Army's WCAP runners

I have no problem with naturalized citizens running for the USA. I am Meb's biggest fan--He is a wonderful example of what is great about America. My problem is the military running a track team-whether populated by foreign born citizens or native gringos. It's not unlike the USPS sponsoring Lance Armstrong. Why does a government agency have a sports marketing department.

I'd rather see a shoe company, or Microsoft, or Ford, or GE or whomever do it. The Army has enough on its plate-fighting wars and what not. The USPS has enough on its plate, losing packages and delivering junk mail and what not.

Here's the deal wrote:

I have no problem with naturalized citizens running for the USA. I am Meb's biggest fan--He is a wonderful example of what is great about America. My problem is the military running a track team-whether populated by foreign born citizens or native gringos. It's not unlike the USPS sponsoring Lance Armstrong. Why does a government agency have a sports marketing department.

I'd rather see a shoe company, or Microsoft, or Ford, or GE or whomever do it. The Army has enough on its plate-fighting wars and what not. The USPS has enough on its plate, losing packages and delivering junk mail and what not.

Well, the program is paying off now! The army have some great talents and they should have an equal opportunity to compete for their country like everyone else. I don't see why anyone should have any issue with it especially that it has been clarified that the program is not funded by your taxes.

Here's the deal wrote:

I have no problem with naturalized citizens running for the USA. I am Meb's biggest fan--He is a wonderful example of what is great about America. My problem is the military running a track team-whether populated by foreign born citizens or native gringos. It's not unlike the USPS sponsoring Lance Armstrong. Why does a government agency have a sports marketing department.

I'd rather see a shoe company, or Microsoft, or Ford, or GE or whomever do it. The Army has enough on its plate-fighting wars and what not. The USPS has enough on its plate, losing packages and delivering junk mail and what not.

fair. I don't think we should be paying for taxes for specific athletes to train as pros, unless all pros get a certain amount. But I don't think we should be allowing private corporations, like Nike, to say who can and cannot sponsor athletes either. Someone should be allowed to run in a singlet with a toyota logo or a mcdonalds logo, etc.

I wonder if a serviceman could have a second job as a pro athlete. Say someone gets fit while doing their duty and qualifies in a sport that the Army WCAP doesn't include. Are they allowed to take money from a corporate sponsor for performing their sport outside of their armed forces duties?

Lawi Lalang has joined the Army. Is he WCAP bound?

wcap wrote:

Lawi Lalang has joined the Army. Is he WCAP bound?

The number of Kenyans in the US Army is higher than you would expect. Most don't run competitively after college. Most can make a better living here in the states. So the Army is a way for them to stay in the states.

He's got the marks to run for WCAP.

The question you should ask is why aren't fast Americans joining the Army and joining WCAP?

Alan

Runningart2004 wrote:

wcap wrote:

Lawi Lalang has joined the Army. Is he WCAP bound?

The number of Kenyans in the US Army is higher than you would expect. Most don't run competitively after college. Most can make a better living here in the states. So the Army is a way for them to stay in the states.

He's got the marks to run for WCAP.

The question you should ask is why aren't fast Americans joining the Army and joining WCAP?

Alan

Why would they want/have to join the army? They do not have to change nationalities.

Here's the deal wrote:

I have no problem with naturalized citizens running for the USA. I am Meb's biggest fan--He is a wonderful example of what is great about America. My problem is the military running a track team-whether populated by foreign born citizens or native gringos. It's not unlike the USPS sponsoring Lance Armstrong. Why does a government agency have a sports marketing department.

I'd rather see a shoe company, or Microsoft, or Ford, or GE or whomever do it. The Army has enough on its plate-fighting wars and what not. The USPS has enough on its plate, losing packages and delivering junk mail and what not.

Agreed. It's shady and wrong. Kind of like the fact that the armed forces preys upon minorities.

muscles muscles wrote:

Runningart2004 wrote:

The number of Kenyans in the US Army is higher than you would expect. Most don't run competitively after college. Most can make a better living here in the states. So the Army is a way for them to stay in the states.

He's got the marks to run for WCAP.

The question you should ask is why aren't fast Americans joining the Army and joining WCAP?

Alan

Why would they want/have to join the army? They do not have to change nationalities.

Some are upset that WCAP Track and Field is mostly Kenyan. Without these former Kenyan athletes joining the Army, acquiring citizenship and joining the WCAP there would be no WCAP. How many college graduates with elite track and field marks are jumping at the chance to join the Army?

Alan

In 2016 there were 30+ US athletes in the 5k/10k who met the standards for WCAP. If you're upset that there aren't many US born runners in WCAP direct your anger at these guys not the guys who actually raised their hand to serve.

