Pre Fan wrote:@ 10k, I'd bet on Pre against Rupp on any day of the week.
There is no way in hell pre would have beaten Rupp on the day Rupp ran his 2733.
1354.5 for the first half. 1339 for the second half. Pre couldn't do that. Sorry...just no way it would happen no matter how much you love pre.
There's no way of knowing, however I think you're crazy to discount him that easily.
1354 would have been a comfortable pace for the first half for what was Pre's best 10k. If you think he would have let little Galen run away from him, well, you're dreaming.
He would have loved to have someone running with him, pushing him. How close was his nearest competitor in that race? Rupp had help the whole way.
15 second drop over 5k. Please.
Andy Wheating is on pace to be one of the best runners in the country. He will be the "Buster" of the United States and deserves a nickname to match. I propose "Gwap," does anyone have other ideas?
Pre Fan wrote:
There's no way of knowing, however I think you're crazy to discount him that easily.
Pre ran his 27:43 pm a crap track, alone, in an all-comers meet. Rupp was hoovered to his 27:33 on a hyperfast track in perfect conditions.
Pre was 10 times the runners Rupp is. Any questions?
Vs. Fresno St., Stanford 3/21/70 Fresno 2 Mile 8:40.0 1st
Vs. Texas, El Paso 3/28/70 El Paso 3 Mile 13:48.8 1st
Vs. Washington 4/4/70 Seattle Mile 4:03.2 1st
Vs. Washington 4/4/70 Seattle 2 Mile 8:51.6 1st
Vs. California 4/11/70 Berkeley 3 Mile 13:30.6 1st
Vs. UCLA 4/18/70 Eugene Mile 4:05.3 1st
Vs. UCLA 4/18/70 Eugene 2 Mile 8:46.4 1st
Vs. Washington St. 4/25/70 Eugene 3 Mile 13:12.8 1st
Vs. Oregon St. 5/2/70 Eugene Mile 4:00.4 1st
Northern Division 5/9/70 Seattle 3 Mile 13:32.0 1st
Pac-8 Championships 5/16/70 Los Angeles 3 Mile 13:27.8 1st
Oregon Twighlight 6/5/70 Eugene Mile 3:57.4 3rd
NCAA Championships 6/20/70 Des Moines 3 Mile 13:22.0 1st
AAU Championships 6/26/70 Bakersfield 3 Mile 13:26.0 5th
U.S. vs. West Germany 7/16/70 Stuttgart 5000 Meters 13:39.6 2nd
U.S. vs. U.S.S.R. 7/24/70 Leningrad 5000 Meters 13:49.4 2nd
International 7/26/70 Moscow 1500 Meters 3:44.9 1st
Postal 12/12/70 Eugene 3 Mile 13:25.6 1st
Quadrangular 3/20/71 Eugene 2 Mile 8:33.2 1st
Vs. San Diego St. 3/27/71 San Diego Mile 4:00.2 1st
Vs. Stanford 4/3/71 Eugene 3 Mile 13:01.6 1st
Vs. Washington 4/10/71 Eugene Mile 4:02.6 1st
Vs. Washington 4/10/71 Eugene 2 Mile 8:36.2 1st
Vs. California 4/17/71 Eugene 3 Mile 13:34.0 1st
Vs. UCLA 4/24/71 Westwood Mile 3:59.1 1st
Vs. Oregon St. 5/8/71 Corvallis 2 Mile 8:42.4 1st
Northern Division 5/15/71 Pullman 2 Mile 8:42.4 1st
Pac-8 Championships 5/22/71 Seattle Mile 4:01.5 1st
Pac-8 Championships 5/22/71 Seattle 3 Mile 13:18.0 1st
Oregon Twighlight 6/6/71 Eugene Mile 3:57.4 2nd
NCAA Prelim Heat 6/17/71 Seattle 3 Mile 13:34.6 1st
NCAA Finals 6/19/71 Seattle 3 Mile 13:20.2 1st
AAU Championships 6/25/71 Eugene 3 Mile 12:58.6 1st
