Thank NYRR for that. Why they can't hold a special OT marathon on the CP in conjunction with one of their many half-marathons is a mystery.
not good wrote:
Not good for the ladies, cause they were short-changed a year to qualify, and if this is true, are short-changed another 2 months.
Oh no, short-changed! They only have like three years to get a qualifier. Anyone who's got a shot at making the team will qualify, they'd do it even if they had a year less.
A warmer perspective.... wrote:
It's been said it's "short-changing" individuals who aren't full-time runners by putting it in Houston because some, who live in more frigid parts of the country, would have to train in poor wintery conditions. Just to shed light on the other side of things, for those of us (like myself) who live in the hot/humid South, to have the Trials in the first week of November again would mean having to train from 3months out in freakin' hot/humid weather (August, September, October). It sucks every bit as much to try to do a 24miler in the South in September as it does trying to get in a workout in freezing weather.
Message summed up: there are going to be people who, either way, won't be happy about the timing. Last time around, it was in New York. I say, why not change things up and put it in Houston?
Interesting to have your perspective, and that actually makes me feel a bit better; ie, Houston makes it tough on the sub-elite runner in the north but NYC makes it tough on the sub-elite runner in the south. So it's not so much a sub-elite versus elite discrimination.
The lesson here may be that the Oly Trials are just not a race for the guy whose ultimate aspiration is to run 214-217. Which is fine; there's plenty of other races out there for us to run (national champs in non-Olympic years, races like Chicago that offer high developmental incentives, etc.) It's just that I've talked to a lot of older guys who reached that 214-217 level and cite the Oly Trials where they finished top-20 or top-30 as the most memorable race of their career; thought I'd be missing out if I didn't try to do the same. But maybe that's not the case; maybe a top-10 finish in a national champs race in a non-olympic year is just as rewarding.
If they cared about "sub elites" then they wouldn't have moved the standard to 2:19. Men's and Women's committees aren't on the same page.
Steve Shuman wrote:Boston, at four months, is too quick a turnaround -- the trials, for either the men or women, are too competitive for the athletes to give much less than full training and effort for the trials and then to have to be at peak again in four months is tough.
We talked about this in 2008. If you look at the 2008 Beijing Olympic Marathon, almost all of the top finishers ran spring marathons.
1. Wanjiru - ran London
2. Gharib - didn't run anything
3. Kebede - ran Paris
4. Merga - ran London
5. Lel - ran London
6. Rothlin - ran Tokyo in February
7. Asfaw - ran Boston
8. Asmerom - ran Otsu, Japan in March
9. Ritz - I don't think he ran one
10. Hall - ran London
On the women's side:
1. Dita - ran London
2. Ndereba - nothing
3. Zhou - ran a pre-Olympic marathon in Beijing in April
4. Zhu - ran the same pre-Olympic marathon
5. Komu - ran Paris
6. Yamauchi - ran Osaka
7. Timofeyeva - Hamburg
8. Simon - Osaka in January
9. Ait Salem - London
10. Kosgei - London
So, of the 20 top finishers, 14 ran a marathon in March or later.
C.C.C.P. wrote:
Oh no, short-changed! They only have like three years to get a qualifier. Anyone who's got a shot at making the team will qualify, they'd do it even if they had a year less.
We're talking about the women here, many of whom may want to have kids in that potential 22 month qualifying span (<2 years) AND could make the team (cough cough Kara G., who isn't even qualified yet). If the men run Houston, they're getting <3 years to qualify.
ming ding xiong wrote:
Steve Shuman wrote:Boston, at four months, is too quick a turnaround -- the trials, for either the men or women, are too competitive for the athletes to give much less than full training and effort for the trials and then to have to be at peak again in four months is tough.We talked about this in 2008. If you look at the 2008 Beijing Olympic Marathon, almost all of the top finishers ran spring marathons.
1. Wanjiru - ran London
2. Gharib - didn't run anything
3. Kebede - ran Paris
4. Merga - ran London
5. Lel - ran London
6. Rothlin - ran Tokyo in February
7. Asfaw - ran Boston
8. Asmerom - ran Otsu, Japan in March
9. Ritz - I don't think he ran one
10. Hall - ran London
On the women's side:
1. Dita - ran London
2. Ndereba - nothing
3. Zhou - ran a pre-Olympic marathon in Beijing in April
4. Zhu - ran the same pre-Olympic marathon
5. Komu - ran Paris
6. Yamauchi - ran Osaka
7. Timofeyeva - Hamburg
8. Simon - Osaka in January
9. Ait Salem - London
10. Kosgei - London
So, of the 20 top finishers, 14 ran a marathon in March or later.
This is a great point. Boston is not too close IF YOU TOOK THE FALL OFF. The problem is for those athletes that run fall-spring-Olympics. It is the triple that destroys people,
not good wrote:
C.C.C.P. wrote:Oh no, short-changed! They only have like three years to get a qualifier. Anyone who's got a shot at making the team will qualify, they'd do it even if they had a year less.
We're talking about the women here, many of whom may want to have kids in that potential 22 month qualifying span (<2 years) AND could make the team (cough cough Kara G., who isn't even qualified yet). If the men run Houston, they're getting <3 years to qualify.
So the window should be larger to accommodate fertility factors? Are you fucking kidding me? If she wants kids she should be able to conceive before or after the qualifying window if she could within it.
The marathon trial qualifier window opened up Jan. 1, 2010, and closes 30 days before the trials race. This excludes the one-day window that was Twin Cities in fall 2009.
So qualifiers have to be run within 22-28 months, depending on which cities win out. And it would be nice if they could make that decision sometime soon, since it definitely changes racing schedules. New York would mean a lot of people posting qualifying times next spring, but Houston/Boston both leave next fall open for qualifying as well. Sure, you could try to qualify at one of the few early fall races for New York but who wants to wait that long?
Even just 18 months should be long enough for anyone who's going to really be a player in the race.
There are plenty of people who can run 215-218 while working a day job in a less-than-ideal running climate, but who are not in the 'relocate for winter and get into 210 shape' category.
A couple of thoughts...anybody who beleives they have a serious shot at the OG is doing the work. That work will incude acclimitization. Northern runners will move to the south, southerners north, flatlanders to altitude, etc. Everybody else is invited to the party, but don't complain about the beer being served.
That being said, moving from southern heat and humidity to autumnal type conditions has proven to be beneficial to performance. Moving from winter to heat and humidity will definetly have an adverse effect.
Someone should have told Ryan Hall that before he ran London in 08.
1984--Marathon Trials in Buffalo--window was open Boston'83 to Boston '84--qualifying time 2:19:04---235 qualifiers
But that was when sport was a sport and men were men
Here's a question. How do you know what it takes to qualify for the Olympic Trials in the marathon? I searched all over the USATF site and couldn't find anything on the 2012 Olympic Trials.
Thanks.
The knock on the current LDR types is that despite an administrator in the NO and many more "chiefs", there is too much behind the curtain activity and not anywhere near enough communication.
Google Google Google Google Google.
the dude with the funny hat wrote:
Wait a second, Houston would be terrible! Because those of us who live and train in cold winter climates would be doing our last 8 weeks of buildup to the trials in either sub-freezing temps or on a treadmill.
Move somewhere else to train numb nutz....
I can't take 2mo off my day job to relocate for training. Although yes, my nuts do get numb training where I live.