junk1 wrote:
Someone just chasing prize money does not run a lot of grueling ultras where the payoff is nothing or next to nothing. There is no prize money at Badwater or at most of the races Wardian runs.
If he's in it for the money he is using a very ineffective strategy.
Exactly. He is is scheduled to run Marine Corps Marathon next weekend. Prize Money = Zero.
If I am not mistaken, I believe he is running New York the weekend after Marine Corps Marathon, too.
Wardian is ruining local races? What are you talking about? Like the whole town comes out for these races and then parades the winner on their shoulders chanting his name while someone starts the sketching for the sculpture in the town square?
Local road races have about 5 people watch that are not a relative of someone running. 4 of those people are homeless who stumbled out of the alley. The glory of winning these races is right up there with getting your name picked for free lunch out of the Subway fish bowl...
I am frightened by the fantasy world you live in. Sorry he "stole" your winner's medal and coupon for a free pizza. Next time, form your own race and tell no one about it.
Met him several times and I have to say he is a great athlete, but not the nicest guy.
I've know him for years and he couldn't be a nicer guy. he loves to run and race and he's quite good and has had a lot of success. I'm happy for him and hope he continues to excel.
Exactly - Vermont works hard to get Wardian every year. And, usually he's 3rd or 4th across the line.
Of course, even if he did clean up on prize money, that's the whole reason why races offer prize money. Organizers want a competitive field. But Wardian does many races with no prize money, and many races with prize money that he doesn't win a dime. He runs almost all of the local races in DC, as well. I saw him in a race here a few years ago that didn't even have online results.
Has Wardian gone head to head against Max King in any trail ultras??? That would be a solid match up with the edge going to King.
wowsa wrote:
i am a huge fan of wardian. the dude is a total badass and seems like a nice guy.
no, he won't set the world record in the marathon, but anyone that can run thon's week in and week out in typically well-under 2:30 (2:17 best i think) is pretty cool in my book.
thon's what?
I appreciate the respectful disagreement and the examples that counter my points. Like I said, I'm not trying to sway anyone's opinion about the guy personally. It may have more to do with his sponsor, MarathonGuide.com, than it does with his own choices.
I'm just saying, it has a negative effect in terms of the impact on the running community when someone who is unknown comes in from 1000 miles away to win a race in an uncompetitive fashion. This isn't Wardian specifically, but an example is someone soliciting the organizer of a marathon with a $1500 first prize for travel, room, and expenses, getting "invited", and winning by 16 minutes. That person leaves, and literally, within a day, nobody is talking about the race. Sixteen minutes later, an actual race takes place between three runners from the city the race is being held in and from one state away. Completely ignored by the media, and nobody hears about it or cares.
Conversely, same race, several years prior. Organizer is not interested in or prepared to pay travel, etc. to a name runner like Wardian. The field is largely local and somewhat regional. A great race with a close, dramatic finish takes place, local runner wins in course record time. Media goes crazy. That runner is on radio and TV (locally) for a week after the race, etc., and people still talk to that runner about the race years later, where they were when it happened, and their memories about it like it was the goddamn Kennedy assassination.
So, there is a kind of blowback to the local running scene that can happen in either case. It's not right or wrong, it's just what happens. I see other people stepping up and aspiring to do what Wardian does (or did, in destroying uncompetitive fields), and I strongly disagree with it, because I've seen how it can take a lot of positive things away from an event and a community.
Yes, there are examples of Wardian and racers like him running at races with no prize money, but how do you know the costs aren't covered by a sponsor, or the race director? It has to make economic sense for them to fly or drive across the country to run a race, so the money for that is coming from somewhere. I strongly, strongly doubt it is coming out of pocket, given he has a family to support.
Anyone can race anywhere they want, but those choices have effects. I don't like the effects I've seen caused by people who make the choice to race often in locations far away from their homes, taking resources and attention away from the communities that support those events. Don't throw a hissy if you disagree. It's just my opinion.
albin1e4 wrote:
The race was at Tussey Mountainback with a nasty elevation profile for running 6:40 miles.
http://www.tusseymountainback.com/course-info/elevation-profile
That makes a big difference to your pace especially on a longer race
common wrote:
I appreciate the respectful disagreement and the examples that counter my points. Like I said, I'm not trying to sway anyone's opinion about the guy personally. It may have more to do with his sponsor, MarathonGuide.com, than it does with his own choices.
