German Fernandez Wins Big 12 Mile

Jim Ryun was great at the mile, but had no range. Fernandez is great at the mile, and is talented up through the half marathon.

My take on it wrote:

Jim Ryun was great at the mile, but had no range. Fernandez is great at the mile, and is talented up through the half marathon.

Great? He was the world record holder at 19. He was more than just great.

How can you claim he had no range? He had a world record at 2 events. He also had an american record at the 2 mile. Why would he try and do the half marathon when he is the BEST at the middle distances? What has Fernandez done at the 10k or half that is comparable to the achievements of Ryun. Put down the koolaid. You're embarrassing yourself.

He just doubled back to take second in the 3k. 8:05 to his teammate Farrell's 8:00. 3rd place was 8:08.

In accordance to the order of events, Pat McGregor won the 1,000 in 2:24, which was done right before the mile. Is this right? Depending on the rest in between, that's not a bad double.

Clearing the bs up wrote:

"Defend" it.

Well said. Obviously Long Dong Silver was drowning in his own hyperbole when he said "The most talented american born runner ever. I'll defend that last sentence forever..." I'm guessing that he is another German fan in his mid-20's or younger, much like the vast majority of the people in the other thread I referenced who predicted that he would break McChesney's American-born collegiate record in the 5,000m as a true freshman. Still waiting on that one, by the way!

We have never and likely will never have someone as talented as Jim Ryun at the mile. His skill at the mile allowed him to run a great 800 and 2 mile. German is 4 seconds off Ryun's mile time. In high school Run ran 9:04 for the 2 mile, and German 8:34. Ryun ran 8:25 at 19 which converts to 7:50.1 for 3k. German ran 7:47 for 3k at 18.

So while Jim Ryun was amazing, outstanding, etc. at the mile, German is better than him at the 2 mile and up.

My take on it wrote:

We have never and likely will never have someone as talented as Jim Ryun at the mile. His skill at the mile allowed him to run a great 800 and 2 mile. German is 4 seconds off Ryun's mile time. In high school Run ran 9:04 for the 2 mile, and German 8:34. Ryun ran 8:25 at 19 which converts to 7:50.1 for 3k. German ran 7:47 for 3k at 18.

So while Jim Ryun was amazing, outstanding, etc. at the mile, German is better than him at the 2 mile and up.

Buddy, do you realize that German Fernandez has never even seen a track as crappy as the best tracks that Ryun ran on?

My take on it wrote:

We have never and likely will never have someone as talented as Jim Ryun at the mile. His skill at the mile allowed him to run a great 800 and 2 mile. German is 4 seconds off Ryun's mile time. In high school Run ran 9:04 for the 2 mile, and German 8:34. Ryun ran 8:25 at 19 which converts to 7:50.1 for 3k. German ran 7:47 for 3k at 18.

So while Jim Ryun was amazing, outstanding, etc. at the mile, German is better than him at the 2 mile and up.

Ryun ran those times in 1966/1967 on a cinder track. What would German have run for the mile in 1967 on a cinder track when the world record was 3:51.1? 7:47.91 vs 7:50.1....two point one seconds faster at 3k 43 years later with better spikes and on a modern track surface, hardly mind blowing.

Yes, but I stand by what I said. Jim Ryun was far superior to German at the mile and below, about even at the 3k/2 mile, German slightly better, and then above that German is superior.

fernandez also took second in the 3k by a few seconds in 8:05, behind his teammate tom farrell (8:00). He was obviously not trying to blow the doors off of anyone in the mile.

Leaving aside his 13:25 at 18 (19 seconds faster than Ritz at that age), his 3:55 is arguably superior to Webb's race because it was solo AND indoor. Webb had a field to chase and draft off, whereas GF was ten seconds ahead of everyone in that race. I think that we'd all like to see German at full strength in the outdoor season.

malmo wrote:

Buddy, do you realize that German Fernandez has never even seen a track as crappy as the best tracks that Ryun ran on?

German Fernandez is phenomenally talented. If he can ever stay healthy he can do some really special things.

Jim Ryan, on the other hand, was a once in a lifetime talent. No other American high schooler, 18/19 year old has ever been close.

My take on it wrote:

Jim Ryun was great at the mile, but had no range. Fernandez is great at the mile, and is talented up through the half marathon.

What's his best half marathon?

