From the release
"I am very grateful to the University of Oregon and the coaching staff for all they have done for me. This important decision has taken me a couple of months to decide on but a decision I feel that is best for me in reaching my upcoming goals”, said Matthew from his base in Eugene where he will stay to complete his sociology major.
Oh yeah, and best of luck to him. Was a complete doubter going into the USATF Champs and at Worlds. He ran an amazing race strategically, and now he has a bronze at Worlds.
Kiko wrote:
So.....it's all about the money?
How much are his medals worth?
Wheating went pro after running a 330 that summer I think. Which def increased his value, not just the 15/8 at ncaas.
With fernandez, the "mile" is a more marketable event than the 5k, so he would be worth more. Plus everyone is obsessed with german, which is worth more $
Still not sure why he didn't go pro right after NCAA's considering it was his 4th year and had an Olympic year coming up, when some decide to red shirt.
But I am sure his contract is nicer now then it would have been.
I really don't know why the NCAA's doesn't allow their athletes to make money at their sport in this day and age.
German Lost Nothing wrote:
...Nobody was going to offer German a pro contract for anything beyond maybe 50k a year. Why would they when Chris Derrick was clearly better than German just in that class year...
Derrick better than Fernandez as HS seniors?
Maybe.
Derrick was "clearly better" than Fernandez?
Don't be ridiculous. Fernandez ran a 4:00.29 for 1600 meters to break Ryan Hall's state meet record of 4:02.62, and 3 hours later, ran the 3200m in 8:34.2. And then finished his career with an 8:34.40 2 mile to break a 29 year-old record.
Derrick was clearly better? Yeah, right.
Occupy Tardville wrote:
Seems like a no brainer, Centro is not just good, he's WC medalist good and that alone jacks up his market value. He can always finish his degree but it's not as if he can tack on a couple of years at the end of his career and make up for what he's going to earn in his first couple as a Pro.
It's not a couple of years, it's 6 months. Centro would be a pro by the Trials regardless. I don't think this is as much about money between now and the end of the college track season, as it is about preparing for the Trials and the Olympics in the optimal way. That doesn't include an NCAA indoor and outdoor season.
German Lost Nothing wrote:
Nobody was going to offer German a pro contract for anything beyond maybe 50k a year. Why would they when Chris Derrick was clearly better than German just in that class year, and Derrick is no Rupp, Wheating, Centro like talent.
German won the NCAA 1500m as a freshman. Chris Derrick has still not won NCAAs. Chris Lukezic who didn't win NCAAs gave up a Gtown scholarship to turn pro so clearly the value is above 50k a year. Rupp didn't win NCAAs until his 5th year in college.
Maybe the 250k a year wasn't there for German and he stayed in school. The more I think about it that makes the most sense.
But surely he could have got more than $100k to turn pro after his freshman year.
Great move by Centro. Zero downside, all the upside.
Re:Fernandez...
If he wins the indoor 3k and runs around 7:40-42, runs 3:33-35 and 13:10 outdoors while picking up another NCAA crown, he'll get more as a senior then after his freshman year. I think he can realistically achieve all of that.
Would love to see the kid destroy everyone in college in 2012.
Wejo, where do you find these numbers? I have wondered how much pro runners make, but can't seem to find the data.
wejo wrote:
On a run the other day, I said Fernandez cost himself at least a million.
With Fernandez lets say he could have gone pro for at least $250k a year. We'd be coming up on $750k he's lost out on. And a good agent would have tried to structure the deal through 2016.
And $250k per is just the minimum I figure they'd have to pay him to give up 3 years of college. He might have gotten more.
Now if Fernandez turns pro, he'll get less per year than he would have gotten as a freshman and he's already lost out on 3 years.
I'm a big fan of the guy so I hope he has a great senior year. Talent like that does not go away.
With Centro Jr, the calculus is different as by turning pro now the paychecks just start a few months earlier and he can shift his training away from the college year.
If he stayed he would not lose out on 3 years of earnings. But I don't think his value could go up much only down. He'll sign his pro contract at the top. Now he doesn't run for Nike for free to 6 months in the Oregon jersey.
Rupp is one guy who made a ton of cash by staying in school. He was a great runner but not a champion until his senior year. So did Jenny Barringer (through the 3:59 1500m not her last XC year).
Lukezic cashed out on top but never amounted to much as a pro.
Wheating probaly benefited by staying. His double NCAA wins made him a legend but he did lose out on 2 years of earnings. If he didn't get the double his senior year, I think financially he would have taken an overall hit.
Does he still qualify for the WC medal payment from the IAAF. It is not huge but it is a non-trivial amount of money and it probably has to be claimed this year if it is not already too late.
German Lost Nothing wrote:
Brojos just because you suffer from German infaution doesn't mean the rest of the world does. Nobody was going to offer German a pro contract for anything beyond maybe 50k a year. Why would they when Chris Derrick was clearly better than German just in that class year, and Derrick is no Rupp, Wheating, Centro like talent.
I beg to differ. You might have a case at the moment that Derrick is better than German, but anyone who's followed German's career closely knows that there's SO much more potential there. Did you watch German as a freshman in college solo 3:55? Or were you in Eugene to watch him reel in the lead pack in the men's 5,000m final while running in the 13:20's? If he can stay healthy for the next few years he'll give sub 13 a good run.
