How did Kenenisa Bekele become this good?

Another vote for talent.

Sometimes anomalies happen and someone just has more ability than others.

Combine this with determination and a good coaching system and you get a K Bekele.

If he also took PED's it would not be a differentiator from other athletes who took PED's. The difference is still talent.

His slower brother has run 12:52.

Freelove wrote:

Think about it: if he was in, say, 26:50 shape at Daegu he would have been 3rd at best. Instead he dropped out. Three weeks later he's looking like he could've beaten Farah easily. If he had that fitness, why didn't he contend in Daegu? If he didn't, how did he drop 30+ seconds off his 10k in 3 weeks?

Think about it: A pretty evenly paced, rabbited European Time Trial =/= a Championship race full of surges, fluctuating paces and an inevitable slowing of the pace to build for a monster kick.

There's a big difference, mentally, between following some rabbits and clicking off 400s at a certain pace versus multiple changes of pace capped by an all-out 400 which routinely requires 1500m-esque speed to pull off victory. Perhaps he knew he didn't have that in him. Coming off an injury, training that kind of speed is often the last piece of the training puzzle due to the risk of re-injuring yourself.

Of course, the actual reason he stopped could've been anyone of the conspiracy theories spouted here.

Agree. I think it's interesting that everyone believes Usain Bolt runs so fast mostly because of his ridiculous talent but we don't believe the same for Bekele.

Here are the factors that may contribute to their success (not in any particular order):

Training

Coaching

Personality traits (determination, drive to succeed, competitiveness, etc.)

Natural talent/ability

PEDs (depending on your view about this)

If we assign a percentage of how much each of these factors contribute so the total adds to 100%, I would say that maybe 80% of the success of both Bolt and Bekele can be explained by talent. The second most important factor is probably personality traits - maybe another 10%.

I think training and PEDs (I do not assume they are using, but I know many do) may be the least important factors because all world class athletes have access to the same methods or drugs.

Of course this is all just pure speculation on my part because I have no evidence for this. It is just an attempt to frame the discussion.

Also, these factors will not have the same weight for all althletes. But for those that are at the pinnacle of their sport, I would think that talent can explain most of their success.

wanna be the best wrote:

You gotta wonder, how does someone build up to cranking out 62's for a 10k, like that is just so freaking insane, how? How did train to get to such a level? I'm flabbergasted!

It's the way he holds his thumbs.

cheese pasta wrote:

I'm willing to bet $1 million that if you randomly selected 1,000 15 year-old males from the world population and gave them the exact same training Bekele did from that age that none of them would ever run 12:37.

OK, make that $1 billion and 1 million 15 year-olds and you've got yourself a bet.

A rare turtle soup.

Well naturally getting more out of mileage than other people would be talent.

Take someone who in the US would be treated as a 800 guy and train him to run the 10.

someone had to do it wrote:

Bekele is doped. You're kidding yourself if you think otherwise. The guy drops out of a 10k at daegu at a low pace, then comes back 3 weeks later and busts out a world leader 10k, faster than Mo Farah ran, the guy who won gold at 5k and silver at 10k. What a joke, I thought me may actually have been clean before that.

Why does this show that he's doping? If he were doping then surely he would have kicked ass at Daegu and not bothered with the race 3 weeks later. Priorities, dude...

Reality check223 wrote:

what is talent? and why are people so determined to attribute an individual's success to it? it's a weak mentality.

Because talent, in any sport, is as important as hard work and commitment. Don't believe me? Go out and train and your little legs off and see if you come within 2 minutes of Bekele's 5k WR. Go on, proves us all wrong.

Reality check223 wrote:

Shiny McShine wrote:

Because talent, in any sport, is as important as hard work and commitment. Don't believe me? Go out and train and your little legs off and see if you come within 2 minutes of Bekele's 5k WR. Go on, proves us all wrong.

