Salazar - The Anti-Hanson?

How many WORLD champions has Salazar produced?

0!

Read the stories of the older U.S. greats--start with Shorter,Daws and Rodgers--part of the whole trip is struggling-- doing it on your own and not being given the accomodations and facilities is part of the overall process of toughening you mentally and physically.

Wake up wrote:

crazy streaker wrote:

I am a HS senior and the team I picked for next year was/is based a lot on the coach who believes in me. ... THAT IS A HUGE PART OF COACHING!

No, that is a huge part of recruiting. There is a difference.

Don't believe everything that a coach whispers in your ear, especially those sub-4 dreams. Far better to help an athlete achieve measurable goals than filling his head with wild unrealities.

you misquoted me. When I was referring to that is a huge part of coaching I was referring to my current coach. You replaced all that with "..." which makes it seem different. Anyways, when being recruited you have some coaches who tell yuo that you are good and they'd love to have you. Then you have coaches who name specific things that they like about you and things you need to work on. Then they tell you honest goals that they think you could achieve by explaining their "plan" for you. Obviously a lot of coaches just spit out BS but others are legit. Like why would I caoch continue this even after you are going there?

Is it wrong that I'm experiencing pleasure because a midwestern operation is beating the pants off a west-coast one? What's that word...schadenfreude?

I recall when Bob Schul was trying to get funding for a developmental program a few years ago (don't think it panned out).

He flat out said anyone without sub 50 400 speed was wasting their time running anything except the marathon.

As far as the marathon, I don't think 27:30 is the same as sub 50 for a determing factor to medal. Look at the 2:06 and 2:07 Japanese, or the Korean that won in Barcelona, if I recall correctly, although that might have been Worlds.

I do think 28:30 is about as slow as you can run and realistically dream for success, providing of course you are suited for the marathon.

It's just like in Rocky IV during the training montage.

whatever, saladbar. wrote:

How many entrants in this OT marathon are currently Salazar-coached? Looks like Salazar's best efforts, even with much more funding and resources for bait than the Hansons could ever offer, have had zero impact.

The article states that Salazar is concentrating on the 5,000 and 10,000 for his runners. The lack of Salazar-coached athletes in the Trials is not a reflection on his coaching.

The Gouchers are tougher than those guys fruitcup.

So you think a group like Salazar's who only take extremely elite athletes and keeps them running fairly similar times to what they were doing when they got in are more likely to be doped than Hanson's who takes guys with modest PRs and drops them a ton? That logic makes sense. (I don't think either group is doping, FYI)

buffalo billy wrote:

How many WORLD champions has Salazar produced?

0!

Read the stories of the older U.S. greats--start with Shorter,Daws and Rodgers--part of the whole trip is struggling-- doing it on your own and not being given the accomodations and facilities is part of the overall process of toughening you mentally and physically.

Are you kidding or just an idiot (and I mean that in the nicest possible way)?

Shorter (Florida TC), Rodgers (Boston TC), Daws (must be before my time) absolutely did not do it on their own. They did it with support from coaches and cohorts. Sure they didn't have a ton of financial support but the whole purpose of these training groups is to get better together, not apart.

It seemed to me that most of the WC team were Nike athletes and Salazar coached athletes were well represented. So while he hasn't produced world champions (he did coach a bronze medalist) he's done better than anyone else.

There is a chance they could be on the juice but I give the same probability to any other modern day athlete. So if others are accusing Salazar you need to spread your net a little bit wider or you're just a hypocrite.

Fleet Footed Falcon wrote:

The article states that Salazar is concentrating on the 5,000 and 10,000 for his runners. The lack of Salazar-coached athletes in the Trials is not a reflection on his coaching.

Yeah, he had to abandon his marathon designs when he failed to produce according to his own criteria. If at first you don't succeed, quit. (Well, more likely Nike ran out of patience with Salazar wasting their dough on marathoners who weren't ever going to come close to being world or Olympic medalists.)

I agree with you here. There are too many variables for distance coaching to be "scientific" in any meaningful sense. People respond differently to different types of training and are prone to different injuries. I think that the best coaches learn to be flexible with their training methods rather than "scientific."

