Is Jerry Schumacher the best American distance coach right now?

Scorpion_runner wrote:

Overall, historically, Yes it is Jerry. Sure. But Taylor's 2:24 after coming off Boston, and not really gassed, tells me she can at least get down to 2:21. And she is only 31, which is a puppy in marathon. Who knows what she is going to run in the next 2 or 3 years.

Out all the american women she has the most upside besides Hasay( of course due to age)...so I wouldn't be surprised if taylor snags an Olympic medal or World Championship before it is all said and done. - Cragg (jerry)snagged one.

This makes zero sense. You take someone who has been living at altitude, running high mileage, and running marathons for years, who has a big breakthrough at a wind-aided race, and you take that as an indication that they're going to drop ANOTHER three minutes?

I actually can't think of any marathoner ever who was very experienced, had a mid-to-late career breakthrough, and then in a few years had another breakthrough.

Jager Bombz wrote:

idk man there's literally no reason for suspicion other than the fact his athletes are running fast. just sucks that being fast is enough to raise questions in this sport

There literally is a reason as Jager was listed as "likely doping" in the USADA report.

What? late in her career? She ran her first marathon in 2015! So what are you talking about? She is 31 and is still learning to run the marathon. Mary K has been running the marathon for years and at the age of 35 PRd last year for the fastest marathoner ever in a women's race.

She is young as hell in the marathon event. Runners leave the track at about 30-31 years old and then go off to the road. which is what she did. From 2009-2015 she ran track!

She will be marathon running for another 5-6 years ( 37), so not even close to the middle of her career as a marathoner.

I have been around this sport at the top level for 40 + years.

Something isn’t right here.

Jager is the manifestation of that.

Hooligan is the confirmation.

Jerry Shoes athletes don’t feel right at all.

I want so hard to believe,

But I just can’t.

Trump2020OP-the real one... wrote:

No love for Coach JS?

M.A.G.A...

JS is not an American coach. He is a Swedish "Magic Wizard" on his way up for a higher nomination .

If he will live 20 more years and still have his super brain intact , maybe then we are talking about The Coach of the coaches.

But I think we have to be fair and say there are many other coaches in the States that are very good but dont have the same

level of talents to work with as those American coaches mentioned.

Scorpion_runner wrote:

Nope still Alberto.

Rupp won the Pargue and Chicago Marathon and ran 2:06

Hasay ran 2:20

Yomif is destroying everything in sight, and repeated as indoor world champion

Murphy is back to a high level

Hassan's range is insane and is just getting better and better at 5000m. She will give Obiri a serious run next season.

Jerry is good. But I'm still not convinced that Houlihan will be able to medal with Dibaba, Kipyegon, Muir, Hassan and Semenya on the track, when it will counts.

I would honestly put the guy at NAZ Elite ahead of Jerry. They are killing it.

Kids, this is the direct result of drug dependency. Please kids, just say no to drugs!

What’s Jerry’s training look like?

Pascal’s love child wrote:

What’s Jerry’s training look like?

Here is a sample of Jager off season training. About 90+ miles a week some mile reps and 200m reps.

TrueBut wrote:

This is kind of a pointless argument. What Alberto has done with Centro, Rupp, Hassan and Farah hasn’t been done with any BTC athletes, besides Evan.

If you want to say who coaches American athletes better, which it sounds like this has become, how do you compare a coach who has 4 Americans athletes to one who has 15ish? Alberto’s 4 are great (Centro, Rupp, Hasay, Murphy). Jerry has 4 great ones (Jager, Shalane, Courtney, Shelby). They both have great former American Athletes.

I guess what I’m saying is this is a pointless argument when comparing a coach who only coaches Americans to one who coaches Top International Stars...

great point. Also worth noting that most of Jerry's really successful runners are ridiculously talented and likely would be running fast no matter who was coaching them. Just look at Houlihan, for example. You can give Jerry some credit for her insane kick at the end of races, but for the most part that's just natural ability right there.

Shalane is easily one of the toughest runners out there, men or women. Mentally strong, tremendous amount guts. Courtney is the collegiate record holder (before being coached by Jerry), so it's not a total surprise that the best collegiate steeplechaser goes on to break an american record.

There are only a couple athletes that Jerry's coached where I've thought "Wow, that guy/girl has no business running that fast, Jerry's a genius." On the other hand, Galen Rupp getting a silver medal in the olympic 10k against such a stacked field was clearly one of those moments. Same with Centro in the 1500 in 2016.

No way. Alberto is still tops.

Baffled but wrote:

I tell you what I can’t believe at all is how Jerry is never accused of doping. Is he that much better of a coach that his athletes can routinely beat “known dopers”? The jumps of several in the group would be hysterically condemned if they were from say Morocco or even Salazar. Does Jerry get a pass because he is never photographed or does interviews?

Or are these Bowerman performances a result of the very best developed talent, big time contracts, training together, well paid coaches, facilities, Nike resources, altitude camps year-round, etc.?

