One additional note- more significant than talent, the major difficulty any uncoached kid fit enough to run four laps at all will have with running a good mile time is unfamiliaity/lack of experience with the concept of even pace.
PE miles are notorious for being dominated by JV cross-country kids simply because they understand how to efficiently expend their effort over four laps.
That's a HUGE advantage, and many of my JV runners enjoy reputations as monster runners because of it.
There is a more detailed look at the standards.
For what it's worth, I teach PE and did the presidential fitness test with my 5th-8th graders. The fastest girl ran 7:19. 3 more were under 7:45.
I don't think it takes much talent to break 7 for HS, but it will take some training.
This is PE class not a team. You are offering extra credit to any girl who can break 7 minutes for the mile. I wouldn't call you a snob because you seem nice enough to run this question by everyone at Letsrun. But I have to agree with your athletic director. It is very very hard for a girl who doesn't train to run a sub 7 minute mile.
Your aim was to give extra credit. Your demands are ridiculous for this extra credit. I would change it to 7:30 for the mile. With that extra credit time, you might have some takers. I think you will also have some people who easily hit that target time but so what. Give at least half the class a chance. Make it 7:30 instead of 7:00.
i cant open that thing up, could you summarize it?
ONE MILE RUN-WALK FOR GIRLS
Percentile Scores Based on Age/Test Scores in Minutes and Seconds
AGE
PERCENTILE 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17+
100 8:36 8:04 8:00 6:11 6:26 7:07 6:22 5:42 5:00 5:51 5:58 6:20
95 10:06 9:30 9:10 8:21 8:07 8:06 7:35 7:21 7:20 7:25 7:26 7:22
90 10:29 10:05 9:45 9:07 8:49 8:40 8:00 7:49 7:43 7:52 7:55 7:58
85 11:20 10:36 10:02 9:30 9:19 9:02 8:23 8:13 7:59 8:08 8:23 8:15
80 11:37 10:55 10:20 10:03 9:38 9:22 8:52 8:29 8:20 8:24 8:39 8:34
75 12:00 11:17 10:55 10:22 10:08 9:44 9:15 8:49 8:36 8:40 8:50 8:52
70 12:12 11:25 11:20 10:45 10:19 10:04 9:36 9:09 8:50 8:55 9:11 9:15
65 12:20 11:45 11:38 10:58 10:42 10:24 10:05 9:30 9:09 9:09 9:25 9:33
60 12:31 12:20 11:53 11:13 10:52 10:42 10:26 9:50 9:27 9:23 9:48 9:51
55 12:45 12:39 12:10 11:32 11:00 11:00 10:44 10:07 9:51 9:37 10:09 10:08
50 13:12 12:56 12:30 11:52 11:22 11:17 11:05 10:23 10:06 9:58 10:31 10:22
45 13:56 13:21 12:46 12:13 11:40 11:36 11:23 10:57 10:25 10:18 10:58 10:48
40 14:14 13:44 13:07 12:24 11:58 12:00 11:47 11:20 10:51 10:40 11:15 11:05
35 14:45 14:04 13:31 12:48 12:08 12:21 12:01 11:40 11:10 11:00 11:44 11:20
30 15:09 14:32 13:56 13:19 12:30 12:42 12:24 12:00 11:36 11:20 12:08 12:00
25 15:27 14:55 14:21 13:44 13:00 13:09 12:46 12:29 11:52 11:48 12:42 12:11
20 16:10 15:12 14:53 14:07 13:29 13:44 13:35 13:01 12:18 12:19 13:23 12:40
15 16:45 16:00 15:19 14:57 14:00 14:16 14:12 14:10 12:56 13:33 14:16 13:03
10 17:36 16:35 15:45 15:40 14:30 14:44 14:39 14:49 14:10 14:13 16:03 14:01
5 19:00 17:27 16:55 16:58 15:43 16:07 16:00 16:10 15:44 15:17 18:00 15:14
0 21:40 22:19 20:40 24:00 24:00 21:02 24:54 20:45 20:04 24:07 21:00 28:50
Is that a typo for a 14 year old girl? 5:00??? That's like the top .00001%...
so a 17 year old girl, 6:20 is in the 100th percentile... so sub 6 is probably top .1%?
Also why is the difference for the 100th percentile bigger among ages, but the difference is much smaller at the 95th, 90th etc? Typo?
I coached HS track and XC for 5 years at a decent sized school. The fastest girl I ever had was just over 5 minutes and the slowest was just under 7.
Now, I swear I'm not exaggerating or trying to be mean, but the slowest girl (6:54) was moderately overweight and slightly disabled. She kind of half shuffled / half waddled when she ran. She ran her PR at the end of the season (started out running a 9:00 mile).
So while I firmly DON'T believe that running a 7:00 mile takes a 'decent' amount of talent, I will say that it would probably be a rare occurrence for most girls to have the proper motivation and training to do so.
To: 7:00 is a joke,
Apparently you didn't read the question from the original poster. I suggest you do that and then respond to her post. She is not coaching high school cross country. None of her girls train for cross country or track. She is teaching a PE class, and is wondering if she should give extra credit for any girl breaking 7:00 for the mile. Your response is a little idiotic and wrong. 7 minute miles for 15 year old girls in a PE class is too fast! She should raise the time to 7:30 minimum.
Most sedentary HS girls do not have the endurance or training to run a 7:00 mile. I do think that you need some training to run a 7:00 mile. I've read peer-reviewed articles that stated that a sedentary young adult (18 yr old) was found to have the same endurance capacity as older men (60-70 yo) who regularly perform endurance training (running) at least 3x/week. (for example, V02max). So it depends whether or not your students regularly engage in physical activity. If they're all sedentary, I would not expect to find any girls running a 7:00 mile.