Also, this Salazar article really makes me hope that the Hansons guys kick the crap out of Salazar's group, even though Ritz and Hartman and company are good guys, just to disprove such elitist assumptions.

1. Ritz and Hartmann (2 "n"'s) aren't in "Salazar's group," they're in Hudson's.

2. It appears that all of the "variables" respond positively to thyroid meds.

There was a thread earlier about the thyroid medications. It seemed to me to be complettely unanimous that thyroid medications would have absolutley no performance enhancing effect. To me the better question here is if there are any PED's that would as a side effect cause thyroid problems? It seems possible to me that if you're messing with the body that the body will react in several ways, some positive, some negative. I have no scientific evidence to back this up. it just seems like a more likely scenario then using the thyroid medication as a PED.

Anyway, I find it interesting that any thread involving salazar always comes to doping accusations. In my own, limited, interactions with him he's always struck me as the type of person who would do absolutley anything within or out of the rules to win. But this is just a personal hunch based off of limited interactions. I don't know the Gouchers at all so i will not comment on them, but I wouldn't put it past alberto to do things bhind his athletes backs.

I would put the 10.000 time at 28:00 to be competitive on the world stage in the marathon, these days.

If you aim to run 2:06-2:07, you better be able to run around 28:00 for 10.000 otherwise it would be difficult.

28:30 I don't think would cut it anymore. You might be able to run 2:09-2:10 with 28:30 speed, but getting under than would be difficult.

Alberto Juzdado (Spain) 2:08 marathoner, usually only ran around 28:30 for 10.000, or slower.

De Castella - 2:07.56 marathon man, had best 10.000 of right around 28:00

Bill Rodgers - 2:09 marathon - 28:04 10.000 man.

Benoit Zwierchleski (France) - 2:06 marathon, best 10.000 of around 28:30 (was caught with epo 2 years ago)

Roncero (Spain) 2:07 marathon, and 27:14 10.000 speed.

Baranowski (Ukraine) - specialist 2:07 marathon runner, with only 29:00 speed for 10.000, but has run 1:51 for 800 when a Junior.

Ghost in Korea

crazy streaker wrote:

I am a HS senior and the team I picked for next year was/is based a lot on the coach who believes in me. He has said it multiple times that he thinks I can do HUGE things and that has a big influence on the athlete. My current HS coach things I can do ANYTHING. He sometimes is unrealistic with it like saying I should pr by 15 seconds and go sub 4 this year but the point is that he BELIEVES in me and that translate into me beleiving in myself. THAT IS A HUGE PART OF COACHING!

so just because a coach kissed your ass on the phone, he's a good coach?

fool.

crazy streaker wrote:

I am a HS senior and the team I picked for next year was/is based a lot on the coach who believes in me. He has said it multiple times that he thinks I can do HUGE things and that has a big influence on the athlete. My current HS coach things I can do ANYTHING. He sometimes is unrealistic with it like saying I should pr by 15 seconds and go sub 4 this year but the point is that he BELIEVES in me and that translate into me beleiving in myself. THAT IS A HUGE PART OF COACHING!

Making a bunch of dumbass predictions and telling someone they are way faster than they actually are does not make a coach good; it makes them look stupid.

If you are an athlete with a "thyroid condition" then Alberto is the coach for you.

If you see a huge benefit to altitude tents and breathe right strips and underwater treadmills, then Alberto is the man for you.

If you are into busting your ass without the assistance of the best drug doctors in the country, then you will be better suited to run for the Hansons.

As much as you say that Alberto is the Anti-Hanson. I would say that the Hansons are most definitly the Anti-Salazar. I would tend to think that there is the right way and the barely legal way.

Hansons have had way more success when it comes to marathoners and Salazar has had way more success when it comes to the pharmacy.

If Teg ran for Salazar, would Al switch him to the 10k?

What did happen to Chock? You'd think with her speed out of high school she would have been a perfect fit for the group. Did she not get along with the other girls?