JimG wrote:
According to some of the athlete reps in LDR, they were opposed to allowing expedited eligibility for new citizens either.
At the joint M&W LDR meeting, the proposal was tabled, essentially meaning that the 2-year waiting period remains in effect.
Please explain? I don't understand what this is?
This just made me sick to my stomach. Active military USA citizens not American enough? No wonder USATF keeps lagging behind.
Should foreign athletes be banned from NCAA Championships because All-Americans should be American?
yes...I agree with this statement!
Final Justice
Latest update from last night's meetings.
Best was Katie McGregor - winner of 3 USA Championships in 2010 - who stated "if someone is an American, they should be able to compete in USA Championships from day one."
Update 12/3/10 11:00PM: The LDR Division met Friday at 5:30PM and most spoke in favor of the rule. Best was Katie McGregor - winner of 3 USA Championships in 2010 - who stated "if someone is an American, they should be able to compete in USA Championships from day one." She told us after that she knew there was some issue, but hadn't known what it was - we expect that's the story with most people. After much discussion, it appeared that the group would vote to recommend that the Rules Committee aprove the Rule - but the few who were against shut the discussion with a motion to recommend tabling the rule vote to the next year.
Next up, the Rules Committee will meet at 10:00AM Saturday and set their recommendation. The Rules Committee might follow the idea to table the vote - a cop out - or, with enough input, vote to recommend the rule. If you, or anyone you know, will be at the USATF meeting, come voice your opinion at the Rules Committee meeting. If you know anyone on the Rules Committee or any delegation, talk with them... More coming...
Who are our athlete representatives? The USATF website is outdated.
This could get huge and I don't see why the current group that heads LDR don't see it. All it's going to take is one athlete with a savvy lawyer and some cash to sue USATF for denying their basic rights and the entire organization is exposed.
Simply put, you are telling Americans that they can't compete in an American championship because they are not American enough.
I guess we can keep them out of schools, deny them health care, police protection, etc?
To table this for two years will be a travesty.
no one said they aren't American enough, they just can't represent America internationally so why should they be allowed to impact selection races? The IAAF rule is there to stop people from switching countries for no good reason.
That's the problem. USATF isn't just applying this rule to selection races, they're applying it to ALL USATF championship races whether they are selectors or not.
there are so many things wrong with this...those of you that are in support of this have no idea what the current process is for citizenship. Minimum of five years continuous residency before you can apply. Application lengths are a case by case and region by region basis and could take a further 18 months. If you are married to an American citizen the process may be shortened by as much as 2 years.
This should have been approached in 2 steps: The USA should have told the IAAF to solve their problem in a more logical manner. (Yes, I am well aware that we are not at all well liked in that organization) Secondly, USATF should take steps to be sure that it does not impact the rights of our citizens and is enforced in the spirit of the rule.
Under the current set of rules, a US citizen who has been living here for 7 years can't compete in the New Haven Road Race and be considered american. Yes, in my book that does make him less a citizen than others. It needs to be fixed.
It was asserted at Men's LDR that ALL races serve as selection races, whether it's a specific championship, such as World Half, or a general list, like Ekidens.
You're being melodramatic. The USATF is restricting participation in the qualifier to people who can actually run the race for which the event is a qualifier. Should USATF allow runners to participate in prelims when they lack either the positive intent or ability to participate in the finals (think Rupp in 2008 Trials)? The rational answer is not a controversy; don't invent one.
Of course, you'll cry, "but its the CHAMPIONSHIPS." Once again, let's shelve the emotion. The championships really don't mean much except as a qualifier for meets that DO mean something, especially when many of the "champions" aren't even the best American at the distance (think 15k champion, 10k road champion, etc). The best frequently forgo the championships in order to cash in elsewhere, something recent immigrants can and should do so they are positioned to train and represent the US when it matters.
It's not about civil rights or the xenophobia implicit in anti-immigrant attitudes. It's about pragmatism.
to further complicate the issue, can someone tell me why this is an issue when the IAAF rule reads asfollows:
To summarize, they say 3 years, not two, and they also say it's 12 months upon agreement of both countries. There are also exceptions based on case (think Sydney Maree)
But again the primary issue is who is this hurting? On the women's side of the house I can only think of 5 or 6 women over the past 15 years that this has even pertained to. Maria Trujillo, Colleen DeReuk, Magdelena Levy, Mary Akor, an ex wife and Regina Joyce. Any other "new citizens" represent the US in a distance event or take the spot of someone in a trial over the past 15 years?
One compromise (which was a rule at one time and I'm not sure when it was changed). Is to require a 3 year period between representing member countries.
Sounds like, in the end, the issue was tabled - keeping the status quo (they can't compete in US Champs races) in place for another year.
The strangest part to me is that is came into effect because of a change that the IAAF put into place, not something the USATF decided to do.
The Real UncleB wrote:
I'm pretty sure they would like to exclude only non whites not born in the USA if they could
Exactly what I was about to say. And maybe they'll still figure out a way to do it.
FYI , This is a big issue that the current group of individuals at USATF have little or no knowledge of. None of the athletes have a clue.
it makes sense to me that they shouldnt compete in championships that are used for selection, but they should be able to in others. in an olympic year, what if we had 5 kenyans that all just got citizenship and all ran the 800 in the 2012 olympic tials durin their first year of citizeship and all 5 made the final...that would mean that the other 3 in the final would automatically be selected if they had the times and how lame would that be....the world and olympic trials are for qualifying purposes and the winner in every event shouldnt be someone who is ineligible to compete for us, it doesnt matter why they are unable to compete, anyone that is shouldnt be eligible.
Will this exclude Obama?
It's my understanding that the proposal tabled today specified that this change would apply only to road events specifically because of the lane space issue on the track. Might be that they should also open the track up to all citizens in non-championships years.
Obama's mother is American, so even if you believe he was born in Kenya and smuggled in to the US as an infant in an Al Qaeda plot to destabilize this country, he is still a US citizen by birth.
Now McCain was actually not born in the US. Didn't know that, did you? While you're at it, google: mccain songbird.