Anyone on the German Fan Train a little less of a fan with him ducking NCAA's?

dylan383 wrote:

If he's running for OSU, then he should compete in this meet, barring any physical problems.

One never ceases to be amazed at the complete lack of understanding the bigger picture that can be found on letsrun.

We're talking NCAA indoors here. Not even NCAA outdoors or USATF or the Olympics.

Look what this does for OSU, any kid thinking about where to go in the next few years can now see that this school will give him the opportunity to race for his country, should he qualify. That maybe they will be more interested in his longer term development than cranking him through 4 or 5 years of NCAA competition and then tossing him on the heap when he's done.

If, in the opinion of GF and his coach, he would be better served by skipping a single year of NCAA indoor champs in order to race at Worlds, and the OSU Athletic Director buys in, then what issue can people here have? What do you think looks better for OSU to the rest of the world, that they have an NCAA indoor medalist or a World Cross-Country medalist?

It's not as if GF is looking for easier competition by competing at the World Cross-Country championships. Any bets on how the 5000m PBs of the top 12 there compare with the NCAA field?

I've been thinking the same thing. If German is held back at Worlds, he'll probably finish very strong and end up top-10 but he won't have had a shot to do his best. With his combination of stamina and mile speed, there's no reason for him to let anyone in that race run away from him. So just let him go out top-5 and actually "mix it up" with the world's best juniors, something he (and all of us LetsRun fan-boys) has been looking forward to doing since NCAA Cross.

It's indoors. He's already at the level where he's going to be welcome on the European summer track circuit. You can't race for 4 seasons, so it's Europe vs. indoors.

Besides, he's not really letting his team down, as OSU doesn't really have a track team. They're all distance guys, just trying to run as fast as they can. The entire program is premised on the notion that XC is the team event, and the rest of the year is for running well as an individual. It's different for someone like Rupp, who can help his team go for the title.

As far as doing both, there's a difference between running at Washington and running in a championship. The other races are fitness tests. He was soloing a steady effort, and he happened to run really fast. At NCAAs, it would be a war. Win or lose, there's no doubt it would be a tougher race, both physically and mentally. Although he may want to do both, Dave has enough experience to know that you can't run those kinds of races that often.

fresh perspective wrote:

um... Rupp skipped all of indoors last year in preparation for his summer season without so much as one complaint from the boards.

There's a big difference, genius. Rupp was prioritizing the Olympics several months away, and as a result the entire indoor season was a tertiary consideration. In stark contrast, Fernandez just finished running in his indoor conference meet, but now he is going to skip the NCAA championships in favor of a competition that is being held only two weeks afterwards!

It just seems like people here are bitter that Fernandez has different priorities than the message board junkies.

Dave Smith thinks that heavy racing and travel one week prior to him leaving is too much unnecessary stress. And he wasn\'t racing at Conference, that much is clear.

no need to attack me personally due to our contrary views.

This issue will be long forgotten in 3 or 4 years. Maybe in the near future German will run 3k/5k/1600(DMR) at NCAA indoors, helping his team contend for an indoor championship.

Gosh, everyone needs to calm down and let the kid race. Running is foremost about having fun as an 18 year old; if running World Cross is important to him, let him do it!

Doesn't he have enough expectations and critics already? Even though he has surprised everyone in the distance running community.

peter lorre wrote:

If Rupp was doing this the howls would echo across the boards...

This is one thing I thought. Rupp did redshirt last year, but he had already racked up a lot of runner ups, all american honors and ncaa cross team title. And that was for the OLYMPICS and he knew he could make the team.

The year before that he ran a FULL indoor (with NCAA's) FULL outdoor (with NCAA's) and then went to USA's and qualified for worlds. Then came back from worlds and had a shortened cross season to help the team get the title.

He recently said he'll do whatever Vin wants him to at NCAA indoor. He's obviously doubling 5K and 3K, but he said if Vin wants him on the DMR he's on, no questions asked. Even if it means he can't win the 3K.

That's what scholarships are awarded for, that's what college running is about.

I still don't get the thing about world cross. It has been stated repeatedly that it is 2 weekends apart. Derrick is doubling 5K-3K at NCAA's and still going to worlds. Luke is doing the 5K. It's ducking to miss the NCAA meet.

If German medals at world xc, then all will be well in Letsrun land.

If Derrick or Luke beat him (or get anywhere near him for that matter) the sh*tstorm that will come down will be unbelievable.

fresh perspective = stale wrote:

...but now he is going to skip the NCAA championships in favor of a competition that is being held only two weeks afterwards!

Exactly, they are only two weeks apart and he'll return from indoor nationals with an itinerary that has him leaving for Jordan only 7-8 days later. Seems like a great call by his coach.

In essence, he's skipping kiddie nationals to compete against the best in the World.

Zat0pek wrote:

[quote]Yanqui wrote:

He's not "ducking" anybody.