But what is talent? Also, I've already come within 2 minutes of his 5k wr

a) c'mon, don't be silly, you know what talent is. It is a natural aptitude for a specific skill, or sport, or activity and there is no doubt it plays a huge role in one's success in any given endeavor

b) running is nearly entirely fitness based. So yes, the ability to absorb hard training and translate that into increased fitness gains is a physical "talent" (or god given or inherent physical trait if you will) that not everyone possesses

c) so you've come with 2 mins of his wr. congrats. If talent doesn't matter, you should be able to work hard and smart enough to get around 12:40, right? Good luck

I'd be willing to bet you wouldn't be able to run 2k at his 5k pace.

Reality check223 wrote:

yeah, i've no doubt that i could run as fast as him if I wanted to. But I don't want to because my focus is on the mile (and other things in life which are not compatible with 5k training at the moment).

This explains why we can't compete with Bekele.

Right now we have a Letsrun poster that has the ability to run with Bekele but just doesn't want to.

wanna be the best wrote:You gotta wonder, how does someone build up to cranking out 62's for a 10k, like that is just so freaking insane, how? How did train to get to such a level? I'm flabbergasted!

his line of fit for his prime in '04/'05

~ 51.4 / 1'47.8 -> 3'30.7 , 4'46.1 , 7'20.0 , 12'36.4 , 26'15.3

bottom line :

he is a low-51 guy with unbelievable endurance

there are are plenty of guys around here with low-51 ability, but of course, none have his endurance to run those 5k/10ks

a helluva lot of guys here coud whup him over a 400 & quite a few over a 800, but then his endurance advantage really comes into play & he starts to grind everyone who ever lived into the ground by ~ 3k races

Reality check223 wrote:

because I run a different event

So you can Bekele, either Bekele, in the mile?

Begin by sprinting 100 m. The next day sprint 2 x 100 m with full recovery. Continue in this vein until you can do 100 x 100 m sprints. You now have the strength to run your fastest 10000 m. Next, gradually reduce your recovery time until it's a short as possible. Take a couple of days off to get supercharged, then let fly.

Freelove wrote:

Three weeks later he's looking like he could've beaten Farah easily. If he had that fitness, why didn't he contend in Daegu? If he didn't, how did he drop 30+ seconds off his 10k in 3 weeks?

Of the aerobic and anaerobic systems that must be stressed/trained to race fast at 10k, look at what is needed to fully develop the aerobic system: maximize your heart size, maximize your lung size, maximize the number of capillaries, and maximize your muscle glycogen storage. Once you've maxed out those first two, they stay pretty much the same size even when you stop training.

Simile: your aerobic system is like a road, with your body's ability to deliver oxygen comparable to the quantity and speed of cars on the road. A road only has a certain capacity, but with work it is possible to expand the capacity of the road with training. Bekele built a 12-lane super-highway over the years with his training. He doesn't drive on it in a year or two. The infrastructure is still there, just maybe a couple of potholes.

Point is, once the base has been set, it is easier to get back to where you have been.

ventolin^3 wrote:

wanna be the best wrote:You gotta wonder, how does someone build up to cranking out 62's for a 10k, like that is just so freaking insane, how? How did train to get to such a level? I'm flabbergasted!

his line of fit for his prime in '04/'05

~ 51.4 / 1'47.8 -> 3'30.7 , 4'46.1 , 7'20.0 , 12'36.4 , 26'15.3

bottom line :

he is a low-51 guy with unbelievable endurance

there are are plenty of guys around here with low-51 ability, but of course, none have his endurance to run those 5k/10ks

a helluva lot of guys here coud whup him over a 400 & quite a few over a 800, but then his endurance advantage really comes into play & he starts to grind everyone who ever lived into the ground by ~ 3k races

Bekele can run sub 49.xx for 400m....

imbecile wrote:Bekele can run sub 49.xx for 400m....

there is uncertainty ( hogwash ) from his own mouth :

5'30 into this :

"49 something & 1'48"

now imbecile, the 800 he claims is virtually exactly the predicted ( high-1'47 in perfect race ), but the 400 he claims is way, way faster than predicted

ask yourself :

is 49+/1'48 a unique combo only one man ever born coud claim ??

or, if not, then, any others of 49+/1'48 have demonstrated same endurance qualities of kennster & if there endurance projects up, shoud theoretically be able to match him at 3/5/10k

is 49+/1'48 unique ability ???