I saw on Jim Walmsley his strava that his cadence is very often 158. Pretty low but he's a fast runner with a good running form
I saw on Jim Walmsley his strava that his cadence is very often 158. Pretty low but he's a fast runner with a good running form
I'm generally a "run natural" guy, and that means easy distance pace is run at 160 spm with a stride length in the 1.5m range. Warm ups are probably closer to 180/1.3m because my stride hasn't opened up yet. During workouts and races, I typically end up at around 180/1.7-1.8.
Putting it in perspective, I'm 5'8", 145, 44 years old, and a 15:30/2:30 guy.
But the thing is, I never paid attention to any of this. The only reason I know t is because when I got a new Garmin last September, the info was there to see.
I'm not concerned with cadence at all, but my Garmin always ends up showing a number really close to 180. When I run relatively faster and slower it's because my stride is longer or shorter.
This may surprise you.That 180 tempo is not related to how quickly you can pick your feet up and down, but how quickly you can perform vertical oscillations in your spine. To test this, look at your watch and run in place as quickly as you can for 1 minute. It's very easy to exceed 45 steps every 15 seconds which is a 180 tempo. Next, stand in front of a mirror with your arms crossed and your hands on your chest, and see how quickly you can vertically isolate your shoulders left right left right left right for 1 minute (left, right is 2 ocillations) You'll find the 180 is optimum for vertical spinal oscillations. Those oscillations are the core of human bipedal movement.
Ido wrote:
I say the whole issue with cadence is nonsense. People trying to force themselves into 180 cadence resulting unnatural choppy very short strides fatiguing themselves, running slower then they could have. High cadence is a result of fast running and good stamina, not the other way round.
I say one should not even deal or think about cadence at all. Instead try to improve your stride length by improving your technique and power, not by forcing a bigger stride, and with time when your stamina improves and you can go faster, your cadence will rise as a result of that.
But the question is: does running 180 spm make you fast, or do fast people run 180 spm? I do easy runs at 160 spm or below, and race 5Ks at 180 spm. Both my stride length and cadence increase as I go faster. I've tried to run with a higher cadence before on easy runs, but I can't do it without also speeding up a lot. Eventually I decided to stop worrying about it and run my easy runs easy and my races at race pace.
love my garmin anyway wrote:
But the question is: does running 180 spm make you fast, or do fast people run 180 spm? I do easy runs at 160 spm or below, and race 5Ks at 180 spm. Both my stride length and cadence increase as I go faster.
This is the same for me. There is almost no correlation between the cadence of the men running a world class 10,000m and some amateur on his daily jog. It's an apples and watermelons comparison.
I choose not to wrote:
Yep. This 180 nonsense is the same as Lance and his higher cycling cadence.
Of course we now know what "cycling" meant in this context.
Wisely dine. If you check out the link of the elites I attached, they run exactly the same as you- easy runs 160-170 spm. Competitive pace and higher speeds they climb to 180-190 spm
Ido wrote:
Wisely dine. If you check out the link of the elites I attached, they run exactly the same as you- easy runs 160-170 spm. Competitive pace and higher speeds they climb to 180-190 spm
But that's not what you are arguing. You are saying that 180 in general is too high and forces you to be choppy. It doesn't force you to be choppy. Many elites run higher than 180.
kdk wrote:
Ido wrote:Wisely dine. If you check out the link of the elites I attached, they run exactly the same as you- easy runs 160-170 spm. Competitive pace and higher speeds they climb to 180-190 spm
But that's not what you are arguing. You are saying that 180 in general is too high and forces you to be choppy. It doesn't force you to be choppy. Many elites run higher than 180.
It does if you are a slower athlete.
No, that is not what I'm saying. Read well. What I say is that both cadance and stride length grow according to your speed. Obviously when you run at 3 minutes per km and below, like the elites do, your cadence will be around 180 and above and your stride would not be choppy because it would also grow longer. However, running at low speed and forcing yourself to high cadence like in this video
causes you to be choppy and inefficient. This new trend that whatever speed you run you need to maintain at least 180 cadence is stupidity. And the claim that the elites always, even when easy running, maintain high cadence and just play with their stride length is a false claim.
Low speed- low cadence. High speed- high cadence.
I've attached many videos prooving that even the elites when easy running, have sub 180 cadence
I choose not to wrote:
Yep. This 180 nonsense is the same as Lance and his higher cycling cadence.
In cycling, (optimum) cadence is function of power output "watts"(not the other way around). 200=cadence70 300watts= 80 400watts=90 500 =100+ , roughly speaking. I can't remember off-hand how non-linear it gets after that. I would also add a +/- 5 to each dependending on morphology, long levers/limbs slightly lower optimum cadence. shorter levers/limbs slightly higher. Yes there are outliers to all of the above.
You're an idiot.
180 is the most efficient stride cadence. When you run slow your stride will be shorter, when you run fast it will be longer. That's how you speed up, not increasing cadence.
When you're at 180 and you're going faster your stride will open up behind you, instead of over-striding in front of you, like you're doing now.
Sprinting is a totally different kind of running, that's why your cadence picks up over 180 there.
BTW, what are your PRs? I am guessing shitty.
Well I guess Bekele, kipchoge are idiots too becuase when they run easy the have 165-170 cadence
Check out these kenyans' cadence at the recovery pace- I guess they are idiots too ha?
Tell kipchoge to lower his cadence from 192 to 180 when he runs the marathon, because 180 is the most "efficient"
Stupido OP wrote:
BTW, what are your PRs? I am guessing shitty.
They would be the same at 180 too.
Count Dibaba strides at 2:20-2:29 in this video.
She easy running at about 160 cadence. Tell her that she is not "efficient".
Case closed (again)
Ido wrote:
https://youtu.be/TDXxtZrJB_QBekele easy runing probably somewhere around 4km per minute at 168 cadence.
I rest my case.
The fastest I've run a 10k is only at 1km per minute.
We have a new relegion, a new God. The 180 relegion. Hail 180- you're the true God. Monkeys