Sure he is. He's ducking the best AMERICAN collegians in favor of competing against the best Juniors in the WORLD. *rolls eyes*

The reason it's ducking is because if does NCAA's it's WIN or LOSE. It's not finish somewhere in the middle and "rub elbows" with various african JUNIORS.

In case you didn't notice, Rupp was beating some very classy african SENIORS at the World Championships and Olympics over the past couple years. Guys who have run under 13:00 and 27:00. The ethiopians he was mixing it up with in the 3K and 5K this indoor season are no slouches either. If Fernandez can't prove that he can win here, why should he run in the middle (hopefully) of a bunch of African juniors?

Or how about this, why not see if he can win here first in at least one event, then go on to worlds. If the guys IS as amazing as some of you think he is, it surely won't hurt him to race one 3K against guys who are doubling and tripling 2 weeks before your next race.

Only on letsrun. It's unbelievable to hear people criticizing Fernandez for choosing to represent his country at the WORLD championships over the NCAA indoor championships. Pathetic.

800 I agree with you 100%.

You guys on here that keep saying Derick and Luke are doubling too and then hitting worlds. Here is the increadible ignorance on your parts; GF has a good chance to win the mile and 3k, those two do not have a chance to win the 3k or the 5k. That is the difference!

Like 800 said, racing both of those to "win" then trying to recoup for worlds is not going to go well. Derick and Luke will not be within 20 seconds of GF at worlds.

Saying he is ducking is moronic. The plan was to skip indoor nationals since cross you fools! Smith nor GF expected 3:55, the plan since early cross was world cross. So he runs better than anyone expected and everyone here thinks they can be the armchair quarterback.

GF gets no worse than 6th, the "doublers" get no better than 30th. So shut the F$ck up, and let GF do what he planed to do since Sept.

wankerland wrote:

In essence, he's skipping kiddie nationals to compete against the best in the World.

These guys are good, yes, but this is getting a little out of hand. Bekele aint in the junior races any more. Yes there will be guys in there who go onto run 13:0X or 27:1X this season or next, but Sam Chelanga and Galen Rupp will too. In fact Sam and Galen are probaly ready for that now. I'm not convinced that he was going to beat Michael Coe if they had a re-match at 3K.

At least when you race NCAA's there is no scapegoat. You either came away the winner or not. Jordan will leave everybody wondering what the hell the perfomance meant.

There are only 2 ways to know success or failure in Jordan.

1) Win it or acutally compete for the win (if this happens we can all go out an buy lottery tickets and retire).

2) Get beat buy Chris, Luke or Gregson or be even remotely close to them since the indoor "checkpoints" indicate that he should beat them all by at least 30 seconds.

Ritz and Teg got 3rd and 5th, but it's not like that catupulted them into the best runners in America. People are sucking this "mixing it up with the world - juniors" thing to hard.

Wow you 4:00.1 milers at Oregon sure are bad sports.

If you wanted to run worlds, then why don't you? --- oh that's right --- you can't.

Because you're stuck at a program that's all about Vincent Lananna.

The "kiddie" nats was a joke, a poke at the thread referring to D2 as "baby" nats.

Likewise, people are sucking this indoor nationals, "you either come away the winner or not" thing too hard.

He needs to beat Derrick and company by 30 seconds to be a success?! Where did you come up with that sh*t? He was only 19 seconds ahead of him at US Juniors, yet the indoor results "indicate that he should beat them all by at least 30 seconds."

He needs to beat Derrick and company by 30 seconds to be a success?! Where did you come up with that sh*t? He was only 19 seconds ahead of him at US Juniors, yet the indoor results "indicate that he should beat them all by at least 30 seconds."[/quote]

There's no science to it and of course it's just a number, but he put 19 seconds on Derrick over the last 2K at usa's. He wasn't supposed to take off before that, so common sense would say if he goes earlier, say from the start, that the gap should be much bigger. And if he doesn't go a lot harder from the start at jrs. he will be racing for the late teens.

Also I was speaking to some of his adoring fans that think he's ready to take down Rupp over 5K right now, which would mean he'd need to be in at LEAST 13:12 shape, which would be about 30 seconds ahead of Chris and Luke for 5K. So how could he be that far ahead of them at 5K and not 8K?

Worlds > college

Fernandez > Rupp

OSU > Oregon

A few points to try and clear things up.

GF is not dodging anyone by not going to NCAAs. I agree there are some very solid guys racing there but everyone who makes the top 10 at worlds is probably better then anyone else GF would be racing at the NCAAs. There is just simply far better competition at world xc. Why not test himself against the best in the world if he has the opportunity? Give him a chance to represent America and get some more international experience.

This is GFs last year being able to run at world xc and he has 3-4 more years to come back and win NCAAs.

Sam Chelanga and Galen Rupp are too old for world junior xc so comparing them to 17, 18, 19 year old 13.0X 5k and 27.1X 10k African runners is just silly.

Aman is totally different to wherever Ritz and Teg ran. It was a shit show mud feast there. Aman will be dry and fast. Pretty much an 8k track race. About as different as you could ask for.

Good luck to GF at worlds