Jamaica's newest phenom Christopher Taylor rocked the "Champs" In Jamaica with 200/400 records

Unless you're making sport of me here, you're on Mon. Break out your Dashiki and Kufi and bring your drum. March is a great time to get out of the North and witness the event that is affectionately and simply known as ‘Champs’ ( the Boys and Girls Championships) in Kingston,

As for making track more interesting: Watching Shorter run a 10k whilst stoned to the bee-jesus on weed and beer on a hot Eugene afternoon made it much more compelling. He looked like a little wind-up toy out there. Good, clean, All-American fun I say. Now, approved for Baby Boomers who are the key demographic among track fans these days.Maybe T&FN can put on a tour on for this destination.

No one has responded to this - either to defend or to agree. None of us actually "know" this to be true. But what can be said with certainty is:

1) After being a near non-factor in T&F sprinting for nearly four decades - something changed suddenly across the entire Jamaican T&F complex about a decade or so ago. The demarcation is easily seen in going from no significant international medals, to dominating the medal stand and rewriting the record books. It happened and it's real. The only question is - why?

2) The Jamaican anti-doping program had been in a shambles for quite some time, with little testing actually happening. They were called out for this internationally, and the program was recently overhauled.

3) Thus far, despite the sudden surge of the entire complex - high school, college/club and pros - only lesser names and fading stars have been snagged in the testing. Yes, PEDs are on the island and have been used.

4) There's been actual discussion inside Jamaica regarding PEDs in the high school ranks, and ways to protect young runners from this. It's an interesting proposition in that competition in Jamaican high school T&F is FIERCE - with the recruiting of promising runners from a young age resembling the wildest days of NCAA basketball and football recruiting.- plus a lot of fuss because of the poaching of runners from other schools.

5) Last, there is the curious case of Usain Bolt and his secretive German doctor - Dr. Hans-Wilhelm Muller-Wohlfahrt - dubbed "Healing Hans", about whom ESPN tiled an article: Germany's Dr. Hans-Wilhelm Muller-Wohlfahrt - Either A Great Healer Or Quack With Hyperactive Syring

Here's some of what was written about him:

Everything I've written here can be confirmed by historical analysis of international competition results, reading Jamaican news articles and discussion forums, as well as reading British papers that cover the PED issue extensively.

4x4phreek wrote:

1) After being a near non-factor in T&F sprinting for nearly four decades - something changed suddenly across the entire Jamaican T&F complex about a decade or so ago. The demarcation is easily seen in going from no significant international medals, to dominating the medal stand and rewriting the record books. It happened and it's real. The only question is - why?

Americans were the leaders in T&F for decades. The lead was lost. Why? Other sports took center stage. Basketball and Football went from the fringe sports to dominance in the USA. Jamaica, similar. T&F became a focus point for athletes. Jamaicans care little for the USA sports of Football and Basketball.

2) The Jamaican anti-doping program had been in a shambles for quite some time, with little testing actually happening. They were called out for this internationally, and the program was recently overhauled.

The USA is the world leader in grey-zone performance helpers. They are far ahead of Jamaica because the USA has more resource$$$ available, and have the money to hire top lawyer$ to keep keep the wolves at bay.

3) Thus far, despite the sudden surge of the entire complex - high school, college/club and pros - only lesser names and fading stars have been snagged in the testing. Yes, PEDs are on the island and have been used.

See reply to (1). And, PEDs are rampant in the USA. The USA is #1 for use of illegal drugs in the World—heroin, cocaine, methamphetamines, marijuana, etc. are all banned and illegal but manage to sneak into the USA anyways.

4) There's been actual discussion inside Jamaica regarding PEDs in the high school ranks, and ways to protect young runners from this. It's an interesting proposition in that competition in Jamaican high school T&F is FIERCE - with the recruiting of promising runners from a young age resembling the wildest days of NCAA basketball and football recruiting.- plus a lot of fuss because of the poaching of runners from other schools.

See reply to (1).

5) Last, there is the curious case of Usain Bolt and his secretive German doctor - Dr. Hans-Wilhelm Muller-Wohlfahrt - dubbed "Healing Hans", about whom ESPN tiled an article: Germany's Dr. Hans-Wilhelm Muller-Wohlfahrt - Either A Great Healer Or Quack With Hyperactive Syring

Ever heard of NOP's special doctor, Jeffrey Brown?

Everything I've written here can be confirmed by historical analysis of international competition results, reading Jamaican news articles and discussion forums, as well as reading British papers that cover the PED issue extensively.

Why did you ignore the same for the good old USA?

