Does mental toughness really matter?

Quote from Herb Elliott, Australian miler:

"I believe you must train intensely. There's been a tendency these days to be overawed by the scientific explanations of why long slow running or interval training is the answer. Both are probably physiologically and biologically defensible but what they neglect is the spiritual and mental side of a person. If you emphasise the physical side of training you may become superbly conditioned but mentally not advanced at all. On the other hand, if you concentrate on the mental aspect it is inevitable that the physical side will follow.

My golden rule is to train for the mental toughness and don't train for the physical development. I used to have one day off a week but four of my other six runs would be excruciatingly intense and challenging. About half-way in each of the runs your body would be telling you to ease off, slow down or even stop and you've got to confront and grapple with that challenge.

Throughout my athletic career I'd wake in the morning and think: 'Oh God, I've hard training session tonight' and I'd work all day dreading the thought. Sometimes I'd and say to myself: 'Bugger it, I'll have an easy run'. But inevitably something inside made me run it hard anyway.

There's been a tendency to move away from the tenacity and intensiveness in training and I think anyone who does train that way will have an incredibly distinct mental advantage over someone who doesn't."

Dude, mental toughness is EVERYTHING. It separates the winners from the contenders. You obviously don't have it.

If mental toughness impacts our performance in training, why would it not at least play some role in our performance during races? Particularly longer races.

There are lots of races where we see it play a role. Look at men's Boston win. Just the confidence to get out there and go for it is a manifestation of what you're talking about. Or Rudisha's 800m in London. That was an incredibly talented field he ran against. Taking it out like he did was super-ballsy. Or watch Andrew Lloyd's 5000m Commonwealth run over Ngugi.

Part 1

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x8AwxlXPK3c

Part 2

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KXV68wJw1Gc

Hard to believe Elliott wasn't tough enough to do doubles.

Psychobabble wrote:

Brad Wigins wrote:

Physiology determines your total capacity for work.

Psychology determines what percentage of that capacity you utilize.

Psychology is physiology. Your brain made of biological matter and is not some superficial out-of-body thing. Your brain does what it does. There is no "choosing" mental toughness. We're meat puppets. Accept it or please explain to me how "you" make a synapse fire in your brain.

I agree that psychology is physiology. However, I also think that, like other skills involved in sports, you can train to make staying mentally tough more automatic. Staying tough at the end of a race is a form of delayed gratification. Just like you can train yourself to avoid bad foods or work for good grades, you can train yourself to stay tough at the end of races.

Unless your self-regulatory skills are really poor, this won't make a huge difference in terms of time, but it could easily be (and often is) the difference between first and second.

I understand what your saying, but how do we know it's not the physiology of these kids which gives them a certain advantage in rough train.

wtfunny wrote:

If mental toughness impacts our performance in training, why would it not at least play some role in our performance during races? Particularly longer races.

There are lots of races where we see it play a role. Look at men's Boston win. Just the confidence to get out there and go for it is a manifestation of what you're talking about. Or Rudisha's 800m in London. That was an incredibly talented field he ran against. Taking it out like he did was super-ballsy. Or watch Andrew Lloyd's 5000m Commonwealth run over Ngugi.

Part 1

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x8AwxlXPK3c

Part 2

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KXV68wJw1Gc

Thanks for your that. Yea I can't really argue with those performances. you have Really good point.

Moe's Tavern wrote:

Dude, mental toughness is EVERYTHING. It separates the winners from the contenders. You obviously don't have it.

Haha, you wanna race me man?

wtfunny wrote:

yyy wrote:

maybe. maybe not. depends.

^ = a great example of lack of mental toughness. :)

lol Great example of high class lrc humor.

For me mental toughness is the ability to quiet your body's feedback [pain].

Think: could you run any faster if a lion was chasing you and the slowest person would die?

You would probably stop listening to your body's feedback until you literally keeled over from exhaustion. So imagine a lion is coming for you

الرجل wrote:

wtfunny wrote:

Mental toughness has a lot to do with it; mental toughness is a huge factor in how hard one trains, for example. As such, it definitely helps shape what we call 'talent'.

