Olympic Trials "A" vs Olympics "A" Explained for German Fernandez

Sorry Yogi! That was then. This is now. This time out you can NOT chase the standards after the conclusion of the Olympic Trials. That was messy and likely the reason it is not happening. Mr Obvious was correct. You are correct abut the past, but not the current approach. Also an athlete must participate in the Olympic Trials to move forward. No sitting out allowed. My first OT volunteer shift is tomorrow. :-)From Eugene,KiowaVT

yogibear wrote:

Mr. Obvious wrote:

Before anybody asks, No, you cannot chase the standard after the Trials.

Yes, you can.

In 2004 Suzy Favor Hamilton had the Olympic A standard, and nobody else had even the B. Suzy sits out the Olympic trials thinking her A gets her in. She's right, as long as nobody gets a B, or somebody gets an A.

Carrie Tollefson wins the trials (Toomey 2nd, Rudolph 3rd). Tollefson then goes to Europe to chase the B standard. She gets it (4:06.30 in Belgium) which punches her ticket to Athens, and bumps Suzy. Tollefson (and Toomey and Rudolph) never get the A, so Suzy stays home.

So what happens in the following situations:

Country has 1 B and 1 A?

Country has 1 B and 2 As?

can you send 2 and 3 athletes, respectively? Or if you send ONE athlete with the A standard, all others must also have the A?

fadsfadsf wrote:

So what happens in the following situations:

Country has 1 B and 1 A?

Country has 1 B and 2 As?

can you send 2 and 3 athletes, respectively? Or if you send ONE athlete with the A standard, all others must also have the A?

1. Country can send either the A athlete or the B athlete, but not both.

2. Country can send either the 2 A athletes or the B athlete.

Yeah German. Great run yesterday.

GF took almost two seconds off his season best in one day. He has eleven days before the first heat of the mens 1500m. I for one believe he can run under 3:35.50 at the trials. I do not believe GF will allow a wait, sit and kick final. He and DS know it's the long drive out that will be his best change to make the team.

GO GF.

Mr. Obvious wrote:

Before anybody asks, No, you cannot chase the standard after the Trials.

False, this is up to the USATF. They've allowed it before and can do it again with no notice.

Nottrue wrote:

False, this is up to the USATF. They've allowed it before and can do it again with no notice.

This seems to me somewhat like saying to someone who mentions cocaine is illegal, "False, this is up to the US Government. They've allowed it before and they might change their minds." Why not operate under the assumption that the current stated rules will hold up in the future, just to be safe?

Nottrue wrote:

Mr. Obvious wrote:

Before anybody asks, No, you cannot chase the standard after the Trials.

False, this is up to the USATF. They've allowed it before and can do it again with no notice.

The qualifying window ends July 1 at the latest, pending your event.

Chasing has been a bit open ended in the past. The rules are more definitive this time.

Obviously, rules like this are confusing, even for those of us who follow track closely. I wouldn't argue that these rules are responsible for tracks lack of popularity, but it sure doesn't help.

yogibear wrote:

Mr. Obvious wrote:

Before anybody asks, No, you cannot chase the standard after the Trials.

Yes, you can.

In 2004 Suzy Favor Hamilton had the Olympic A standard, and nobody else had even the B. Suzy sits out the Olympic trials thinking her A gets her in. She's right, as long as nobody gets a B, or somebody gets an A.

Carrie Tollefson wins the trials (Toomey 2nd, Rudolph 3rd). Tollefson then goes to Europe to chase the B standard. She gets it (4:06.30 in Belgium) which punches her ticket to Athens, and bumps Suzy. Tollefson (and Toomey and Rudolph) never get the A, so Suzy stays home.

--Bitch.

Qualifying window:

Men's and Women's Marathon - January 1, 2011 - January 14, 2012. Marathon standards must be met on an IAAF approved course (PDF).

Men's 50km Race Walk - January 1, 2011 - June 17, 2012. Race Walk standards must be met on a 2011 IAAF approved course (PDF) or a 2012 IAAF approved course(PDF).

10,000m and Combined Events - January 1, 2011 - July 1, 2012 or the end of the athlete's individual event at the 2012 Olympic Team Trials - Track & Field, whichever comes first.

All Other Individual Track & Field Events - May 1, 2011 - July 1, 2012 or the end of the athlete's individual event at the 2012 Olympic Team Trials - Track & Field, whichever comes first.

Yeah German. Great run yesterday.

GF took almost two seconds off his season best in one day. He has eleven days before the first heat of the mens 1500m. I for one believe he can run under 3:35.50 at the trials. I do not believe GF will allow a wait, sit and kick final. He and DS know it's the long drive out that will be his best change to make the team.

GO GF.