Vs. U.S.S.R. All-Stars 7/3/71 Berkeley 5000 Meters 13:30.4(AR) 1st
Vs. Africa 7/16/71 Durham 5000 Meters 13:57.6 1st
Pan Am Games 8/2/71 Cali 5000 Meters 13:52.6 1st
Vs. Fresno St. 3/18/72 Fresno 2 Mile 8:55.4 1st
All Comers 3/25/72 Bakersfield 6 Mile 27:22.4(NCAA) 1st
Oregon Invitational 4/1/72 Eugene 2 Mile 8:35.8 1st
Vs. Washington 4/8/72 Seattle Mile 4:07.3 1st
Vs. Nebraska 4/15/72 Lincoln 2 Mile 8:35.2 1st
Oregon Twighlight 4/23/72 Eugene Mile 3:56.7 1st
Vs. Washington St. 4/29/72 Eugene 5000 Meters 13:29.6(AR) 1st
Vs. Oregon St. 5/6/72 Eugene 1500 Meters 3:39.8 1st
Pac-8 Championships 5/20/72 Stanford 3 Mile 13:32.2 1st
NCAA Prelim Heat 6/1/72 Eugene 5000 Meters 14:01.4 1st
NCAA Finals 6/3/72 Eugene 5000 Meters 13:31.4 1st
Rose Festival 6/24/72 Gresham 3000 Meters 7:45.8(AR) 1st
Olympic Trials Prelim Heat 7/6/72 Eugene 5000 Meters 13:51.2 1st
Olympic Trials Finals 7/9/72 Eugene 5000 Meters 13:22.8(AR) 1st
Bislett Games 8/2/72 Oslo 1500 Meters 3:39.4 2nd
Bislett Games 8/3/72 Oslo 3000 Meters 7:44.2(AR) 1st
Pre-Olympic 8/24/72 Munich 2 Mile 8:19.4(AR) 1st
Olympic Prelim Heat 9/7/72 Munich 5000 Meters 13:32.6 2nd
Olympic Finals 9/10/72 Munich 5000 Meters 13:28.3 4th
Zauli Memorial 9/13/72 Rome 5000 Meters 13:26.4 2nd
Coca-Cola 9/15/72 London 2 Mile 8:24.8 2nd
All Comers 3/17/73 Eugene 2000 5:06.2 1st
All Comers 3/24/73 Bakersfield 6 Mile 27:09.4 1st
Oregon Invitational 3/31/73 Eugene 2 Mile 8:31.8 1st
Vs. Washington 4/7/73 Eugene Mile 4:03.2 1st
Quadrangular 4/14/73 Eugene Mile 3:56.8 1st
Quadrangular 4/14/73 Eugene 3 Mile 13:06.4 1st
Oregon Twighlight 4/27/73 Eugene Mile 3:55.0 1st
Vs. Oregon St. 5/5/73 Corvallis 3 Mile 13:27.2 1st
Pac-8 Championships 5/19/73 Eugene 3 Mile 13:10.4 1st
Oregon Twighlight II 5/29/73 Eugene 2 Mile 8:24.6 1st
NCAA Prelim Heat 6/7/73 Baton Rouge 3 Mile 13:19.0 1st
NCAA Finals 6/9/73 Baton Rouge 3 Mile 13:05.3 1st
AAU Prelim Heat 6/14/73 Bakersfield 3 Mile 13:17.8 1st
AAU Finals 6/16/73 Bakersfield 3 Mile 12:53.4 1st
Hayward Restoration 6/20/73 Eugene Mile 3:54.6 2nd
International 6/23/73 Helsinki 1500 Meters 3:43.1 3rd
World Games 6/27/73 Helsinki 5000 Meters 13:22.4(AR) 2nd
World Games 6/28/73 Helsinki 1500 Meters 3:38.1 11th
International 7/1/73 Kajaani 1500 Meters 3:46.5 2nd
International 7/2/73 Joensuu 1500 Meters 3:48.2 3rd
International 7/4/73 Oulu 5000 Meters 13:40.6 1st
Vs. W. Germany, Sweden 7/12/73 Munich 5000 Meters 13:23.8 2nd
International 7/15/73 Louvain 5000 Meters 13:35.2 2nd
JV Invitational 4/6/74 Eugene Mile 4:07.2 1st
JV Invitational 4/6/74 Eugene 2 Mile 8:49.4 1st
Mt. Hood Relays 4/20/74 Gresham 2 Mile 8:30.4 1st
Oregon Twighlight 4/27/74 Eugene 10000 Meters 27:43.6(AR) 1st
Bakersfield Classic 5/18/74 Bakersfield 2 Mile 8:34.4 1st
Hilites 5/30/74 Corvallis 2 Mile 8:35.8 1st
Hayward Restoration 6/8/74 Eugene 3 Mile 12:51.4(AR) 1st
International 6/18/74 Tampere 3000 Meters 7:55.8 1st
International 6/20/74 Kauhava 3000 Meters 8:00.4 1st