6x6 extreme off-roader wrote:

Why did you ignore the same for the good old USA?

Is the the old 'unreliable' avoid-the-facts-I've-just-given-you, and point the finger elsewhere auto-quip?

Address the facts of my post with a clear statement and we can then move the conversation forward with any and every question you may have.That's how conversation works.

You did indeed point the finger elsewhere. It is the old way your sad country can compete. You need more than PEDS. The USA needs to abolish football and basketball. Then, the Yankees might be able to compete with a track-focused country like Jamaica.

Haven't you ever wondered why so many baseball phenoms come from the the tiny country of the Dominican Republic, a country of less than 10M people?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_current_Major_League_Baseball_players_by_nationality#Dominican_Republic

6x6 extreme off-roader wrote:

You did indeed point the finger elsewhere. It is the old way your sad country can compete. You need more than PEDS. The USA needs to abolish football and basketball. Then, the Yankees might be able to compete with a track-focused country like Jamaica.

Haven't you ever wondered why so many baseball phenoms come from the the tiny country of the Dominican Republic, a country of less than 10M people?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_current_Major_League_Baseball_players_by_nationality#Dominican_Republic

What the hell is this? It's never good to post when on drugs.

9x9 extreme stupidity wrote:

It's never good to post when on drugs.

Then, you take a break from posting until your mind clears up.

Interesting that only hours after I posted that, ESPN is running the 30 fo 30 9.79 special on Canadian-Jamaican sprinter Ben Johnson's dramatic improvement - and downfall - while on PEDs.

By analyzing the 100m record progression under Johnson, his outlier status against other top sprinters is very easy to see.

It should be noted that the only sprinter to have outlier status worse than Ben Johnson's improvement increments is - Usain Bolt. It's right there in the numbers. Just do the math.

I wonder just how many remember that Bolt was a 200m specialist very early in his career (and fast friends with fellow 200m specialist Wallace Spearmon), before improbably dropping down to not only run the shorter race, but dominate it in a way not seen since Ben Johnson.

YAWN!!!!

Bolt was also an outstanding 400m runner in HS. Or maybe, 45.35 for 400m (set in his last HS race) is not fast enough to be a specialist.

Ben Johnson is Canadian. Do you consider Matt Centrowitz to be American, or American-Ghanan?

6x6 extreme off-roader wrote:

Haven't you ever wondered why so many baseball phenoms come from the the tiny country of the Dominican Republic, a country of less than 10M people?

OK. No problem. You can't handle the facts. I get it. Just don't reply then. You're better offer seething in silence than going scatter shot with the accusations and deflections.

Oh - and you do yourself no favors by pointing about the Dominicans and their baseball success, because not only do you show ignorance of the 'baseball complex' down there, but you unwittingly support the case I've made about Jamaica.

It's well known that the competition to get off the island is fiercely intense in the Dominican Republic (not unlike Jamaican T&F and the push for college scholarships) because most know that if they're not found by MLB scouts while still in their teens, they're unlikely to ever make it out.

So PED use is started early and is rampant. It's why if you look at the MLB suspension list for PEDs, it's full of Dominican and Latin American players. Go look for yourself. PED use is all they've known, and to give it up while in the majors risks losing their earning power, so they continue to take the risks.

Now, as I asked you prior, if you want to continue the conversation, please return your attention to the five points I've made, and let's go from there. You, might even address a sixth point I've added about Bolt's historical outlier status.

??calabar?? wrote:

rabalac wrote:

[quote]rabalac wrote:

.

So, 'you' won't allow Taylor to run against them because he is too young and it wouldn't be 'fair'?

Did Taylor not beat him?

"...because not only do you show ignorance of the 'baseball complex' down there, but you unwittingly support the case I've made about Jamaica...."

Childish, on your part. But of course, Jamaica couldn't possible have a "track complex' "down there"? It can only be doping, not more. Meanwhile, the good old USA keeps losing great, young, track men to Football and Basketball. Jamaica could care less about those track-stealing Yankee sports.

6x6 extreme off-roader wrote:

YAWN!!!!

Bolt was also an outstanding 400m runner in HS. Or maybe, 45.35 for 400m (set in his last HS race) is not fast enough to be a specialist.

Nice. So now I get theatrical yawns - instead of real substance. As I said, I understand that you can't handle the facts.

And yes, you're helping make my point about Bolt with his 400m running. As I described, it's improbable for a long-legged 400/200 runner to drop down to shorter sprint races as he moves up in class against the world's best 100m specialists - and then dominate in the fashion he has. Now, I'm not seeing any discussion from you thus far about Bolt's outlier status - beyond even that of Ben Johnson...