Lol it’s easy. Brojos personally dislike Salazar and Rupp, and they do their best to lead a witch hunt against them every chance they get. Rojo at the very least is a Jager fanboy, and tries to deflect any criticism against BTC.

great point wrote:

great point. Also worth noting that most of Jerry's really successful runners are ridiculously talented and likely would be running fast no matter who was coaching them. Just look at Houlihan, for example. You can give Jerry some credit for her insane kick at the end of races, but for the most part that's just natural ability right there.

I would say if anything, Houlihan had always had the type of kick, especially in collegiate races. I think Jerry developed her strength. After a couple years of messing with the 5k she now has the strength she needs to be a great 1500 runner. Then again, she ran 14:34 so maybe she is a true 15/5k hybrid like Hassan.

Jager Bombz wrote:

idk man there's literally no reason for suspicion other than the fact his athletes are running fast. just sucks that being fast is enough to raise questions in this sport

Bluntly speaking, this is completely ruined by Jager. His steeplechase progression was extraordinarily irregular with massive jumps left and right. Add that to the fact that USADA marked him as likely doping based on his test results, and he's pretty much one of the most suspicious guys out there.

Hdjsjddhsj wrote:

Jerry has also broken more top talent than other coaches.

German Fernandez

Sammy Silva

Chris Solinsky

Chris Derrick

Emily Infeld

Colleen Quigley

Lopez Lomong is coming back around but has been up and down under Jerry

Tegenkamp was often hurt under Jerry

Brent Vaughn

Andrew Bumbalough

Many of the above have shown flashes of greatness but lacked consistency over the long term with Jerry. He has a cookie cutter type of system. High volume and pretty intense. You either survive and thrive or break.

Add Elliott Heath to that list...does anyone know if he's still at Bowerman? Or what injury has taken him down for going on, what, 4, 5 years? I always sensed he was at least as talented Garrett, esp. at longer distances, but he seems to have disappeared...

It’s egun wrote:

I have been around this sport at the top level for 40 + years.

Something isn’t right here.

Jager is the manifestation of that.

Hooligan is the confirmation.

Jerry Shoes athletes don’t feel right at all.

I want so hard to believe,

But I just can’t.

And what did your gut say when Aden's athletes broke 3 x wr's in a day? Or when Farah was running 3:28 with a newly found miraculous kick and Rupp 3:50/8:07/13:00 indoors?

PoorElliott wrote:

Hdjsjddhsj wrote:

Jerry has also broken more top talent than other coaches.

German Fernandez

Sammy Silva

Chris Solinsky

Chris Derrick

Emily Infeld

Colleen Quigley

Lopez Lomong is coming back around but has been up and down under Jerry

Tegenkamp was often hurt under Jerry

Brent Vaughn

Andrew Bumbalough

Many of the above have shown flashes of greatness but lacked consistency over the long term with Jerry. He has a cookie cutter type of system. High volume and pretty intense. You either survive and thrive or break.

Add Elliott Heath to that list...does anyone know if he's still at Bowerman? Or what injury has taken him down for going on, what, 4, 5 years? I always sensed he was at least as talented Garrett, esp. at longer distances, but he seems to have disappeared...

Elliott no longer trains seriously. He has a good job at Nike (with a very new promotion), and I believe has foregone any thoughts of further competition.

That swoosh life wrote:

PoorElliott wrote:

Add Elliott Heath to that list...does anyone know if he's still at Bowerman? Or what injury has taken him down for going on, what, 4, 5 years? I always sensed he was at least as talented Garrett, esp. at longer distances, but he seems to have disappeared...

Elliott no longer trains seriously. He has a good job at Nike (with a very new promotion), and I believe has foregone any thoughts of further competition.

Ah, that's a shame, but good to hear he's landed well outside of competitive racing. Takes a lot of maturity not to keep living a lost dream for years...

Seyta wrote:

Bluntly speaking, this is completely ruined by Jager. ... he's pretty much one of the most suspicious guys out there.

^This. He was ranked as the most suspicious likely doper by the IAAF in 2016, worse than all of the other including Farah, Hassan, Kiprop and Rupp.

For those who claim that "likely doping" does not mean much, here's the definition again:

"Likely doping: Considering the information within the Athlete’s Passport, it is likely that the Passport is the result the Use of a Prohibited Substance or Prohibited Method and it is highly unlikely that it may be the result of a normal physiological or pathological condition."

So, all of them are "highly unlikely" clean, and Jager was the worst of them all.

Thanks to IAAF's non-transparency philosophy, we won't see his off scores, unfortunately...

still there, saw a btc instagram birthday post for him this year, why the women in bowerman are so much more successful than the men idk, anyone have a good and well formulated idea (other than doping) on why?

https://www.instagram.com/p/Be1ZBSngvbG/?utm_source=ig_share_sheet&igshid=p81opa3huems