Thoughts on Cheserek and Jenkins flying to Stanford and taking 2 spots only to jog

Curious if you booed the others that ran to hit a qualifier and didn't go all out or was it just the Oregon guys?

Are folks truly "outraged" that 2 college athletes paced 2 teammates to a qualifying mark for regionals in a college race?

Seriously? Other than trolling I have to guess that those with their panties in a bunch have never run at the elite level.

The two runners drawing the criticism just recently completed amazing races at indoors. They are required to get qualifying times, they had teammates that could use pacing.

What exactly is the problem?

They should have hammered an early season 10k so soon after indoors to what purpose exactly?

How many casual fans are sitting around to watch six consecutive 5ks and four 10ks? Stanford has created a great meet, but it isn't a spectator meet for the masses. I would not agree with you that there are plenty of other opportunities to jog a 10k elsewhere, especially that don't require juggling schedules later in the season. It's not our job to plan Oregon's season and tell them when to run a hard 10k. They have to qualify for regionals (another 10k that means nothing). Stanford put on a meet with a 10k. They signed up, ran easy to accomplish their goal, and that was it. Did anyone ever say they were going to chase a fast time? I understand the frustration if you paid to see them run. I would be frustrated too, but Andy Powell, Cheserek and Jenkins did not make the rule declaring they had to qualify for the regional 10k.

I agree that every team should have some meets during the season that matter. However,scheduling them is very very difficult. Unlike the vast majority of the teams there, Oregon is at least trying to do that, which again is one reason they ran easy in the Stanford 10k, which was not a scoring meet of any kind.

bigtool05 wrote:

I don't have a problem with it but they could have easily just gone to a local meet and done the same thing. 29:00 is basically a tempo run for those two.

i agree with this... it was unnecessary and almost as if they were trying to steal the spotlight a bit.

hayward102 wrote:

I would not agree with you that there are plenty of other opportunities to jog a 10k elsewhere, especially that don't require juggling schedules later in the season.

It's not our job to plan Oregon's season and tell them when to run a hard 10k. They have to qualify for regionals (another 10k that means nothing). Stanford put on a meet with a 10k. They signed up, ran easy to accomplish their goal, and that was it. Did anyone ever say they were going to chase a fast time?

You've completely missed where I've addressed these concerns.

-There are plenty of other opportunities. They host meets at Hayward, why not put a 10k in there at the end of a meet? Lots of meet around the west coast have 10ks. OR, as I already said, just register for the second heat at Stanford and get your qualifier. That way you don't put out any other deserving athletes and you don't make your program look as bad. It also helps fans, PAYING FANS, understand that they aren't there to win, just to get a mark.

-I understand it's not our job to plan out Oregon's schedule. AS I MENTIONED ALREADY, they could have just jumped in heat 2. Plus, the excuse you used saying "Did anyone ever say they were going to chase a fast time?" is maddening for the fact that we, sadly, can't assume that they are going to run fast, whether that means a fast time or to win the RACE.

Is there no point in this whole season where we are going to do something to grow a fan base? Is the only thing we as coaches care about is our own team?? Are we as incapable as we seem of looking beyond our own group of kids for what's best in the long run for the entire sport!? We are such ain impressively incompetent bunch if we ignorantly believe that we can host meaningless time trials all spring and magically see fans in the stands (stands which don't always exist because the smart ADs know they aren't necessary, since track doesn't have fans).

You can justify the actions of coaches like Powell all day but, in the end, these tactics and decisions have far-reaching consequences and until we can grow up and do things that ARE hard for the common interest of all track fans and athletes we will never dig ourselves out of this financial and public-interest black hole in which track and field exists and operates.

Here might be a partial solution.

NCAA elects to do what the IAAF just started doing a couple years back.

Top 15 runners at NCAA XC get the auto qualifier to the NCAA track regionals.

Better yet, top-15 get byes straight through to the NCAA championships.

cbenson4 wrote:

bigtool05 wrote:

I don't have a problem with it but they could have easily just gone to a local meet and done the same thing. 29:00 is basically a tempo run for those two.

i agree with this... it was unnecessary and almost as if they were trying to steal the spotlight a bit.

I think the point was more they were pacing 2 others where low 29s was much more work for them. It seems conditions might have also played a role in the venue.

I'm also curious what time would have made those upset feel better? An earlier poster made a comment that they could have at least blasted the last lap, but I think that would have actually generated even more angst if they had done that.

Card Nall, I agree with a lot of your general points about engaging fans, but we'll just have to disagree on some of the specifics and how they apply to this race. Stanford is the one that set up this distance carnival meet. I'm confused why you're bashing the coaches of one of the few schools that actually try to engage their home fan base because Stanford hosted what is basically a time trial/qualifier for a lot of distance athletes. The goal of a lot of the athletes was to qualify for regionals. It just so happens that for most of them, that is a harder effort. 10ks at either of the two home meet options in Eugene don't really make sense because they are either right before Pac-12s or conflict with other big meets. It seems to me that you're mostly upset that you had to watch them run a qualifying race at Stanford, but are asking them to go do the same thing somewhere else at another time.

i just wanted to see a good race from them, seeing as how Flotrack hyped it up and all that. i was just disappointed.

coach d wrote:

There is no "distance running" in track and field. What just happened is why the best thing we can do to make track and field more popular is to get rid of distance (not mid-) events like the Europeans are doing. Let them run road races like the rest of the fitness joggers. Or have them run "distance carnivals" that nobody gives a damn about, like Mt. Sac does.