International 6/22/74 Saarijarvi 3000 Meters 8:07.4 1st
World Games 6/26/74 Helsinki 5000 Meters 13:21.9(AR) 2nd
International 7/2/74 Milan 3000 Meters 7:42.6(AR) 2nd
International 7/9/74 Varkaus 3000 Meters 7:57.4 1st
International 7/14/74 Joutseno 5000 Meters 13:55.6 1st
July Games 7/18/74 Stockholm 2 Mile 8:18.4(AR) 3rd
All Comers 9/3/74 Eugene Mile 3:58.3 1st
International 9/10/74 Helsinki 5000 Meters 13:27.4 3rd
Coca-Cola 9/13/74 London 2 Mile Did Not Finish DNF
Oregon Twighlight 4/26/75 Eugene 10000 Meters 28:09.4 1st
Finnish Tour 5/4/75 Madras 3000 Meters 8:26.4 1st
Finnish Tour 5/9/75 Coos Bay 2000 Meters 5:01.4(AR) 1st
Finnish Tour 5/15/75 Burnaby 5000 Meters 13:46.8 1st
California Relays 5/24/75 Modesto 2 Mile 8:36.4 1st
NCAA Prep 5/29/75 Eugene 5000 Meters 13:23.8 1st
vermonster
Pre Fan wrote:
15 second drop over 5k. Please.
Yea...because lot's of runner prs were run with 15 second negative splits! Please yourself.
Over 10000 meters it's not that uncommon to "have a day" when
1.) you don't race the distance often
2.) you start conservatively to ensure you don't die
3.) you're Steve Prefontaine
malmo wrote:
OTC fanclub wrote: can't say "it's early"It's early. Maybe not to you Turkey Trot kings, but to competitive runners it's early.
Yea cause when "it's early" like it is now, its very common for guys to put up high school times en route to championship/Olympic trials. I remember Bekele, Gebreselassie, Tergat, Songok, El Gerrouj putting up similar botched up times too when it was early in the season for them...
Mrr82 wrote:
Pre Fan wrote:@ 10k, I'd bet on Pre against Rupp on any day of the week.There is no way in hell pre would have beaten Rupp on the day Rupp ran his 2733.
1354.5 for the first half. 1339 for the second half. Pre couldn't do that. Sorry...just no way it would happen no matter how much you love pre.
Only a fanboy fool would bet against Pre in this one. Rupp has advantages Pre could never have even dreamed of. Pre had the guts and instinct that Rupp can only wish he had.
This one wouldn't even be close.
Pre knew how to race, rupp only knows how to time trial.
The kid has no balls when it comes to "racing".
rupppfan wrote:
Pre knew how to race, rupp only knows how to time trial.
The kid has no balls when it comes to "racing".
Yea, like when he ran his 2733, running incredibly smart, and outkicking everyone for the win. That timetrialing? I'm a pre fan, but some of you are pathetic and don't know what having balls is. Someone who understands their limits, and paces themselves, understanding how running works and trusting in their ability, has more balls then someone who goes out too hard, ending up hurting their performances.
Then there's the fact Rupp was 20 when he ran his 2733, Pre was 23 when he ran his 2743.
mrr82 wrote:
Then there's the fact Rupp was 20 when he ran his 2733, Pre was 23 when he ran his 2743.