Alan

Maybe because they were born U.S. citizens and do not take advantage of a program that GIVES them expedited citizenship.

What a deal!!

You get a job with very low probability of active duty, benefits before and after service, ability to train on taxpayer dollars for years without any real consequences if they do not achieve minimum performance standards, trips worldwide where they can run as a U.S. entrant and treat it as a training run, a free trip to Kenya, and many more benefits largely paid for (unless you can document that pay is not funded as normal Army pay), ability to train as a group with compensated coaches and facilities.

And it the end not very impressive world class performances against the elite African runners.

Without the ease of gaining expedited citizenship there would probably be not any WCAP.

So end the funding for WCAP - now we all agree

It's an attempt to compete with all the foreign countries running programs they have. Many countries have had a system like this for many years. All the years of the Russian dopers, most of the athletes were in the army. They trained. That was their job. We now allow a Kenyan to become a U.S. citizen by joining the army, and be within the WCAP program. It's a win-win. The athletes get to become a U.S. citizen, and get formal training for a secure job in civilian life after. And, we get to build our military, and create a program that competes with others.

ARMY Money Wasted wrote:

Maybe because they were born U.S. citizens and do not take advantage of a program that GIVES them expedited citizenship.

What a deal!!

You get a job with very low probability of active duty, benefits before and after service, ability to train on taxpayer dollars for years without any real consequences if they do not achieve minimum performance standards, trips worldwide where they can run as a U.S. entrant and treat it as a training run, a free trip to Kenya, and many more benefits largely paid for (unless you can document that pay is not funded as normal Army pay), ability to train as a group with compensated coaches and facilities.

And it the end not very impressive world class performances against the elite African runners.

WCAP does not give expedited citizenship.

We've been through this. Please keep up. WCAP is an MWR programed funded through non appropriated funds. Not tax dollars.

WCAP also funds other Army sports (boxing is a big one).

Alan

Old thread. WCAP was hurting for quality runners for some time.

Alan

http://www.letsrun.com/forum/flat_read.php?thread=2677160

We're 17 trillion + in depth. Poor and homeless everywhere. Why the F are we wasting money on this crap? Let Nike, New Balance, Saucony, etc. pay to train Olympic athletes. Anybody who defends this program has no sense of financial responsibility.

ctj2018 wrote:

We're 17 trillion + in depth. Poor and homeless everywhere. Why the F are we wasting money on this crap? Let Nike, New Balance, Saucony, etc. pay to train Olympic athletes. Anybody who defends this program has no sense of financial responsibility.

I'm a broken record....

WCAP is not funded through tax payer dollars.

Alan

I'm a broken record....

WCAP is not funded through tax payer dollars.

I apologize, I missed this part: "WCAP is an MWR programed funded through non appropriated funds. Not tax dollars."

Non appropriated funds should be used to 1st) Support military personnel and families 2nd) Be given back to the taxpayer

It should not be used to support Olympic aspirations. They can get a job at Home Depot or run for one of the shoe companies that sponsor teams.

So all of the salaries and benefits paid to these hired guns are not paid as normal ARMY pay?

Provide proof that these "special" Army members get paid wages and benefits from a unique funding source.

Also are not all post Army benefits coming out of taxpayer dollars?

It is a program that should be terminated since there are better uses for taxpayer dollars that encouraging a network of Kenyan's to find an easy path to U.S. citizenship - I do agree that all enlistees are eligible for naturalization upon completion of basic training so many non-sports enlistees also benefit from this but they are also part of the active military force - not some special group that can milk the system for many years without delivering on their commitment to excellence (sub 2:15 marathon for example)

If they are not good enough to compete on a world class basis kick them out of program instead of rewarding mediocrity. Put term limits on this program or enforce the rules.

Redirect funds to needed skills - translators, special skills, and competencies that help protect and defend.

WCAP is also a recruiting tool. That benefits the Army as a whole. It's also a "good will", "good for morale" or whatever. These guys have to do more than "just run". It might not be in their MOS or Branch but they serve a purpose.

If you think the WCAP is a waste of non appropriated funds you have no idea how the military wastes actual tax payer dollars.

Regular pay and benefits is normal pay and funded through tax payer dollars.

Again, upset these guys aren't in the motorpool or doing random Army tasks? They aren't missing much.

If I were you I'd be more upset at the lowest bidder mentality in Army acquisitions. HMMWVs love to leak transmission fluid from the transfer case for no apparent reason.

So do most people here think the Army soldier just trains for war all the time? That's funny.

Alan