I completely agree mental toughness in willingness to train. But I was referring to a race only. Like I don't believe heart makes much of a difference in a race.

How can you say heart doesn't make a difference in a race??

If there are two equally talented and physically strong runners in a race, the one with the most heart and drive, will be the one who wins.

No wonder you do bad in your races. Heart is what makes the racer.

Elliott wrote:

Quote from Herb Elliott, Australian miler:

Throughout my athletic career I'd wake in the morning and think: 'Oh God, I've hard training session tonight' and I'd work all day dreading the thought. Sometimes I'd and say to myself: 'Bugger it, I'll have an easy run'. But inevitably something inside made me run it hard anyway."

Compare that to Daniel Komen. When he was asked whether he dreaded an upcoming race he didn't understand the meaning of the question (he did understand English though). Being afraid before a race was a thing he never had considered.

To know the exerted mental effort you have to know the physically possible maximal effort. Which is not possible. That means you will have all kinds of combinations of being mentally tough/weak and fast/slow. Komen was slightly retarded, mentally strong, and extremely fast. Contrast this to Herb Elliot who was kinda smart, mentally weak (always fearing the workouts) but also extremely fast.

Similarly you can have runners who are retarded, mentally weak and extremely slow, just like Bad Wigins.

Runlikecaleb wrote:

الرجل wrote:

I completely agree mental toughness in willingness to train. But I was referring to a race only. Like I don't believe heart makes much of a difference in a race.

How can you say heart doesn't make a difference in a race??

If there are two equally talented and physically strong runners in a race, the one with the most heart and drive, will be the one who wins.

No wonder you do bad in your races. Heart is what makes the racer.

I mean I didn't say it was completely useless I just think it's over-blown. And I don't always do bad in races haha. As to your last statement, I believe your over-simplifying it. I think two physiologically equal runners would happen only very rarely. Even if two people the same PR's, their ability will oscillate from day to day due lurking variables we don't know about, because of this I think "heart"is used to fill in these variables, which would be a problem because then it's not actually heart.

الرجل wrote:

Every time I run bad in a race my coach yells at me for being mentally weak. Fed up, I told him that mental toughness is a myth and your body will always run to its ability which may have been lacking in that day. What do you guys think about this . Is there any evidence that people have different levels of heart in a race?

Seriously, you are 98% right. Mental toughness is the MOST OVER RATED trait in racing. Believe me, When I raced I burned competitors at the end of runs, and later in life I was killed at the end of runners. Mental toughness had nothing to do with it.

Now mental toughness in training has a bigger role.

(PS your coach was WRONG and STUPID to tell you that. He could be a good guy in other ways but don't let him get into your head!)

I'm glad someone sees eye to eye with me.

We cannot outrun our fitness. However, mental resolve has two applications: providing the will to suffer in traiNing, and allowing one to persevere late in runs when the stride deteriorates.

I've never heard of any successful elite runner who wasn't mentally tough. Can you push yourself so hard as this poster?

malmo wrote:

Once a Bum wrote:

Hey Malmo,

What I'm getting at is, how often did you workout so hard that you found yourself recovering in bed in the fetal position? Weekly? Monthly?

Fetal position frequency? After every race, and perhaps once every 10-15 days or so after a hard training session.

Excellent delivery. I laughed.

the lolz all up in it wrote:

variety is the spice of life wrote:

Compare that to Daniel Komen. When he was asked whether he dreaded an upcoming race he didn't understand the meaning of the question (he did understand English though). Being afraid before a race was a thing he never had considered.

To know the exerted mental effort you have to know the physically possible maximal effort. Which is not possible. That means you will have all kinds of combinations of being mentally tough/weak and fast/slow. Komen was slightly retarded, mentally strong, and extremely fast. Contrast this to Herb Elliot who was kinda smart, mentally weak (always fearing the workouts) but also extremely fast.

Similarly you can have runners who are retarded, mentally weak and extremely slow, just like Bad Wigins.

Excellent delivery. I laughed.

me to