People who pull crap like the 10000 don't deserve to be out there.

The 10,000m is my favorite event, and I agree it is dead, precisely because of the joggerfests.

When I see these things, then I wish they were gone.

cbenson4 wrote:

i just wanted to see a good race from them, seeing as how Flotrack hyped it up and all that. i was just disappointed.

I'm curious what would have satisfied you? Given that indoors were what 3 weeks prior, did you really think they would hammer a 10k at this kind of meet?

The year before didn't they basically run a qualifier (though faster , I remember 28:30ish but i might be mistaken). Odds are they would have done that this time but were probably asked, or volunteered to help pace their teammates to help them qualify, as one guy set a PR he might not have been able to go much faster than what they ran.

One certainty is that no one connected to the defending indoor and outdoor national champions gives a sh1t what coach Doosh thinks

rojo wrote:

Why would anyone be bothered by it?

The meet is the equivalent of a heat at USAs. No one gets upset when people don't go all out in a heat. You simply do what you need to do to qualify.

The outrage actually though is interesting. It to me shows why track and field isn't more popular. ONe of the inherent things about the sport - that most people don't really seem to get - is most meets are nothing more than exhibitions/practice.

Jenkins and Cheserek aren't really racing. THey are practicing. Yes in most meets, people are racing all out but really the results are almost 100% totally insignificant until you get to a championship say NCAAs, USA, Worlds.

Pre-season football isn't real popular. Nor is pre-season track.

How about fans who paid to attend the meet? I know several who were upset. BTW, they told me they'd never heard such booing and heckling at a track meet. This is exactly why the sport isn't more popular. Fans see that the two big distance stars of Oregon are schedule to "compete", they fight Friday holiday traffic to get to the meet, pay their entrance fee, and then witness them doing a workout.

I should add that the fans who come to this meet know that it's largely an exercise in qualifying and/or running fast, and not just about "racing" or "competing, but they could have scheduled a 10,000 in Eugene if they just wanted to put in the least effort possible.

BTW, I know you're referring to the NFL, but there is no pre-season NCAA football, just as there isn't for NCAA track.

Like other people have been saying, anyone who went to Stanford expecting to see Jenkins and Ches racing for the win or anything besides an easy qualifying time is an idiot and knows nothing about track.

They also can't just schedule a 10k for themselves, the NCAA has rules about what determines a qualifying meet. Better to just send your 4 runners to a meet where they're guaranteed to hit the time you want and be done with it early on

what is the issue? wrote:

Are folks truly "outraged" that 2 college athletes paced 2 teammates to a qualifying mark for regionals in a college race?

Seriously? Other than trolling I have to guess that those with their panties in a bunch have never run at the elite level.

The two runners drawing the criticism just recently completed amazing races at indoors. They are required to get qualifying times, they had teammates that could use pacing.

What exactly is the problem?

They should have hammered an early season 10k so soon after indoors to what purpose exactly?

To entertain the spectators who were paying to watch the races.

Just get rid of the NCAA and turn all track professional - prize money, sponsors, the whole 9 yards. The public doesn't care what school wins what titles. But they might care what individual goes fast.

Almost every sport NCAA dominates turns to dust. Only football really thrives professionally. Hockey, baseball, soccer, are all marginal college sports because their pro system is robust and includes college-age athletes. FC Dallas, for example, has 13 players age 23 or younger, over half the roster. Four are under 20.

From the Oregon Ducks meet preview info

"Oregon’s 10,000-meter runners will be in action at the Stanford Invitational, Friday, looking to position themselves in NCAA Regionals qualifying position."

http://www.goducks.com/ViewArticle.dbml?SPSID=4367&SPID=243&DB_LANG=C&DB_OEM_ID=500&ATCLID=209997987

Stanford is not Payton Jordan.

I don't remember anyone caring when Derrick ran like 28:45 at Stanford when he was clearly in sub 28 shape.

This is called good coaching. These guys obviously race well when it matters and there is a reason for that. Some of you are losing interest in the sport because of how athletes choose to race in a time trial qualifier meet? I'd lose interest if they had to go to the well for 4 10k races this season and bombed nationals as a cost.

doo doo wrote:

Some of you are losing interest in the sport because of how athletes choose to race in a time trial qualifier meet? I'd lose interest if they had to go to the well for 4 10k races this season and bombed nationals as a cost.

Qualifier for what?

They "race" the same way in the nationals.

And they are............................... BORINGGGGGGGG