All this said, Derrick is a great runner, but lacks German's speed. I see Derrick developing into a great 10k guy down the road.
What are the logistics and mechanism for negotiating pro contracts for college students given NCAA regulations?
Do shoe companies actually approach freshmen and sophomore runners saying, "We will give you 50k to turn pro," and is that 'legal'? And does running have the same prohibition about hiring an agent as football/basketball?
If I am a smart, poor college freshman, I would be very to hesitant to sign any contract, if shoe companies are offering and I don't have an agent to negotiate, because they are likely screwing/low-balling me, e.g. if I am German, and am offered 50k/year as a freshman, that seems like a ton of money, but I suspect that I could be getting a lot more if someone could negotiate for me.
wejo wrote:
Wheating probaly benefited by staying. His double NCAA wins made him a legend but he did lose out on 2 years of earnings. If he didn't get the double his senior year, I think financially he would have taken an overall hit.
The 3:29 he ran in Europe probably had more to do with it than the NCAA double.
Phil Simms wrote:
Was it wejo or rojo that was super critical of Lukezic because he went pro without having won an NCAA title? What a dumb argument. The guy got paid for several years based on his potential.
It was me and i think I was proven correct.
Yes he got paid for several years on potential but in the end one of America's great mile prospects ended up out of the sport by age 25.
My main anger in these "go pro early" stories is directed at the shoe companies, not the runner. The college system is a fantastic development place and I don't know why the shoe companies need to blow up the tiny sport we have as it's not like these athletes are selling a ton of shoes - it's more of an ego thing for the shoe companies.
I also have a problem when Nike seemingly pays a lot of Non-Oregon athletes to go pro early but then has until know kept the Oregon stars (Rupp & Wheating) in there til they are out of eligibility.
German Lost Nothing wrote:
Brojos just because you suffer from German infaution doesn't mean the rest of the world does. Nobody was going to offer German a pro contract for anything beyond maybe 50k a year. Why would they when Chris Derrick was clearly better than German just in that class year, and Derrick is no Rupp, Wheating, Centro like talent.
If you don't think German Fernandez would have got at least 6 figures when he was a freshmen, then you are out of it. One could argue Derrick was possibly better at the long distances but not a chance in the world in earning potential.
The facts are clear - a good agent would have gotten German Alan Webb type money.
Let me remind you what Mr. German Fernandez accomplished as a frosh. In February of 2009, at the age of 18 and 3+ months, the kid set a world junior record in the mile by running 3:55.09 all alone in an indoor race.
Read the previous sentence again. German was a YOUNG freshmen. For comparison's sake, please realize that Alan Webb's 3:53.43 mile in HS came when he was 18 years old and 4 months old. German was younger.
That indoor season, German also ran an American junior record in the 3000 (7:47). Outdoors, he destroyed everyone to win NCAAs in the 1500 and then capped his season by running an American junior record of 13:25 in the 5000 at USAs (faster than Derrick but come on what earning potential does a 13:29 5000 guy have anyway).
You don't think a shoe company would want a guy like that? Literally, maybe once a decade a guy comes out of America with credentials like that.
Webb had a similar mile time, had bombed his freshman year at Michigan and still got a ton.
That indoor season, German also ran an American junior record in the 3000 (7:47). Outdoors, he destroyed everyone to win NCAAs in the 1500 and then capped his season by running an American junior record of 13:25 in the 5000 at USAs (faster than Derrick but come on what earning potential does a 13:29 5000 guy have anyway).
I'm with you, buddy, but maybe you should ask Bumby, who became a Nike athlete as a 22-year-old with a 13:30 PR, what earning potential a 13:29 athlete has. I have no idea what he got paid, but I'd imagine whatever he's getting paid, he would have been paid more if he was 18 instead of 22.
Oregon Soc degree... a licence to print money !
rojo wrote:
It was me and i think I was proven correct.
Yes he got paid for several years on potential but in the end one of America's great mile prospects ended up out of the sport by age 25.
You're delusional. How were you proven correct? The fact that he was out of the sport by the age of 25 actually proves even more that he needed to take the money and run.
In your bizarro world nobody can leave their sport early until they either finish their eligibility or win an NCAA title (as if that means ANYTHING outside of the NCAA).
Let's use a basketball player as an example: Assume Player X leaves after his junior year, immediately following his team's early exit from the NCAA tourney.
Then suppose he plays in the NBA for 5 years before deciding to move on to other things. Was it wrong that the Pistons drafted him and paid him millions of dollars? Maybe he would have decided to move onto other things at the same age even if he had completed his eligibility; Then he'd have one less year making that money (Lukezic was around 100k, but it doesn't matter).
Rojo, your argument was dumb then, but it may be even dumber now.
fgfg wrote:
Oregon Soc degree... a licence to print money !
A licence? Really bro?
Robert, I'm still trying to wrap my brain around this. Do you think Lukezic was out of the sport by the age of 25 because he left college early?Phil
rojo wrote:
Yes he got paid for several years on potential but in the end one of America's great mile prospects ended up out of the sport by age 25.