a letsrun historian wrote:
Something like this has been done before. Long story short: Guy in his late 20s with no college of HS track experience picks up sprinting and trains for a bit longer than a year. He manages a 12.38 FAT at first, and then updates the thread later to post his 12.26 wind-legal FAT 100 and his +2.4 tailwind 11.98 FAT 100.
http://www.letsrun.com/forum/flat_read.php?thread=8100711
Nice thread! 12 flat is realistic for most people, sub 11 is not.
Ok keep an eye out either late this evening or early tomorrow and ill post, ive just added them to my drive so I can look properly
jdarez786 wrote:
for the next few years, I'm going to train for speed.
Male
32
186cm
80kg/175lbs
April '17 - 100m PB 15.2sec (HT)
I was training with a slightly injured ankle which I exacerbated and was taken out of training till December. I later learnt this injury was chronic ankle instability and weakness, brought about by improper squat technique at the gym.
February '18 - 100m PB 13.88 (freezing cold and bit of a headwind) (FAT)
I realize that I'm probably making beginner gains and it'll get harder as I go along. Still, I'm determined to break into the 10s at some point.
No chance, dude. If you started in your mid 20s and had minimal or no problems with injuries, you might have been able to run 11.99 FAT at 30 if you got the maximum 2.0 m/s tailwind. Even with that, there is a world of difference between a 11.99 and a 10.99.
As for your condition and age now? Forget it. Even breaking 13 would be hard. Running in the mid 12s would be a miracle.
jdarez786 wrote:
After 2yrs in the gym, I look pretty ripped and impressive too.
April '17 - 100m PB 15.2sec (HT)
Jan '18 - 100m PB 13.99 (FAT)
I'm determined to break into the 10s at some point.
Those who can run in the 11s (much less the 10s) can break 14 on their first week on the track. It took you quite a while to get there. But since you're determined to run in the 10s, here's what will work:
1. Find a 100m cliff
2. Learn and get good at skydiving. Get your "A" license, which may take a few months and a few hundred jumps.
3. Learn base jumping. Practice off of tall bridges first; they're typically safer than buildings or other structures.
4. When you're confident, base jump off that 100m cliff you found in step 1. You will get under 11.
@jdarez wrote:
Most people can not break 15 no matter how much they train.
This is a load of crap. Even a 40 year old obese woman can run 14.9 if she trains and loses that weight.
Sub 11 takes real talent, though. If you're just talking about young trained males, the percentiles would be:
Top 99%: 14.5
Top 95%: 14.0
Top 85%: 13.5
Top 65%: 13.0
Top 50%: 12.5
Top 30%: 12.0
Top 10%: 11.5
Top 1%: 11.0
AJ2000 wrote:
JD would you mind posting a vid of your start and top speed ????
as for your track sessions....... I hope your not paying this 'online' coach!!!!
+1
I get that there is more than one way to train and I try to keep am open mind, but, jeez, I don't think any legitimate sprint coach would defend these workouts as they are put together.
jdarez786 wrote:
Can you come with irrefutable evidence to show that a person starting from being reasonably athletic can or cannot break the 11 second barrier without consistent proper training?
My HS has a great coach, and we're one of the faster teams in the area. Out of the 100 or so boys in the team, only 1-2 break 11 FAT each year.
The thread in the earlier post had it right. Low 12s wind legal FAT and 11.9 wind aided FAT is about what you'd expect from an average dude in his late 20s or early 30s.
Almost every post is going to say you cannot do it.
But you could enjoy the ride towards this goal. First you might have some smaller goals to achieve on the way to your big goal.
1. Be able to increase the number of skips in one minute of jump roping.
2. Be able to lower your time running a short hill. Maybe every other week have someone
time you on a hill of between 50-100 meters. You might have him time you ten times that day.
3. Run a lot of down hill striders. Try to increase your pace.
4. Do bounding up hills.
5. Work with a sprint coach on acceleration.
6. Work with a sprint coach on improving running form.
Etc., Etc., Etc.,
...or even 8th grade gym-class-on-grass-with-sneakers.
jdarez786 wrote:
I do pay the coach and I'm happy with his services.
You paid for a coach and only managed a 13.8? Man, I need to start my own coaching business!
These shoes the best wrote:
Maybe every other week have someone
time you on a hill of between 50-100 meters. You might have him time you ten times that day.
Unless you're a parent of a 9 year old kid, who is going to be willing to time a 13.8 guy ten times a day for every other week?
jdarez786 wrote:
I firmly believe most people are deterred from sprinting by the genetics argument and don't even try. Sure, you're not going to go sub 10.8 without great genetics and sub 10 without 1 in a million genetics, but I do think training bio-mechanics, strength and maximizing your explosive ability, along with training smart and avoiding injury is enough to push a reasonably athletic individual to sub 11.
