limptestes wrote:
I recently bought some Tribulus Terrestris, which is an herb that has been found to increase testosterone levels. I did this because I have read that long distance running can lower testosterone levels.
If this does increase my testosterone levels, what effects am I likely to see in my training? Faster recovery?
you will run with a constant boner.
So you guys don't think it will do anything? What about Yohimbe?
limptestes wrote:
So you guys don't think it will do anything? What about Yohimbe?
Sorry if I wasn't clear. I don't know about the herb you bought. I do know about the effects I've experienced using ZMA to address the question you are asking.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ZMA_(supplement)
My response to it were a more complete recovery, better sleep, more aggressiveness in workouts and races. I am a marathoner and found it beneficial.
erik
most of the things cited are libido enhancers (yohimbe and trib.) people naturally assume that if their libidos are up, testosterone is up - which isn't necessarily the case. also, if libido is up and mr. happy is happy no one ccomplains
Someone said Red Meat should be eaten to raise testosterone. That WOULD be true except that it turns out estrogen levels in men are 50% higher than they were 30 years ago BECAUSE estrogen growth hormones are put in cattle to fatten them up, so only take that advice with Organic Red Meat or it will have the Opposite Effect for sure.
Is that really true?, wow that would seem to have some serious implications, cancers etc...
For some 'light' reading look up the relationship between cholesterol, cortisol, and testosterone.
Research the effect of training on testosterone levels. Research the effect of high intensity training and extended low intensity training.
In a nutshell: If you feel you need help with recovery or find yourself injured often I would say trying to increase your testosterone production would be a good thing.
Athletes, even runners, have used PEDs to increase testosterone production for eons. If you can do it naturally then by all means go ahead.
You want to know the effect of testosterone on running? It is a POSITIVE one. In fact the effect of testosterone on LIFE in general is a pretty positive one.
Alan
Listen to Alan!
BTW running a marathon doubles your cortisol levels and halves your testosterone, even a day later.
But save you money. ZMA only works on athletes with a zinc deficiency. Trib does little, or nothing. Same with yohimbine unless you are using it transdermally for fat loss.
Reality check-- no supplement has the same effect as testosterone.
But test is illegal and unethical for competitive athletes to take.
With Salazar, or any other elite coach working with professional athletes, I can't imagine they aren't getting very regular blood work and supplementing not only with testosterone, but with thyroid, to bring both up to "optimal levels," but still within negative test range.
They might pass tests, but that's still cheating.
Now if a mid-40's master wants to start doctor supervised HRT because his levels have crashed and training hard is a lifestyle, I say go for it. Just know you'll be doing it the rest of your life, and don't compete seriously i.e break AG records, against athletes who aren't on HRT.
Most ethical doctors will not prescribe HRT unless you have a real deficiency. Testosterone supplementation to a male with family prostate cancer history CAN be like adding miracle grow to cancerous cells. So if you can find a doc to prescribe replacement therapy (mine wouldn't), be sure to monitor your prostate...PSA levels, digital tests...frequently! (and if you find a doc that will prescribe, let me know...being 50 kinda sucks)
go to an "anti-aging clinic" they'll prescirbe test or hgh for that matter.. you just have to pay outta pocket.
Runningart2004 wrote:
For some 'light' reading look up the relationship between cholesterol, cortisol, and testosterone.
Research the effect of training on testosterone levels. Research the effect of high intensity training and extended low intensity training.
In a nutshell: If you feel you need help with recovery or find yourself injured often I would say trying to increase your testosterone production would be a good thing.
Athletes, even runners, have used PEDs to increase testosterone production for eons. If you can do it naturally then by all means go ahead.
You want to know the effect of testosterone on running? It is a POSITIVE one. In fact the effect of testosterone on LIFE in general is a pretty positive one.
Alan
Isn't high Test associated with prostate cancer and heart disease?
The fine print...
Short term impact of Tribulus terrestris intake on doping control analysis of endogenous steroids
Christophe Saudan, Norbert Baume, Caroline Emery, Emmanuel Strahm, Martial Saugy
Received 12 September 2007; received in revised form 9 January 2008; accepted 10 January 2008. published online 18 February 2008.
Tribulus terrestris is a nutritional supplement highly debated regarding its physiological and actual effects on the organism. The main claimed effect is an increase of testosterone anabolic and androgenic action through the activation of endogenous testosterone production. Even if this biological pathway is not entirely proven, T. terrestris is regularly used by athletes. Recently, the analysis of two female urine samples by GC/C/IRMS (gas chromatography/combustion/isotope-ratio-mass-spectrometry) conclusively revealed the administration of exogenous testosterone or its precursors, even if the testosterone glucuronide/epitestosterone glucuronide (T/E) ratio and steroid marker concentrations were below the cut-off values defined by World Anti-Doping Agency (WADA). To argue against this adverse analytical finding, the athletes recognized having used T. terrestris in their diet. In order to test this hypothesis, two female volunteers ingested 500mg of T. terrestris, three times a day and for two consecutive days. All spot urines were collected during 48h after the first intake. The 13C/12C ratio of ketosteroids was determined by GC/C/IRMS, the T/E ratio and DHEA concentrations were measured by GC/MS and LH concentrations by radioimmunoassay. None of these parameters revealed a significant variation or increased above the WADA cut-off limits. Hence, the short-term treatment with T. terrestris showed no impact on the endogenous testosterone metabolism of the two subjects.
The stuff is a fraud. No scientific evidence that it has any impact on athletic performance.
Not your Doc wrote:
Most ethical doctors will not prescribe HRT unless you have a real deficiency. Testosterone supplementation to a male with family prostate cancer history CAN be like adding miracle grow to cancerous cells.
