Jackson Spencer wins Brooks XC

007run wrote:

RegionalAtBest wrote:

I know we're talking boys here, but Dudek had basically the same kind of dominating season with CRs all of the place.... And is only a sophomore.

It is normal for girls to be dominant as freshman or sophs because of how young women develop differently. It's often difficult for them to keep that form. See Addy Ritz and a whole history of freshman or soph phenoms.

Dwightarm wrote:

jabouko wrote:

14:16 CR at Woodward
14:29 CR Utah state meet
15:01 to win NXN
15:10 to win Brooks

What I'm confused about is how does he run an incredible 14:16 at Woodward, breaking the CR by 7 seconds (faster than German Fernandez, Colin Sahlman, + Nico, Lex, and Leo Young) but 'only' runs 15:10 at Balboa Park?

For context:
• Marc Davis' best at Woodward Park is 14:38; his best at Balboa Park is 14:38.
• Bryan Dameworth ran 14:39; 14:49

Balboa records seem to be pretty similar to Woodward Park records (except for this year's CR.) Going by previous CA girls winners, they also line up closely to their State Meet runs.

So could Spencer have run about 50 seconds faster today? Or were the course conditions unsavory?
Or was it a significantly different course in the past?

wtfbbq wrote:

007run wrote:

It is normal for girls to be dominant as freshman or sophs because of how young women develop differently. It's often difficult for them to keep that form. See Addy Ritz and a whole history of freshman or soph phenoms.

While your statement has historically been shown to be true, Addy Ritz doesn't fall under that category.

She didn't win NXN in a blow-out, dominating season; she kind of 'ended up' winning because the favorites ahead of her took it way too fast and subsequently crashed out.

I'd argue her 5th place as a junior was a more impressive run even though she didn't win.

Mount Rushmore wrote:

He good wrote:

Yeah one of the GOAT seasons for sure. He doesn’t get enough credit for crushing the Woodward CR.

What's your top 5 seasons after 2000?

I'd say, in no particular order:

2010 Verzbicas

2000 Ritzenhein

2019 Nico Young

2014 Grant Fisher

2021 Colin Sahlman

I guess I'd replace either Fisher or Sahlman with 2025 Jackson Spencer.

Dwightarm wrote:

jabouko wrote:

14:16 CR at Woodward
14:29 CR Utah state meet
15:01 to win NXN
15:10 to win Brooks

What I'm confused about is how does he run an incredible 14:16 at Woodward, breaking the CR by 7 seconds (faster than German Fernandez, Colin Sahlman, + Nico, Lex, and Leo Young) but 'only' runs 15:10 at Balboa Park?

For context:
• Marc Davis' best at Woodward Park is 14:38; his best at Balboa Park is 14:38.
• Bryan Dameworth ran 14:39; 14:49

Balboa records seem to be pretty similar to Woodward Park records (except for this year's CR.) Going by previous CA girls winners, they also line up closely to their State Meet runs.

So could Spencer have run about 50 seconds faster today? Or were the course conditions unsavory?
Or was it a significantly different course in the past?

007run wrote:

wtfbbq wrote:

While your statement has historically been shown to be true, Addy Ritz doesn't fall under that category.

She didn't win NXN in a blow-out, dominating season; she kind of 'ended up' winning because the favorites ahead of her took it way too fast and subsequently crashed out.

I'd argue her 5th place as a junior was a more impressive run even though she didn't win.

My statement as of yet, still holds up to be historically true. Female winners of XC champs in 9th or 10 grade rarely duplicate that perfprmance in later years. Katelyn T is a rare example of consistency from freshman to senior years. It usually never works out that way.

Jamie Dough wrote:

007run wrote:

My statement as of yet, still holds up to be historically true. Female winners of XC champs in 9th or 10 grade rarely duplicate that perfprmance in later years. Katelyn T is a rare example of consistency from freshman to senior years. It usually never works out that way.

ever heard of jordan hasay ?

OED wrote:

It seems pretty clear that Spencer was focused on NXN and the team race aspect. Today, he just ran to win. Trying to use performances from the 80s that predate NXN aren’t informative comparisons.

billymills1964 wrote:

Great list!!! It's always nice to read any history of thr world's greatest sport.

Shouldn't the XC All Time GOATS Team have 7 athletes?

Would it be possible someone to make The XC Old School GOATS Team? I have only read a few articles or results, except for state championships, pre 1980 and compared to today there are not much from the 80s & 90s, except for states and Kinney/Foot Locker. Is there a website with these results I've not found yet?

I read that Craig Virgin, Billy Mills and Pre were incredible in HS XC but I don't know of any HS XC national championships before The Kinney (then Foot Locker and now Brooks) which makes comparing XC achievements very difficult compared to T&F.

freekiprop wrote:

CorryBoom wrote:

I think Gerry Lindgren would probably be the best high school XC kid ever, although not a lot of competitive opportunities back then apart from the track. But he did win a 4-mile XC race on a particularly brutal hilly layout at Mt. Sac a few weeks before winning the Olympic Trials 10k at age 18. In that Mt. Sac exhibition race, he beat soon-to-be Olympic Champions Billy Mills and Bob Schul. Stanford coaching legend Payton Jordan called it the greatest performance he ever saw.

He wasn’t in high school and it wasn’t 4 miles

Dwightarm wrote:

jabouko wrote:

14:16 CR at Woodward
14:29 CR Utah state meet
15:01 to win NXN
15:10 to win Brooks

What I'm confused about is how does he run an incredible 14:16 at Woodward, breaking the CR by 7 seconds (faster than German Fernandez, Colin Sahlman, + Nico, Lex, and Leo Young) but 'only' runs 15:10 at Balboa Park?

For context:
• Marc Davis' best at Woodward Park is 14:38; his best at Balboa Park is 14:38.
• Bryan Dameworth ran 14:39; 14:49

Balboa records seem to be pretty similar to Woodward Park records (except for this year's CR.) Going by previous CA girls winners, they also line up closely to their State Meet runs.

So could Spencer have run about 50 seconds faster today? Or were the course conditions unsavory?
Or was it a significantly different course in the past?

Dwightarm wrote:

jabouko wrote:

14:16 CR at Woodward
14:29 CR Utah state meet
15:01 to win NXN
15:10 to win Brooks

What I'm confused about is how does he run an incredible 14:16 at Woodward, breaking the CR by 7 seconds (faster than German Fernandez, Colin Sahlman, + Nico, Lex, and Leo Young) but 'only' runs 15:10 at Balboa Park?

For context:
• Marc Davis' best at Woodward Park is 14:38; his best at Balboa Park is 14:38.
• Bryan Dameworth ran 14:39; 14:49

Balboa records seem to be pretty similar to Woodward Park records (except for this year's CR.) Going by previous CA girls winners, they also line up closely to their State Meet runs.

So could Spencer have run about 50 seconds faster today? Or were the course conditions unsavory?
Or was it a significantly different course in the past?

cell block 4 wrote:

And the J6 pipe bomber was white...