This is it folks - Mary Cain is the greatest high school distance runner we have ever seen

this is it folks.... wrote:

We are witnessing history here, hold on for the ride!

I agree. But lets not confuse Queen Mary's career to past male greats. It's male vs. male and female vs. female. Two seperate areas to argue about.

Nope. No sir. No way. wrote:

Haymitch Abernathy wrote:

Delusional. Mary Cain, at the distances she specializes in, is better than Jordan Hasay right now.

Balderdash!

Look at the PR's

Hasay 800 2:08.32(2012) Cain 1:59.51

Hasay 1500 4:10.28(2011) Cain 4:04.62

Hasay Mile(i) 4:33.01(2011) Cain 4:28:25

Hasay 3K(i) 8:57.46 (2013) Cain 9:04.51

She's outstanding, but I hope she and her coaches develop her talent gradually. Don't try to rush her, certainly don't push her to jump right into the Pro world like Webb did.

She's excellent, but still has a ways to go to be an world elite, and she's gotta learn how to handle herself.

I would say she's not ready for the world champs, and we probably shouldn't even have unrealistic expectations for Worlds in 2015.

2016 should be the goal, and the next three years devoted to careful planning, training, and preparation, with an eye for overtraining and overracing.

I think, if she and her team play it smart and don't try to push her as some phenom on a meteoric rise, and just treat her like any other runner with talent, she could be a world beater by then.

Mary Cain is a phenom. But to call her a high school runner is inaccurate. She doesn't run for a high school team. Ryun, Webb, and Gallagher did. She's a pro in every respect but the paycheck.

Brianruns10 wrote:

She's outstanding, but I hope she and her coaches develop her talent gradually.

You've got to be kidding me

Some have a point, in that she is training under an elite coach and not even doing standard high school workouts, but some people just advance faster than others. She's no different than the smart kid who takes college level classes in high school, or works summer jobs as an intern at Apple or Google because of their deep understanding.

Shouldn't runners get the same kind of opportunities as people who advance in other fields quicker than their peers?

she's the best hands down. and people need to stop complaining that she is getting better coaching or whatever, she's the best HSer ever and by the time she is 18 she's gonna be able to compete against some of the best in the world, so she should be getting great coaching right now in HS.

also, anyone else feel like Ajee Wilson was very smart in going pro last year as she will probably be a lot less marketable now that a younger American runner who has a MUCH bigger range is now probably a couple years of improvement ahead of Ajee IN HER OWN EVENT! Ajee may be the (now) 3rd fastest 800 HS runner of all time but she is an afterthought to Cain and it's only one of Cain's 3, probably soon to be 4, outstanding events (8/15/3k/5k).

she's made people forget Hasay, Barringer, Bowman, Uceny and others this year. Its obvious.

But,I can't really say if Cain is more marketable since marketability has a lot to do with attractiveness too. Maybe salazar can do something about her hunched over posture, not just while running either.

but yeah, speed is good, but marketability factors in attractiveness too, and ability to relate. Other high school girls won't be able to relate to Cain as much because she has special circumstances and arrangements atypical from most high schoolers.

Additionally, Ajee wilson wasn't chasing women of that calibre in the races.

I think other girls could run a lot faster if they were being pulled along, maybe not as fast as 1:59.5, but definitely 2 to 3 seconds faster than their fastest time in a high school only race would be.

She is the greatest "female" high schooler of all time.

crazy raisin wrote:

How preeminent we are and how soon we forget the past.

Webb's run for 4th, almost 3rd, behind El G and Lagat in 2001 was far, far better than Cain's run today. And he's not the best either - Ryun was an Olympic finalist at Cain's age. Let us give Cain another year to improve more before we start that comparison, please.

Webb was 10 seconds off the WR. The equivalent would be around 11.5 seconds off the WR. Cain is close....eliminate those sketchy Chinese records and her time is more impressive. That's if you consider those records any more suspect than EL G's.

Scott57 wrote:

Mary Cain is a phenom. But to call her a high school runner is inaccurate. She doesn't run for a high school team. Ryun, Webb, and Gallagher did. She's a pro in every respect but the paycheck.

Really? . . . You said that? That paycheck thing is kinda important to the definition of Pro.

ddBguyj2013 wrote:

But,I can't really say if Cain is more marketable since marketability has a lot to do with attractiveness too. Maybe salazar can do something about her hunched over posture, not just while running either.

Great point, which is what's so exciting about a prospect like Cain. That her form needs work, suggests she has another level in her, another gear of speed to attain, that there is still a lot of room for improvement, which is huge given what she's already done.

My doubts tend to be greater for those who come already highly refined. It tells me their future training will be more micro adjustments, and they're much more likely to plateau because they've already developed to full maturation in terms of form, strength, stamina, etc.

ummm . . . wrote:

Scott57 wrote:

Mary Cain is a phenom. But to call her a high school runner is inaccurate. She doesn't run for a high school team. Ryun, Webb, and Gallagher did. She's a pro in every respect but the paycheck.

Really? . . . You said that? That paycheck thing is kinda important to the definition of Pro.

Though to be fair, I know I guy who's called himself a professional runner, and he hasn't earned sh*t racing. He just is able to run full time because his parents subsidize his lifestyle and pay for his entire fitness team. That and he's deluded beyond compare.

If Cain makes the World Championship team and if she makes the finals in Moscow than she stands ahead of Ryun as the greatest high school distance runner in American history. That's my opinion.

crazy raisin wrote:

How preeminent we are and how soon we forget the past.

Webb's run for 4th, almost 3rd, behind El G and Lagat in 2001 was far, far better than Cain's run today. And he's not the best either - Ryun was an Olympic finalist at Cain's age. Let us give Cain another year to improve more before we start that comparison, please.

Webb's run was 10 sec off a less-contested WR

Cain's run was 11 sec off a the commonly raced 1500 WR

I wouldn't say that Webb's was far, far better

wrtwsfws wrote:

crazy raisin wrote:

How preeminent we are and how soon we forget the past.

Webb's run for 4th, almost 3rd, behind El G and Lagat in 2001 was far, far better than Cain's run today. And he's not the best either - Ryun was an Olympic finalist at Cain's age. Let us give Cain another year to improve more before we start that comparison, please.

Webb's run was 10 sec off a less-contested WR

Cain's run was 11 sec off a the commonly raced 1500 WR

I wouldn't say that Webb's was far, far better

Wait, what's the world record in the women's 1500 again?

ddBguyj2013 wrote:

But,I can't really say if Cain is more marketable since marketability has a lot to do with attractiveness too. Maybe salazar can do something about her hunched over posture, not just while running either.

but yeah, speed is good, but marketability factors in attractiveness too, and ability to relate. Other high school girls won't be able to relate to Cain as much because she has special circumstances and arrangements atypical from most high schoolers.

You don't work in marketing, do you? Ms. Cain's incredibly likeable, effervescent, bubbly. She's having fun every time she's on the track. She's much more likeable and open than runners like Hasay and Flanagan. The imperfect posture only makes her more human.

People want to cheer for someone like themselves. Mary Cain is the Jamaican bobsled team or Eddie the Eagle but successfully competing to win. She's about as marketable as they come.

I'm interested in knowing how much Salazars advice has helped this season, or if she was already in line to do what she had done based off of what she did to get where she was last year.