You are not up on the research on TRT and prostate cancer.
limptestes wrote:
I recently bought some Tribulus Terrestris, which is an herb that has been found to increase testosterone levels.
Doesn't work for this purpose. If you want something nonscheduled, get Clomid. If you want something better but scheduled, get testosterone.
dotato wrote:
I've struggled with low T for years, and about four months ago began supplementing with ZMA.
In my experiment of one, it works. I can't explain how or why, but it does. I find I recover more fully, but not necessarily quicker. I also find increased stamina, both on the road and with sex. I'm more aggressive in workouts (i.e., hills, weights), as well as racing.
I have a bona-fide testosterone deficiency, which this product appears to have helped me immeasurably. I'm 40 and a competitive marathoner.
ZMA will do nothing for people who are not deficient in either zinc or magnesium.
http://www.ergo-log.com/zma.htmlRunningart2004 wrote:
For some 'light' reading look up the relationship between cholesterol, cortisol, and testosterone.
Research the effect of training on testosterone levels. Research the effect of high intensity training and extended low intensity training.
In a nutshell: If you feel you need help with recovery or find yourself injured often I would say trying to increase your testosterone production would be a good thing.
Athletes, even runners, have used PEDs to increase testosterone production for eons.
Yes, they've used testosterone to increase testosterone for ages;)
As to the beginning of the post, two obvious points: eat plenty of saturated fat and get enough sleep. If you are waking up to an alarm clock, you are probably not getting enough sleep.
llllll wrote:
Isn't high Test associated with prostate cancer and heart disease?
Associated, yes. Incidence of drowning is associated with ice cream consumption. Association does not equal causation.
Anti-Estrogen for Muscle wrote:
Someone said Red Meat should be eaten to raise testosterone. That WOULD be true except that it turns out estrogen levels in men are 50% higher than they were 30 years ago BECAUSE estrogen growth hormones are put in cattle to fatten them up, so only take that advice with Organic Red Meat or it will have the Opposite Effect for sure.
Noooo. Minimal amounts of active estrogenic compounds are ingested via beef. The most estrogenic aspect of modern life, for men, is the body composition engendered by a high carbohydrate modern Western diet. Nothing men typically eat produces estrogen like their own bodyfat.
Mr. Cojones wrote:
That root is useless. If you really want to raise your testosterone levels, consume as much soy protein as possible.
Actually soy protein is bad for you, at least in higher quantities. It blocks protein absorption and lowers testosterone, as it is a phytoestrogen (plant estrogens that mimic + bind to human hormone receptors). Tribulus terrestris has also never been shown to actually help, results may vary. There are much better supplements such as Maca, Icariin, holy basil, turmeric, ginger, onion, cardamom, nitric oxide(not for test, but increased energy and blood flow), creatine (debated as whether it helps for long distance, but i have seen it help and it also acts as a painkiller and helps shuttle nutrients), caffeine (works for some, cramps up or burns out others). All of those have been tested, and are safe for most people, but always make sure. Eating enough fats (even "bad fats") is also vital, cholesterol and other fats are the building blocks of all hormones and growth in your body. Do not listen to people who say to cut out fat. Use olive oil and coconut oil, but also get vitamin d (which is a hormone) and some sat/trans fats. Eating enough is also important, diets cause a HUGE drop in hormones. Enough sleep is vital, most athletes know that though. Looking at porn raises test levels greatly, but only for a short time, so do it before you run. Lifting in addition to running will help boost your test, but you will have to eat alot more. Testosterone helps put on more muscle, signals other hormones, and gives you that alpha male mentality, it has a huge physiological effect and increases your sex drive. Testosterone has also been linked to being better at math and spacial perception, although im not sure that just increasing that changes anything, it may have to been in the womb. Test isn't the end all be all though, there are also various growth hormones/factors, such as Human Grown Hormones or Insulin like Growth Factor, all of which are raised by weight lifting or to a lesser extent running depending on the intensity.
Runningart2004 wrote:
For some 'light' reading look up the relationship between cholesterol, cortisol, and testosterone.
Research the effect of training on testosterone levels. Research the effect of high intensity training and extended low intensity training.
In a nutshell: If you feel you need help with recovery or find yourself injured often I would say trying to increase your testosterone production would be a good thing.
Athletes, even runners, have used PEDs to increase testosterone production for eons. If you can do it naturally then by all means go ahead.
You want to know the effect of testosterone on running? It is a POSITIVE one. In fact the effect of testosterone on LIFE in general is a pretty positive one.
Alan
You guys are all looking for an easy shortcut to raise T levels. The secret: weight lifting that targets large muscle groups (so not something like bicep curls. The bicep is a tiny muscle). So, compound exercises. THese are SCIENTIFICALLY PROVEN to raise Testosterone levels. Perhaps alan can link a few studies for us. There is also a good chance you will get ripped in the long term (don't worry, it won't affect your running unless you look like arnold. Look at solinsky, webb 2007, snell, etc.)
A testosterone boosting cycle that targets most of the body's muscles:
1. Push ups, Pull ups (3-6 sets of each depending on how much time you want to spend)
2. Rest
3. Squats (4-6 sets)
4. Rest.
Yes, that's it. This WILL raise your T levels (something that every runner should think about). Do the pushups from your fists to get an extended range of motion (instead of from palms) and don't be scared to squat low (for good form, search youtube).
THe entire upper body is worked by the push ups and pull ups. The abs and obliques are used a lot as stabilizers. The quads, hamstrings, glutes, inner legs and lower back are used by the squats. The calves are worked a little by squatting and a little by running (they can't grow that much anyway).
If this answer isn't good enough for you, you didn't understand it.