At age 17 Ryun had run 4:01.7, 3:59.0 and 3:39.0

At age 18y 1 mo. Ryun ran 3:58.3 in his State meet on a crappy cinder track. Then ran 3:58.1, 3:56.8 and 3:55.3, the latter was the American Record (not AJR) and defeating Olympic Champion Peter Snell in the process.

Ryun set the WR at the 880, 1500, and Mile(twice), plus he set the WR (3:56) in the indoor mile. He also set the AR in the two-mile easily beating Kip Keino, the World record-holder at 3000m (7:39) at the time.

For kicks, Ryun ran a 13:38 5000.

There is no comparison at all between Ryun and Fernandez.

German Fernandez is one of the best freshman runners the US has had in ages, but he's not even up to where Tom Byers was at the same stage in his career. Nor has Fernandez actually beaten anyone of significance. So forget about comparing Fernandez to Ryun -- he doesn't even compare to Byers!. As a Freshman, Byers won both the US Senior and Junior National titles in the 1500. I'm not sure if anyone else has ever accomplished that feat in any event?

So answer me this?

Who has Fernandez ever beaten in a race?

What's his best 800, 1500, mile, 2 mile?

How many world records does he have?

How many world record holders has he beaten?

How many Olympic champions has he beaten?

How many national champions has he beaten?

malmo wrote:

Buddy, do you realize that German Fernandez has never even seen a track as crappy as the best tracks that Ryun ran on?

Malmo, GF has seen about the crappiest track there is. If you ever saw his HS track then you would know how crappy that track is. Riverbank HS is a very old small school. It's track was built before the Jim Ryan era. GF has trained on a very crappy track.

GF has never run a high caliber track race on a track as crappy as Jim Ryan ran on.

Google Maps Riverbank HS and you will see what I'm talking about.

German ran 1:09:45 at age 16, the day after running 4:05 in the 1500 and 4 months after knee surgery. He ran the first few miles with his girlfriend, got bored, and ended up winning it.

I don't think comparing titles from 50 years ago, before the Africans and the running boom, to now is relevant. There is absolutely room for comparison between Ryun and Fernandez. Like I had said, Ryun was the most talented at the mile and below, German from the 2 mile up.

Another take on it wrote:

Clearing the bs up wrote:

"Defend" it.

Well said. Obviously Long Dong Silver was drowning in his own hyperbole when he said "The most talented american born runner ever. I'll defend that last sentence forever..." I'm guessing that he is another German fan in his mid-20's or younger, much like the vast majority of the people in the other thread I referenced who predicted that he would break McChesney's American-born collegiate record in the 5,000m as a true freshman. Still waiting on that one, by the way!

I think Ritz is more talented. He ran 13:27 as a freshman at Mt. Sac I believe. Also 4th in NCAA cross as a freshman. Not to mention his 27:38 as a redshirt sophomore(I think?)

oldoldrunner. When I pushed the send button the first thought was that Fernandez grew up in the Valley and probably has seen, and even run on, tracks as crappy as the best tracks that Ryun ran on.

You are correct, Fernandez hasn't run a high calibur race on a track as crappy as the ones that Ryun ran on regularly.

My take on it wrote:

German ran 1:09:45 at age 16, the day after running 4:05 in the 1500 and 4 months after knee surgery. He ran the first few miles with his girlfriend, got bored, and ended up winning it.

I don't think comparing titles from 50 years ago, before the Africans and the running boom, to now is relevant. There is absolutely room for comparison between Ryun and Fernandez. Like I had said, Ryun was the most talented at the mile and below, German from the 2 mile up.

He doesn't even compare to Byers, how can you possibly compare him to Ryun?

My take on it wrote:

Jim Ryun was great at the mile, but had no range. Fernandez is great at the mile, and is talented up through the half marathon.

Jim Ryun was one of the all-time greats at the mile and 880. I don't recall what Fernandez' world rankings were.

My take on it wrote:

I don't think comparing titles from 50 years ago, before the Africans and the running boom, to now is relevant.

You would be mistaken. That's simply one of the weaker excuses that some the current generation of U.S. distance runners like to use. However, our stopwatches also tell us that American distance running depth charts were actually slower throughout most of the last twenty years!

My take on it wrote:

There is absolutely room for comparison between Ryun and Fernandez.

Absolutely not! Malmo is right, and you're being ridiculous. The bottom line is that Ryun competed against the very best in the world successfully, and he has both the victories as well as the records to prove it.