Why don't more B standard runners go out extremely hard?

why is everyone giving Gabe so much credit for running a gutsy race? i'm not sure exactly when he took the lead but they came though 400 at ~61, and with him taking the lead they were still over 2min at 800m. it's not like he really went for it and dropped the pace down, did he?

I think that there is some kind of "herding" thing. I was at the HEPS and watched, in a preliminary heat, the slower runners allow a slow pace to develop. The result was that the favorites "kicked" the last 200 meters and advanced easily to the next heat. I asked one of the slower runners why she didn't do something differently. She just looked at me without an answer. Then, the person I was with asked her the same question and she simply didn't have an answer.

So, at least Gabe "died with his boots on".

777 wrote:

and then rag on the B-standard guys for going ahead and using good championship strategy! I don't understand!

Well I guess I don't understand either. Are you implying that "good championship strategy" is running too slow to get into the Olympics?

If he did get "blown away" the last 1/4 mile, then he didn't deserve to be there anyway right?

Isn't the point of running in the Olympic trials final heat, you know, getting into the Olympics?

In the women's steeplechase, Jenny Barringer raced to make the team rather than win. She knew that Willard, Anderson and her were the class of the field, so she set a pace that only the three of them could hold. She was the reason the Willard and Anderson set PRs of 7 and 9 seconds, rspectively. Barringer still made the team in a convincing third. This wasn't a strategy to win, but she did make the team. Of course, this can only be done in a race that has a small number of athletes that are much better than the rest of the field.

Barringer never had a chance to beat Willard. It looks like Anderson has made nice gains so I think it is improbable that she could beat Anderson either although that's arguable. If you don't think Barringer ran to win, you're crazy. Leading in the steeple can have its advantages. Barringer is lucky Willard didn't lead. She would have lost by twice as much as she did.

Good Championship strategy is finishing like Will Leer rather than Gabe Jennings. 20MPH winds don't allow PR's or "A" standards for guys at that level.

Of course, a bunch of elite runners and their coaches must be wrong, if they contradict the "Go Pre" mentality of LetsRun anons.

Ohio guy wrote:

There is such a fine line at such a high level of racing that leading is almost a sure recipe for disaster. See '08 Olympic trials 1500's led by Jennings & Gallo.

except Jennings didn't push the pace...at all.

He came thru 800 in 2:00 flat.

He spent his wad just getting to the finals. Adam Goucher on the other hand...

Sure, Will Leer had good championship strategy, hats off to him, he had a very good race, but for other athletes like Gabe, it wasn't about finishing well in the national finals, it was about going for the Olympic spot. Admittedly, he didn't pick up the pace enough, and it was pretty much too little, too late after the 47-second 300, but he had a better shot at making the team going out in front opposed to hanging off the back of the pack while going through 800 in 2:05.

And the wind really wasn't much of a factor.

Yeah, Yoder-Begley had a poor championship strategy, didn't she.

The wind was quoted as a factor by almost every B-standard athlete interviewed as to why they didn't take it out. Anyone who discounts this is ignorant of the reality of a championship race in these conditions. Gabe was having to work far harder than 2:00 effort while in the lead.

Just curious why everyone is making Jennings out to be some kind a of ballsy, really went for it runner. Like stated above he didnt pick up the pace. I dont get it. I mean if I was that caliber of runner(which I am no where near, so no need to start bashing me) being 2 steps in front of a slow pace isnt really going for it. In my eyes.

I just want a straight answer as to why everyone is saying Jennings went for it. (When really he didnt)

It doesn't seem like any of you understand the 1500. It goes out fast that first 100 no matter what. The men were probably 14 at the 100, which means their next 200 was 33. Gabe then took over and ran a 500 in 1:13 which is about 57 pace, so actually he picked up the pace a lot. Added to that is the fact there was a stiff wind in the back stretch, so right after he took it over he ran into the wind. He absolutely picked up the pace. You have to basically disregard the first 100 in a 1500.

athlete wrote:

You might feel a little different if your DFL was being nationally televised.

So only a bunch of slower-than-you-runners on letsrun would then diss you for coming in DFL? Better to go for glory and try to give yourself a shot at the Olympics than defeat yourself from the start. These are the Olympic Trials, not yer plain ole US Champs...

If runners that need the "A" don't go for it, they're guaranteed to sit at home for the olympics. On a related note, if Billy Mills hadn't gone out around his PR for the first 5000m of the 10000m, he probably would never have won a gold medal. According to letsrun, his strategy was suicidal, but the dude has a gold medal and that's nothing to @#&$ with!

yetanotherchick - yes, you're right, there is a 99% chance that you'll blow up and crash badly if you're a B standard runner trying to lead the way to an A standard. That's why you don't do it. Because you worked your ass off to get to this moment, and the truth is that if you have the strength to pull off a miracle and hit the A standard by leading from the start (or close to it), then you also have the strength to pull off a miracle and finish the last 1/3 of the race so fast that you get the A standard no matter the pace up till that point.

But it's also the biggest race of your life. So if you can't hit the A standard, then you want to race well.

So you race smart. You go out with the pack, letting someone else do the work. Hoping you'll have that miracle in your legs.

And I'll bet that when that moment arrived, when it was time to go or miss the standard, the athletes in question recognized that they didn't have the strength in their legs - and we're happy to finish as strongly as they could.

Don't forget that there were heats.

Don't forget that leading a race adds seconds to your finish time (that is, it means that in order for say, Will Leer or Gabe Jennings to run a 3:36 from the front, they'd have to be capable of running around 3:33 that day - or maybe 3:31 given the wind on the backstretch ... and if you've never felt that wind in Eugene, you have no idea how strong it is).

It's easy to say someone else should have "gone for it." Except that this is the truth: they all did. They just didn't do it in the stupidest way possible - by running from the front. Instead, they ran smart and hoped to have the strength ... and when they didn't, they finished as well as they could.

You don't get to be a top runner by making stupid mistakes. And you sure as hell don't hit the A standard and make an Olympic Team by running like some high school freshman in his or her first big meet.

SoCal, quit muddying the waters with facts and experience. Some of these guys commenting have broken 4:30 for 1600 meters, and they did it by going balls out! You old guys need to make way for the superior will of the new wave of Prefontaines!

On a more serious note, it is notable that in a race where everyone was in it with 200 meteres to go, the three favorites prevailed (leaving out the wild card-Webb). This is an indication that the heats + finals system was very effective in sorting out the runners by strength as well as tactics.

777 wrote:

Let's not forget, the OT ARE the US Championships this year. So, despite what NBC might have you think, 4th is not "the worst spot." 4th is better than 5th, etc etc etc all the way down.

Exactly. There is $$$ to consider for placing.