I'm just saying, it has a negative effect in terms of the impact on the running community when someone who is unknown comes in from 1000 miles away to win a race in an uncompetitive fashion. This isn't Wardian specifically, but an example is someone soliciting the organizer of a marathon with a $1500 first prize for travel, room, and expenses, getting "invited", and winning by 16 minutes. That person leaves, and literally, within a day, nobody is talking about the race. Sixteen minutes later, an actual race takes place between three runners from the city the race is being held in and from one state away. Completely ignored by the media, and nobody hears about it or cares.
Conversely, same race, several years prior. Organizer is not interested in or prepared to pay travel, etc. to a name runner like Wardian. The field is largely local and somewhat regional. A great race with a close, dramatic finish takes place, local runner wins in course record time. Media goes crazy. That runner is on radio and TV (locally) for a week after the race, etc., and people still talk to that runner about the race years later, where they were when it happened, and their memories about it like it was the goddamn Kennedy assassination.
So, there is a kind of blowback to the local running scene that can happen in either case. It's not right or wrong, it's just what happens. I see other people stepping up and aspiring to do what Wardian does (or did, in destroying uncompetitive fields), and I strongly disagree with it, because I've seen how it can take a lot of positive things away from an event and a community.
Yes, there are examples of Wardian and racers like him running at races with no prize money, but how do you know the costs aren't covered by a sponsor, or the race director? It has to make economic sense for them to fly or drive across the country to run a race, so the money for that is coming from somewhere. I strongly, strongly doubt it is coming out of pocket, given he has a family to support.
Anyone can race anywhere they want, but those choices have effects. I don't like the effects I've seen caused by people who make the choice to race often in locations far away from their homes, taking resources and attention away from the communities that support those events. Don't throw a hissy if you disagree. It's just my opinion.
Let me help you sum this up...
Wardian has garnered a good sponsor to help defray his costs so you are jealous, but your real issue is with the local race director.
Got it.
ukathleticscoach wrote:
That makes a big difference to your pace especially on a longer race
Thanks.
Apostrophe Crimes wrote:
wowsa wrote:i am a huge fan of wardian. the dude is a total badass and seems like a nice guy.
no, he won't set the world record in the marathon, but anyone that can run thon's week in and week out in typically well-under 2:30 (2:17 best i think) is pretty cool in my book.
thon's what?
From what I can gather, Thon must put on a race of some sort called the "Week In and Week Out." Wardian has run this race several times, with a 2:17 best.
Long live Thon! King of the North!!!!
Wardian came out and ran MDI recently. I was in the field and it was fun to have him in there. He was a minor celebrity, not an unknown. Ran 2:32 into a giant point-to-point headwind with nearly 2K feet of climbing...the day after running a 2:22 at Hartford. That's extreme strength.
General consensus was that he's a congenial guy with a giant motor. Can't expect the guy to be overtly friendly in every conversation at every moment.
I notice you responded with an ad hominem attack, rather than addressing what I have written. Clever.
You're living in a fantasy world if you think anyone talks about the great race between 3 2:50 guys. I don't think most people even care who wins.
I mean, I went out and tempo'd a 10k the other week just for fun and beat the field by 6 minutes (and didn't run under 34). No one was angry that I "stole" the glory from the 40 minute woman in 2nd. Wardian runs a lot of races here and I'm more likely to do a race he goes to. The alternative is what, exactly? A bunch of uncompetitive road races? Should fast people not run small races?
Wardian is OK, but he ain't no Dane Ra_uschenberg. That guy would tear Mike a new one.
Does anybody else wonder what Wardian could do for a marathon if he really set his mind to it and trained for it and got in a good race, without doing all those ultras during the lead up?
I don't think you have much of a point. The idea behind prize money is to attract fast runners. If you don't want out-of-state ringers, don't have prize money at your race.
A race can still be successful without prize money. A good example of that is the Marine Corps Marathon, which is huge but is usually won in the 2:20 range. And Wardian runs that almost every year.
Well, I can tell you that people do indeed care about a great race between three guys from the area, versus three Africans or some guy or girl from 800 miles away who beats the field by 16 minutes.
I notice you chose 2:50 as a time, trying to imply that these locals are "slow". In my example, the local winner set a new course record by a minute, and the top three times all made the top five times run all-time.
Races can be competitive and even more exciting in the absence of a ringer who flies in from out of state. Some have implied that it's in a race directors interest to pay faster people to run to drum up interest in the race and give it credibility. I argue that is the opposite of what actually happens. It diminishes the connection that people have with the event when someone they don't know gets the attention. It's human nature.
"On March 13, 2010, Wardian set a Guinness World Record at the Lower Potomac Marathon winning the race in 2:34:56 in a Spiderman costume"......in other words, he'd beat most of the posters on here wearing a costume. if you don't "like him", I hope you at least "like" that fact.