...oh, and Ben Johnson is Jamaican-born (Falmouth, Jamaica).

6x6 extreme off-roader wrote:

Childish, on your part. But of course, Jamaica couldn't possible have a "track complex' "down there"? It can only be doping, not more. Meanwhile, the good old USA keeps losing great, young, track men to Football and Basketball. Jamaica could care less about those track-stealing Yankee sports.

You're still evading and deflecting. Worse, you look bad in calling me childish - yet you won't do the adult work of addressing the facts I've provided you.

As I suggested, it'd be better to just not post on this, so that you could then either continue to seethe in private, or actually do the adult work to come to terms with those facts.

Yes, American track athletes--not the creme of the crop who opt for other sports--can't compete against poor little, track-focused, Jamaica. It has to be PEDs.

4x4phreek wrote:

Scamaica wrote:

Boy do they start doping young down there

No one has responded to this - either to defend or to agree. None of us actually "know" this to be true. But what can be said with certainty is:

1) After being a near non-factor in T&F sprinting for nearly four decades - something changed suddenly across the entire Jamaican T&F complex about a decade or so ago. The demarcation is easily seen in going from no significant international medals, to dominating the medal stand and rewriting the record books. It happened and it's real. The only question is - why?

.

You need to educate yourself on the history of Jamaica in sprinting before you come on here talking garbage. You just make yourself look (even more) foolish by opening your 'argument' with a statement that Jamaica has been a "near non-factor in T&F sprinting for nearly four decades. Read below and learn.

tunapuna wrote:

You need to educate yourself on the history of Jamaica in sprinting before you come on here talking garbage. You just make yourself look (even more) foolish by opening your 'argument' with a statement that Jamaica has been a "near non-factor in T&F sprinting for nearly four decades. Read below and learn.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Athletics_in_Jamaica

This article just reinforces the fact that Jamaica has had an explosion of medals in the 2000s. It not only doesn't pass the sniff test, it's already been all over the news. Most of their top sprinters have already been busted.

They're a joke!

tunapuna wrote:

You need to educate yourself on the history of Jamaica in sprinting before you come on here talking garbage. You just make yourself look (even more) foolish by opening your 'argument' with a statement that Jamaica has been a "near non-factor in T&F sprinting for nearly four decades. Read below and learn.

Welcome to the discussion, tunapuna - and I commend you for starting directly with the first fact I gave when I entered the discussion!

Also, you will shortly learn that over the course of years of research I've educated myself about Jamaican T&F far more than you ever imagined. I'll ask you to "read and learn" as I discuss what I know. And thanks for the link, but that's just rudimentary reading compared to the many sources I've read that go far deeper than the high points that that article glosses.

Now to your main point of disagreement, here's the issue - you have to read what's written, not what you thought you read. What I wrote is this (with emphasis now added):

"1) After being a near non-factor in T&F sprinting for nearly four decades - something changed suddenly across the entire Jamaican T&F complex about a decade or so ago."

You may have wrongly assumed I've included Jamaican exploits of the recent decade or so under my non-factor description. The four decade period I'm referring to runs roughly between the cluster of three Olympic Golds (400/4x400) won by Wint, McKenley and Rhoden from 1948 to 1952, up to the Olympic gold that Veronica Campbell-Brown won in 2004.

That win by Campbell-Brown kicked off the sudden change that I stated. How sudden a change?

Prior to 2004 Jamaican sprinters (men and women) had claimed just four Olympic golds in sprinting, with just one being at 200m or less (Don Quarrie, 200m) and that was in 1976. But in the past roughly 8 years - after a 28 year drought - Jamaicans have claimed 11 Olympic golds in sprint events along with a handful of world records.

The sudden change couldn't be any more stark than that. This is an anomaly in T&F and signals that something is amiss - and it extends far beyond Usain Bolt's outlier records progressions. The sports world hasn't seen this sudden a rise in winning Olympic Golds by a small country since the anabolic steroid fueled East Germans went from 9 Golds in 1968 to 40 and 47 in 1972 and 1976, respectively.

Those are facts.

Just to be clear, I am well-educated about the issue, and attacking me along that avenue won't be fruitful for you. So let's stick to the facts and try not to throw around terms such as "foolish" and "childish" where facts are better placed.

YAWN!!!!

0/10

Americans = Pure

Everyone = Cheater

This trolling game has been played much better by fools much smarter than you for many years on the LRC forums. You need to drop some PEDs to improve your score above 0.