Like what others have said, I would raise the time to 7:30 for extra credit. Maybe give fewer extra credit points if under 8:00, but hey, it's extra credit.
Thank you all for your responses. The way it works is the official test is at the end of the year. The students have the year of PE classes where they still do running etc. (and will do other miles, but the official one is at the end). I make them run more than other PE teachers but it is still PE... also I realize that there will be very few girls under the 7 minutes mark out of all my PE classes (I have a few track runners/soccer players).
I remember when I was in HS I was able to run the mile in around 6:30 (this was before I did track). I was the fastest female in the class though but it wasn't like there was anyone REALLY slow. However, I was still fairly active unlike many kids today.
In that case, I am also thinking about giving credit based on improvement but I don't want to tell the kids that in the beginning because some might sand bag it so that they improve more later on.
This is the original post, genius
Okay so I'm a PE coach as well as coach cross country/track. I'm deciding the criteria for our physical test next year. For the mile run, I was thinking about offering extra credit for any girl in my class who can run under 7 minutes in the mile. However, when I told this to the athletic director, he told me I was being ridiculous. He said that it takes a decent amount of talent to be able to run under 7 minutes, and it is unfair to offer extra credit for such a good mark that only some of the talented girls will be able to achieve. I argued that 7 minutes is not an extremely hard mark... However, to this the athletic director replied that I was being "snobby." Just because I ran track/coach it, I apparently have higher standards because I only get the more talented girls, and my perspective is skewed.
So is the athletic director right? Does it take a decent amount of talent to be able to run under 7 (for a hs girl)?
This is my response
I coached HS track and XC for 5 years at a decent sized school. The fastest girl I ever had was just over 5 minutes and the slowest was just under 7.
Now, I swear I'm not exaggerating or trying to be mean, but the slowest girl (6:54) was moderately overweight and slightly disabled. She kind of half shuffled / half waddled when she ran. She ran her PR at the end of the season (started out running a 9:00 mile).
So while I firmly DON'T believe that running a 7:00 mile takes a 'decent' amount of talent, I will say that it would probably be a rare occurrence for most girls to have the proper motivation and training to do so.
Timbo7, the smartest person alive wrote:
To: 7:00 is a joke,
Apparently you didn't read the question from the original poster. I suggest you do that and then respond to her post. She is not coaching high school cross country. None of her girls train for cross country or track. She is teaching a PE class, and is wondering if she should give extra credit for any girl breaking 7:00 for the mile. Your response is a little idiotic and wrong. 7 minute miles for 15 year old girls in a PE class is too fast! She should raise the time to 7:30 minimum.
What thread are you reading? The original post clearly asks if it takes a decent amount of talent to run a 7:00 mile. My response clearly answers the question with personal experience. No, I do not believe it takes any discernible amount of talent to run a 7:00 mile. I personally witnessed a 15 year old girl with no talent (and in fact, several impediments) run under 7:00. The reason I believe it is "rare" to see girls under 7:00 is not because of ability, it is because of (a lack of) motivation to do so.
I suggest you brush up on your ability to comprehend reason and logic, then re-read and respond to my post.
curious question... wrote:
Thank you all for your responses. The way it works is the official test is at the end of the year. The students have the year of PE classes where they still do running etc. (and will do other miles, but the official one is at the end). I make them run more than other PE teachers but it is still PE... also I realize that there will be very few girls under the 7 minutes mark out of all my PE classes (I have a few track runners/soccer players).
I remember when I was in HS I was able to run the mile in around 6:30 (this was before I did track). I was the fastest female in the class though but it wasn't like there was anyone REALLY slow. However, I was still fairly active unlike many kids today.
In that case, I am also thinking about giving credit based on improvement but I don't want to tell the kids that in the beginning because some might sand bag it so that they improve more later on.
That make a world of sense.
curious question... wrote:
Thank you all for your responses. The way it works is the official test is at the end of the year. The students have the year of PE classes where they still do running etc. (and will do other miles, but the official one is at the end). I make them run more than other PE teachers but it is still PE... also I realize that there will be very few girls under the 7 minutes mark out of all my PE classes (I have a few track runners/soccer players).
I remember when I was in HS I was able to run the mile in around 6:30 (this was before I did track). I was the fastest female in the class though but it wasn't like there was anyone REALLY slow. However, I was still fairly active unlike many kids today.
In that case, I am also thinking about giving credit based on improvement but I don't want to tell the kids that in the beginning because some might sand bag it so that they improve more later on.
That make a world of sense.
curious question... wrote:
Thank you all for your responses. The way it works is the official test is at the end of the year. The students have the year of PE classes where they still do running etc. (and will do other miles, but the official one is at the end). I make them run more than other PE teachers but it is still PE... also I realize that there will be very few girls under the 7 minutes mark out of all my PE classes (I have a few track runners/soccer players).
I remember when I was in HS I was able to run the mile in around 6:30 (this was before I did track). I was the fastest female in the class though but it wasn't like there was anyone REALLY slow. However, I was still fairly active unlike many kids today.
In that case, I am also thinking about giving credit based on improvement but I don't want to tell the kids that in the beginning because some might sand bag it so that they improve more later on.
That make a world of sense.
8:00 mile pace is fair for extra credit
just to give you a little insight, i am now a female runner at a d1 school and have run 4:40 for the mile. when i was in middle school, i had absolutely no background in running. i believe i ran 7:02 for my gym class mile.
why not offer extra credit for anyone who imporves their time over the course of a semester by specified percent? you are then rewarding hard work versus talent.
My girlfriend never did any sports. She ran 6:30 off of 10 miles a week and very occasionally working out. I don't think 7 minutes is a difficult time for moderately active girls.
If kids know that they will be rewarded for improving they will sandbag the initial fitness test.