Uhh. Rupp was only 10 days from his 21st birthday.
Professional runner wrote:
mrr82 wrote:Then there's the fact Rupp was 20 when he ran his 2733, Pre was 23 when he ran his 2743.
Uhh. Rupp was only 10 days from his 21st birthday.
How is that relevant? Someone can be 21 and be 375 days older then Rupp was when he ran 2733. the fact that he is almost 21 makes no difference. Fact is Pre was more then 2 years older then him when he ran his time.
mrr82 wrote:
Yea, like when he ran his 2733, running incredibly smart, and outkicking everyone for the win. That timetrialing?
Sorry, that 27.33 was the most staged time trial I've ever seen, aside from Rupp's various failed attempts at breaking 4. Yes, Rupp did run it and we all know he's fast, but it was no race.
Nice try fanboy.
really? care to share some specific examples of such "high school" times with us? perhaps my memory is fading but i cannot seem to recall this, please enlighten me. thanks.
true dat wrote:
Yea cause when "it's early" like it is now, its very common for guys to put up high school times en route to championship/Olympic trials. I remember Bekele, Gebreselassie, Tergat, Songok, El Gerrouj putting up similar botched up times too when it was early in the season for them...
sorry it's been a long day....i think my sarcasm meter was off, my apologies, nice post.
OTC fanclub wrote:
really? care to share some specific examples of such "high school" times with us? perhaps my memory is fading but i cannot seem to recall this, please enlighten me. thanks.
Sean Jefferson running 4:12?
southerner wrote:
Sorry, that 27.33 was the most staged time trial I've ever seen, aside from Rupp's various failed attempts at breaking 4. Yes, Rupp did run it and we all know he's fast, but it was no race.
Nice try fanboy.
It was an amazing race. You don't know what a great race is. Rupp ran perfectly within himself, and even had a bit more in him then he put out there. He didn't just tuck in and follow the pace the whole race. He changed gears in the second half, and with a 60 second last lap left some very accomplished runners in the dust. a 15 second negative split in a race where you pr by 42 seconds is huge. he showed incredible poise, patience and ability. Please come back when you have a clue what a real race is. Rupp was one of the only people in the race who ran a true race. Which is a race against yourself to run the best you possibly can. he did that and that's why he won. Maybe you should watch the video and see how amazing his come from behind win was.
When Alistar got passed by Rupp on the way to his National record 2739, he was saying, that damn Rupp doesn't know how to race, he should have been up here with us dying right now. When he passed Ndirangu, a 2731 runner he was thinking dang that kid doesn't know how to race. Along with all the others he made look silly with his crazy second half split. Get a clue.
Mrr82 wrote:
When Alistar got passed by Rupp on the way to his National record 2739, he was saying, that damn Rupp doesn't know how to race, he should have been up here with us dying right now. When he passed Ndirangu, a 2731 runner he was thinking dang that kid doesn't know how to race. Along with all the others he made look silly with his crazy second half split. Get a clue.
ROFL!
mrr82 wrote:
rupppfan wrote:Pre knew how to race, rupp only knows how to time trial.
The kid has no balls when it comes to "racing".
Yea, like when he ran his 2733, running incredibly smart, and outkicking everyone for the win. That timetrialing? I'm a pre fan, but some of you are pathetic and don't know what having balls is. Someone who understands their limits, and paces themselves, understanding how running works and trusting in their ability, has more balls then someone who goes out too hard, ending up hurting their performances.
Then there's the fact Rupp was 20 when he ran his 2733, Pre was 23 when he ran his 2743.
mrr82 should be banned for life from talking or posting about track and field after this exchange.
I'm no "Pre was a God fan" but, come on, he ran 2743 in 1974 - that was 34 years ago! It was the AR and was a world ranked time.
Fast forward to Galen (Ken Doll - no balls is right if you saw him in that slow-ass Oregon Relays mile) Rupp is nowhere near a world ranked time and has 20 seconds to go to get the AR. He never even came close to competing in that mile race yesterday. Pre would have taken the lead from the rabbits (which would have been made redudant by his presence) and tried to win the damn thing. Please stop this Rupp madness.