take world records as being clean unless they are proven otherwise. Sometimes I do have my doubts (I won’t say, I’m sure you guys can guess which ones are the obvious ones), but they are still technically the world records, and there’s no proof they aren’t valid. If there was proof, they wouldn’t be WRs any longer.
And there's hardly any WR holders that have tested positive for dope. I think the last one was Boulami when he set the WR in the SC back in 02. So, maybe you're right - should we give them the benefit of the doubt? ?
There must be an answer wrote:
GoldenMiles wrote:
And to answer the original question, I don’t know. None of us know, unless we’re the athletes themselves who hold the WR. Unlike others on this site, though, I take world records as being clean unless they are proven otherwise. Sometimes I do have my doubts (I won’t say, I’m sure you guys can guess which ones are the obvious ones), but they are still technically the world records, and there’s no proof they aren’t valid. If there was proof, they wouldn’t be WRs any longer.
And there's hardly any WR holders that have tested positive for dope. I think the last one was Boulami when he set the WR in the SC back in 02. So, maybe you're right - should we give them the benefit of the doubt? ?
When was Montgomery outed? Powell a former WR holder was also busted. But they'll all sprinters, we gentlemanly joggers wouldn't touch the naughty stuff.
I think Yiannis's records are clean. He was a strict vegetarian and careful about his regimen.
Hshsb wrote:
I don’t think there are any clean WRs. With doping being so rampant, I have a hard time believing that when comparing outliers, the world’s best clean athlete is better than the world’s best drugged athlete.
The clean athlete would have to be even more or a statistical anomaly than they are already are.
In any case, I think it’s funny that whenever these threads start, the LR faithful pull up the all time lists, scroll to the first white person, and declare that the clean WR.
People here can scream racism all they like, but the fact is that the middle and long distance world records were mainly held by people of European descent before 1990, and almost overnight they were put out of sight by Africans - just around the time that EPO became available, the first drug to really improve endurance.
Now you can argue as others have (at times) that EPO simply 'levelled the doping playing field', but you can't deny facts. It is suspicious in itself that the most corrupt continent on Earth suddenly started running faster than the rest of the world ever had or possibly can, just when a cheap endurance drug hits the market, and we know subsequently was available in every East African pharmacy like aspirin.
I know for sure that if a country like China had suddenly dominated middle and long distance running instead of Africa (and of course they did dominate women's track for a little while, setting crazy WRs), with numerous bust and documented evidence of the ease of availability of peds and corrupt testers, the same people shouting racism at me would be absolutely non-hesitant about accusing Chinese athletes of universal doping.
As far as Nick Willis is concerned, he is a very good candidate, perhaps the best in any event, of likely having ran the fastest time ever clean. Not because he's white, but because he doesn't come from a corrupt East African culture where doping is rampant, and because in his case, his anti-doping stance does come across as very genuine. And if like many people here (not me of course), want to believe that the Brits of the 80's were suspicious, Nick Willis actually ran faster than them (just!).
Lol yeah right wrote:
Lydiard Cerutty wrote:
World records I believe to be clean:
400m
800m
Bekele and Kipchoge records
LoL 400m you mean the one that was run in lane 8, smashing one of the most doped records of all time? I bet you thought Lance was clean too?
Now I’m a pretty big skeptic of super fast times as well, and I have my doubts, but to use the fact that the record was won in lane 8 is actually a really dumb statement. Times in lane 8 are normally slow because the best runners get the middle lanes, so they get somewhat of an advantage with the turn radius but they also get to see the race in front of them. This pushes the worst runners to lanes 8 and 1, and thus the slower times.
Lane 8 is actually the fastest lane on the track, it has the widest turn radius. Why are indoor times (unbanked) so much slower than outdoor times? Because the small turn radius means the runner must exert a greater horizontal force(this is why spikes make a difference) on the turns to keep themselves in their lane. When you’re sprinting 20 mph around a track, it makes a difference.
Coevett wrote:
Hshsb wrote:
I don’t think there are any clean WRs. With doping being so rampant, I have a hard time believing that when comparing outliers, the world’s best clean athlete is better than the world’s best drugged athlete.
The clean athlete would have to be even more or a statistical anomaly than they are already are.
In any case, I think it’s funny that whenever these threads start, the LR faithful pull up the all time lists, scroll to the first white person, and declare that the clean WR.
People here can scream racism all they like, but the fact is that the middle and long distance world records were mainly held by people of European descent before 1990, and almost overnight they were put out of sight by Africans - just around the time that EPO became available, the first drug to really improve endurance.
Now you can argue as others have (at times) that EPO simply 'levelled the doping playing field', but you can't deny facts. It is suspicious in itself that the most corrupt continent on Earth suddenly started running faster than the rest of the world ever had or possibly can, just when a cheap endurance drug hits the market, and we know subsequently was available in every East African pharmacy like aspirin.
I know for sure that if a country like China had suddenly dominated middle and long distance running instead of Africa (and of course they did dominate women's track for a little while, setting crazy WRs), with numerous bust and documented evidence of the ease of availability of peds and corrupt testers, the same people shouting racism at me would be absolutely non-hesitant about accusing Chinese athletes of universal doping.
As far as Nick Willis is concerned, he is a very good candidate, perhaps the best in any event, of likely having ran the fastest time ever clean. Not because he's white, but because he doesn't come from a corrupt East African culture where doping is rampant, and because in his case, his anti-doping stance does come across as very genuine. And if like many people here (not me of course), want to believe that the Brits of the 80's were suspicious, Nick Willis actually ran faster than them (just!).
+1
GoldenMiles wrote:
Average LetsRun poster response:
Any WRs by non-white athletes: Absolutely, 100% doped and dirty! How awful!
WRs by white Europeans or Americans: They definitely were 100% clean, spotless, and pure!
You guys can be so predictable.
There are only three WR's by white athletes irunning events that matter, women's 400, 800, and Marathon.
Absolutely no one on this board thinks the track ones are clean. Most of us doubt the marathon.
Moran.
LoneStarXC wrote:
Are there any world records that are clean? It seems like so many elites are doping, so it’s kind of hard to believe that the runners who come out on top are clean.
Discus.
Terry Burrows (UK) cleaned three standard 114.3 x 114.3 cm (45 x 45 in) office windows set in a frame with a 300 mm (11.75 in) long squeegee and 9 litres (2 gal; US 2.37 gal) of water in 9.14 sec at the National Window Cleaning Competition in Blackpool, UK, on 9 October 2009. - Guiness World Record
The largest house cleaning lesson consists of 2,030 participants, achieved by Saudi Manpower Solutions Co. (SMASCO) (Saudi Arabia), in Riyadh, Saudi Arabia, on 13 April 2018. - Guinness World Record
Deer Brojos,
Please redo the “is this runner clean?” survey. I think a 2018 update would be fun.
Thanks.
LoneStarXC