Was Ritz just a vastly overrated high school cross-country runner? His "great" 14:10 was made a mockery of today

have a conversation wrote:

Michiganian13 wrote:

Actually a lot smarter old man, you're clueless as well.

And posters like you never *cease* to amaze us. Anyway, seize the day.

Glad you know that running is NOT your thing. Carry on "cents" vocabulary errors are you greatest "clame" to fame.

Troll alert. Nice try.

However I am at the same time both surprised he did as well as he did after HS( because he was cranking out monster mileage in HS and I figured he was near peak), and disappointed he didn't do more in his running career(given how dominant he was in HS against historically talented athletes).

SDSU Aztec wrote:

birdbeard wrote:

It was 13:44.

You're correct and that only buttresses him being called a GOAT. I'm pretty good at remembering times; maybe the 13:44 was his second attempt at the record? I didn't realize he came so close to Lindgren's record.

Is referring to him as "Nathan" an inside joke?

Ritz lost to UW redshirt freshman Matt Tegenkamp at US Jrs and then they went 3 and 5 at worlds before senior track. Ritz's participation there cost him a low sub-4, the 3200/2M and 5000 records.

Ritz was .1 off of Lindgren's record but he was actually capable of more, just worn out at the end. He kept trying to do super human things at the end of HS but he was in his own version of a mini slump. Still winning. Still lapping people. Just not hitting the records he wanted to.

Webb kind of stole the show after Pre and that whole narrative of Webb vs Ritz wasnt determined until a 2 Mile at Pre Classic and a 10000 where Webb won 27:3x to 27:3x, 3-4 years later. The 10000 result caused Dathan to move up to the marathon where his second rival, Ryan Hall, was excelling and this was someone he was actually better than. Ryan had run 13:15-16 with Dobson against Time Broe at USATF but then Hall the next year set the half marathon record and then took to the marathon. Hall became a face of marathoning almost overnight.

So poor Ritz became displaced. In retrospect he shouldve just accepted the loss to Webb in the 10000 and not made it an event changing ordeal. Ritz dropped down to 5000 randomly and ran 12:56 while marathon training. There may have been a 12:52-53 there. He was that good.

Ritz only beat Webb and Hall.

I don't think you people have any idea how good Ritzenhein was and how hard he was able to push during the middle of a race.

EXACTLY!! No super shoes, running all alone, 21 years ago, not training in Big Bear in the off season. A friend of mine said it and no disrespect to the NP guys they are very good, but Ritz time was worth 13:45 on today’s course

Ritz is better but they will run faster today than he did then.

michiganrunner55 wrote:

EXACTLY!! No super shoes, running all alone, 21 years ago, not training in Big Bear in the off season. A friend of mine said it and no disrespect to the NP guys they are very good, but Ritz time was worth 13:45 on today’s course

Doesn't matter. Nico Young has already blown away Ritz' best 3000 & 5000 on the track. Wiped away Fernandez from #1 all time junior in the process running 13:24 in the 5000 and is in the top 10 all time in the 3000. . Look for one of these four guys to take that junior 5000 record even lower in the next couple of years. Likely 13:15-18.

Ritz accomplished nothing of significance on the track as a junior.

SDSU Aztec wrote:

birdbeard wrote:

It was 13:44.

You're correct and that only buttresses him being called a GOAT. I'm pretty good at remembering times; maybe the 13:44 was his second attempt at the record? I didn't realize he came so close to Lindgren's record.

Is referring to him as "Nathan" an inside joke?

Part of the general disrespect shown for him by the poster, I'm guessing.

Holy god you people are losers. Trying to diminish a two decades old performance?

Honestly, the rage and jealousy inside some of you running incels is disturbing. Imagine making this the as to mock the high school performances of a now-retired runner.

When you get those bad feelings in your tummy try meditating or something.

definitely soemthing wrong with americans the way they talk abouy kids in sport. once in america in a bar theey were showing 11 year old baseball on tv. wtf is wrong with you people

$0.02 wrote:

Ritz dropped down to 5000 randomly and ran 12:56 while marathon training. There may have been a 12:52-53 there. He was that good.

He was NOT marathon training. He had been training with Brad Hudson in early 2009 doing a lot of marathon work and some 10k work. He switched to Salazar and got on a speed based program. 6 months later he ran his 5k PR. It was absolutely his max effort.

I believe Ritz’s impact on high school running will be greater than any of the NBP kids individually, but I believe all 3 will run faster than his 13:44. Collectively, what they are doing is more exciting and will never be matched. To have ~3-4 sub 8:40 dudes is incredible.

Ritz had a good career, but his best race may have been third place in the 5000 at 12:56. He never won any world championship or Olympic medal. Sometimes people on this board conflate effort with success. Many people put in great effort, but only an elite few win the championship medals.

runnER/DR wrote:

Troll alert. Nice try.

However I am at the same time both surprised he did as well as he did after HS( because he was cranking out monster mileage in HS and I figured he was near peak), and disappointed he didn't do more in his running career(given how dominant he was in HS against historically talented athletes).

Oft injured.

Still a helluva career.

Broke the American 5k record (12:56!).

Three WC finals.

Three OG finals.

60.00 half marathon (Bronze medal in world half marathon champs; 1 second behind silver).

2:07 marathon.

Arguably a better career than Ryan Hall and Alan Webb.

Not sure you can be both surprised at how well he did and disappointed he did not do better?

Time will tell.

If these NP guys go on to stellar careers, we'll look back at this race as an epic event in HS XC history.

If they become 4 nobodies and don't approach Ritz's level, then we'll look back at this as a flat pancake race that was also suspect in measurement.

What’s better than one Ritz

Three Ritz, watch out America

I respectfully disagree. Ritz ran in hs a generation ago. The NP kids may not be as fast as Ritz in XC but they are surely faster than him on the track and will now inspire a new generation of runners for years to come. Ritz is surely one of the greats but NP represents new blood

Youngbloods wrote:

[quote]michiganrunner55 wrote:

EXACTLY!! No super shoes, running all alone, 21 years ago, not training in Big Bear in the off season. A friend of mine said it and no disrespect to the NP guys they are very good, but Ritz time was worth 13:45 on today’s course

Doesn't matter. Nico Young has already blown away Ritz' best 3000 & 5000 on the track.

NIco has run a faster 5k than 12:56?

You’re an absolute moron, and here’s why:

Ritz’s famous 14:10 was run on a hilly course (solo) at Michigan International Speedway, the state championship course for Michigan.

The second fastest time ever at that course is 39 seconds slower!!! 14:49, run this year by the D1 state champ, Riley Hough. Riley Hough ran 14:10 at running lane for a 5th place finish behind Sahlman, the Young twins, and Bergen.

Sahlman only finished 7 seconds ahead of Hough: he would likely not even come within 20 seconds of Ritz’s time at MIS.

For even more context- Hobbs Kessler’s MIS PR-14:52

Grant Fisher’s MIS PR- 14:52

The RXC John Hunt course and MIS courses are not even remotely comparable with regards to time. RXC runs roughly ~35-40 seconds faster. Even with a ridiculously conservative estimate, John Hunt is 20s faster than MIS.

71 guys broke 15 minutes at RXC. No way in hell that would happen at MIS. A maximum of 10 of these guys would break 15 at MIS.

What's your 5K PR?