The argument that this is a distance runner only forum is the talk of Marathon runners and ultra-runners attempting to speak for all LetsRun posters. Some of us on LetsRun were tapped on the shoulder by head track & field coach and asked to get into the blocks and sprint a 200m/220yds. on occasion. Some of us on LetsRun were asked to race a 200m/220yd. leg on a relay on occasion.
I firmly agree the genetic argument is over stated on LetsRun regarding who should or should not sprint. What you have working against you in your quest for sub-11 100m is your age. Sprinting is mostly power and coordination. Coordination to hit a MLB fastball followed up by a Major League Baseball slow curve than followed up by a MLB hard slider is coordination which starts from one's youth. Same for tennis, ballet and violin.
If you have a son or daughter age five or so, get one or both of them going on a modified sprint program. If you have a son under age 12, you have a better chance of turning him into a sub-11 100m man over the next twenty-five years than yourself.
cite ur sources jd wrote:
jdarez786 wrote:
I trained for a grand total of 3 months, 2 of those months with an ankle that was at sub 80% strength.
During that time I went from 15.2sec to 13.88sec, that's almost 1.5sec in 3 months.
Again, those are mainly beginner gains and the result of a recovering ankle.
I'm pretty pragmatic and realistic, but don't ask me how, it just feels possible.
I firmly believe most people are deterred from sprinting by the genetics argument and don't even try. Sure, you're not going to go sub 10.8 without great genetics and sub 10 without 1 in a million genetics, but I do think training bio-mechanics, strength and maximizing your explosive ability, along with training smart and avoiding injury is enough to push a reasonably athletic individual to sub 11.
I didn't realize 10.9 was the dividing line. Thanks for pointing that out and backing it up with such overwhelming data.
He did cite his data.
"I firmly believe......"
It is called an opinion. You might check to see if you have one.
First of all, a slow 30 yr old can't run a sub 11. If that 30 year old can run sub 11 or even sub 12, he isn't slow.
Second, you're not 30 now and will be much older than 30 when you hit your lifetime PR.
What's past is past, but no amount of training would have gotten you to a sub 11. Sub 12 might have been possible if you started a decade ago. As for now? Just be happy if you can get a 12.99.
Set a more moderate goal... The IAAF tables equate 11 flat to a low 15's 5k and it would be absurd for a non-distance runner running 21 minutes to set 15:xx as their initial goal
Mmmmmm....... wrote:
@jdarez wrote:
Most people can not break 15 no matter how much they train.
This is a load of crap. Even a 40 year old obese woman can run 14.9 if she trains and loses that weight.
Sub 11 takes real talent, though. If you're just talking about young trained males, the percentiles would be:
Top 99%: 14.5
Top 95%: 14.0
Top 85%: 13.5
Top 65%: 13.0
Top 50%: 12.5
Top 30%: 12.0
Top 10%: 11.5
Top 1%: 11.0
I'm tempted to just say this is the stupidest thing ever posted here - and that is a LOT of stupidity. But please, provide us your documented cases of 40 year old obese women running 14.9. Not one or two, because I'm sure some woman somewhere can do it, but maybe ten examples, enough to prove your assertion.
jdarez786 wrote:
I do think training bio-mechanics, strength and maximizing your explosive ability, along with training smart and avoiding injury is enough to push a reasonably athletic individual to sub 11.
Even if this were true, you would have to start sprinting in your early teens, have access to world class facilities and coaching, and devote yourself to training for years. Diet and rest would have to be optimized, and steroids may be necessary as well.
As for your case right now? Forget it, you're 20 years too late.
@Mmmmmm.... wrote:
Mmmmmm....... wrote:
This is a load of crap. Even a 40 year old obese woman can run 14.9 if she trains and loses that weight.
Sub 11 takes real talent, though. If you're just talking about young trained males, the percentiles would be:
Top 99%: 14.5
Top 95%: 14.0
Top 85%: 13.5
Top 65%: 13.0
Top 50%: 12.5
Top 30%: 12.0
Top 10%: 11.5
Top 1%: 11.0
I'm tempted to just say this is the stupidest thing ever posted here - and that is a LOT of stupidity. But please, provide us your documented cases of 40 year old obese women running 14.9. Not one or two, because I'm sure some woman somewhere can do it, but maybe ten examples, enough to prove your assertion.
*meaning including after training and losing that weight.
JD
The videos are hard to review in real time so I suspect you're sending slowmo to your coach
From the initial visual, your start is incorrect and you're not driving out.
For your upright technique you need to work on drills for front side mechanics a lot!
I'd say you can get 1.5 sec faster than you currently are with correct drilling and sessions
jdarez786 wrote:
After 2yrs in the gym, I look pretty ripped and impressive too.
April '17 - 100m PB 15.2sec (HT)
February '18 - 100m PB 13.88 (freezing cold and bit of a headwind) (FAT)
I realize that I'm probably making beginner gains
You'll hit a wall once you get to the 12.7-12.9 range, if not before. There's a huge difference between sub 14 and sub 11.
13.88 is "run, fatty, run!"
10.99 done by someone who started training in his early 30s is Olympic-level talent.