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Exactly! German should be aiming for that time or even faster! If he comes away from the Trials with an improved PB, then it was totally worth it. Sure, faster is better but realistically, that should be within his reach at his current level of fitness. Where he goes from there is anyone's guess? If he comes away from the Trials with a massive PB, then it opens up his contract options and the deals that could be made. It will be very interesting to see what happens. So many guys have run faster at this point but do not have near the public profile that German does, which will be to his advantage.

With 11 days yet to go, he can get in some key workouts that are going to improve his speed and strength at least 3- 5% which will be enough to get him into the 3:35 range. But watch out! Injury is just on the horizon if he pushes it too much! Like eveyone else, he's got to play this thing just right to get the results he deserves from his body and legs! I hope his coaching and home environment are stable enough and not requiring him to fly back and forth all over the damn place.

Best of Luck- Go GF!

What happens if a "B" standard athlete wins Trials? Do the A standard atheltes stay home then?

Track & Field

a. In the event that a non Olympic "A" standard athlete

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places in a position that would make the Olympic Team at the 2012 U.S. Olympic Team Trials – Track & Field – and there are two or more athlete candidates in the final of said event who have met the Olympic "A" standard, the nominations to the 2012 U.S. Olympic Team will be awarded to up to three (3) athletes, per gender, who have achieved the Olympic "A" standard, based on rank order of finish at the 2012 U.S. Olympic Team Trials – Track & Field. USATF must turn nominations over to the USOC on July 2 thus athletes must have met the Olympic standard by the end of their individual event at the Trials. There will be NO CHASING OF STANDARDS.

b. In the event that a non Olympic "A" standard athlete places in a position that would make the 2012 U.S. Olympic Team at the 2012 U.S. Olympic Team Trials – Track & Field and only one (1) athlete candidate in that event has met the "A" standard by the end of their individual event at the 2012 U.S. Olympic Team Trials – Track & Field, the highest placing athlete who has met either the "A" or "B" standard will be the nominee to the 2012 U.S. Olympic Team in that event. Please note that in this case only one (1) athlete and one (1) replacement athlete may be entered. The next highest placing finisher with an Olympic "A" or Olympic "B" standard will serve as the replacement athlete.

c. If no athlete(s) from the 2012 U.S. Olympic Team Trials – Track & Field has achieved the Olympic "A" standard by the conclusion of their individual event at the 2012 U.S. Olympic Team Trials – Track & Field, the highest place finisher at the 2012 U.S. Olympic Team Trials – Track & Field with the Olympic "B" standard will be the sole nominee to the 2012 U.S. Olympic Team in that event. The next highest placing finisher with the Olympic “B” standard will serve as the replacement athlete.

d. If no athlete(s) meet the Olympic "A" or "B" standards in a given event by the end of the respective qualification period, no athlete(s) will be nominated to the 2012 U.S. Olympic Team in that event.

If German were capable of 3:35.5 right now, then he would have been closer to Brian See in his first Indy race. He did better the next night because the pace was a little slower and he could draft off Bayer the final lap.

I'd say 3:37 or just a tad under is about his limit right now. Of course, he has a little over a week and has been improving steadily. He has surprised in the past and could do so again. I just think it's a little beyond him right now.

It will be a great experience for him, and maybe he can get in a few European races this year. I'd love to see him in a few 5k's this year.

Just to clarify- so in each event the US will send the top 3 guys at the trials who also have the Oly A standard? So if guys w/ the A finish 1-2-4 and #3 doesn't have the A and doesn't hit it at the trials, the 4th finisher would make the team?

Hulk wrote:

Just to clarify- so in each event the US will send the top 3 guys at the trials who also have the Oly A standard? So if guys w/ the A finish 1-2-4 and #3 doesn't have the A and doesn't hit it at the trials, the 4th finisher would make the team?

Yes. The USATF goal is to fill as many spaces as possible on the Olympic team as possible. The only way a B standard athlete will go is if there is only one A standard athlete and the B beats the A at the trials.

On a practical basis this means the only events at which a B qualifier has a shot at going are: Women's triple jump (zero A qualified athlete) and Heptathlon (one A qualified athletes). There is an outside shot in Women's javelin, men's triple jump, men's hammer, and decathlon, all of which have 2 A qualifiers. An injury to one of the A competitors could open the door for a B competitor there. All other events have at least 3 A standard athletes and although something could theoretically happen to more than one athlete it seems very unlikely.

My man! wrote:

So the question now becomes if those who have the OT standard, but not the OLY standard, do they plan on just making it into the finals, see who's left that needs it, and hopefully work together?

Look at Sir G. Jennings 4 years ago, ran like a champ and still it didn't happen.

Uphill battle you could say.

Like a champ, are you kidding me? He took it out in 2:01, that's not taking it out like a champ. The rest of the field was just super slow.