You disagree? Their mile PRs are better. That is just a fact. That is not a time trial in Covid or a relay split. Hocker did it as a freshman. Teare's PR is 3 seconds faster and he has 2 seasons to improve. And then there is Hunter and Brown. All have mile PRs faster than your 2 guys. Your guys would be like Brown today, on the B team DMR. Actually, Brown is faster so there would not be room for both of them on the B team if they were on the team today.
John Wesley Harding wrote:
driving me crazy wrote:
Wheating was like 6'6, he's not built for indoor track. And these relay team went out the next day and put down insane times - meaning they probably had more in the tank if necessary in the relay. The 800m leg was a negative split and the 1600 leg was a big negative split.
Yeah and I’m sure Hocker was holding something back while getting beaten by the unheralded Iowa State guy ?
I’m not trying to disparage these guys at all and maybe they are collectively the best mid-d group ever, but no way am I putting them on the same level yet as Centro and Wheating as college seniors.
Centro and Wheating are kind of freak cases in opposite directions. Absent Centro's one meet where he got bronze and Wheating's freak race in Monaco where he ran 3:30. Before those summers, were they that insane?
If, say, Teare wins 5000/3000 indoors; wins 5000 outdoors; Hunter wins indoor mile; James West and Hunter are 1/2 in some order in 1500 outdoors, Reed Brown gets on the podium in mile and 1500; Hocker is on the podium in 3000 and 5000 as a true soph
I think that's clearly as good of a crew as they've ever had.
0202020 wrote:
If, say, Teare wins 5000/3000 indoors; wins 5000 outdoors; Hunter wins indoor mile; James West and Hunter are 1/2 in some order in 1500 outdoors, Reed Brown gets on the podium in mile and 1500; Hocker is on the podium in 3000 and 5000 as a true soph
I think that's clearly as good of a crew as they've ever had.
I think that is clearly worse than the 2015 indoor crew with
1/4/6 mile
1/2/3 in the 3k
1/3/7 in the 5000
DMR win
Chez and Jenkins were monsters that year but Geoghegan, Stinson and Gregok were also really solid.
The current crew has a lot of potential. Who knows what actually happens. Maybe teare wins the 3/5k and Hocker is right behind him. Maybe they get 3rd and 6th behind the NAU guys. Both are reasonable outcomes. You need to be careful when comparing potential to real results.
Today's team is very good. They stand on the shoulders of the great runners on past teams that have advanced the program to where it is at present.
Take a look at what times it takes to qualify in mile/3k/5k as compared to the past. Comparing places to guys of the past is silly. If Oregon guys go 1-4-6 in the mile running 3:50-3:52-3:54, are you really saying that is the same as the 2015 team? Today's Oregon team is the best they have ever had. Some of you are forgetting that these times were run in January. They have 2 more months of indoor and then 2 months of outdoor to put up even crazier times.
Centro 3:36.92 at Stanford - 2009
Unfortunately I don't think they will attempt a 4xmile record, let alone go to Penn Relays this year. I've never truly seen a team try to peak and run for a record in the 4xmile in my lifetime
lol at anyone arguing against Centrowitz being on the 1600 leg. You can compare PRs all you want, we know that Centro only ever runs to race -- he doesn't run for time. He was in fantastic shape in college. He was a bronze medalist before turning pro! He ran 3:36 in 2009 as a Sophomore.
We can argue about Andrew Wheating if you really want -- fine. Even though he was an Olympian in college as a sophomore (I mean c'mon man). If you want to say one of these guys might get the 1200 leg, I am skeptical as hell but I'll let you argue it.
But you don't get to argue against the dude with a WC medal in college, who proved it was no fluke by having the second finest career a 1500/mile run in US history after Lagat.
trackislife12 wrote:
Teare: 3:54
Brown: 3:56
Hunter: 3:54
Hocker: 2:49 = (3:55ish??)
West: 3:34 - 1500 (Outdoor eligibility)
Are we going to see a 1-2-3 finish in the men’s 1500? What we are seeing with these times are unreal, but the Centro and Wheating era of Oregon was godly. Discus.
I’m not sure that Oregon has one runner that can beat Nuguse in a 1500m, let alone 3 of them.
If you look at the roster, they have solid talent that is still young too.
There is a very real possibility this won’t be a school best for long.
John Wesley Harding wrote:
I am Woman wrote:
Except that their times are better.
See, that’s where we disagree. I think it’s apparent that Wheating and Centro were capable of about 2:45/3:50 for 1200/1600 as college seniors, respectively—maybe a couple ticks slower indoors. Additionally, I’m inclined to pick them for the all-time Oregon DMR—if your mind is capable of entertaining hypotheticals—because they proved themselves capable of winning titles on the big stage, not just impressive time trials during the weirdest year for running in recent memory. If you absolutely insist on rigid adherence to DMR splits, then you’re right, but you’re probably a total bore in conversation.
Again, I’m not saying that Oregon’s current guys won’t go on to do great things, or that I won’t be rooting for them, but they haven’t proven that they’re in the same tier as Centro and Wheating as college seniors. Get back to me when one runs 3:34, wins an NCAA title and places 4th at USAs, and then we can begin to talk.
You can stop switching back and forth between the two handles by the way.
Agreed. In Big boy, Big girl school the only thing that matters is winning. Everything else is just window dressing.
Just ask Dan Marino.
How many NCAA titles did Centro win? Did he win every 1500 and mile title while in college? He would be the 5th best miler on the team today. He may do better outdoor but that is not what we are talking about.
Dan Marino is in the Hall of Fame and an all-time great QB.
Now for best mid-distance collegiate teams don't forget the 2005 Michigan sqaud with Nick Willis, Nate Brannen, Mike Woods, Andrew Ellerton.
Who has a DMR time 5 seconds faster than any other school? Oregon 2021!
Runner10287 wrote:
Dan Marino is in the Hall of Fame and an all-time great QB.
But he's no Ty Detmer.
I am Woman wrote:
Take a look at what times it takes to qualify in mile/3k/5k as compared to the past. Comparing places to guys of the past is silly. If Oregon guys go 1-4-6 in the mile running 3:50-3:52-3:54, are you really saying that is the same as the 2015 team? Today's Oregon team is the best they have ever had. Some of you are forgetting that these times were run in January. They have 2 more months of indoor and then 2 months of outdoor to put up even crazier times.
People run against who they run against. Who knows if the 2015 had new spikes and could have skipped 2014 track and XC if they would have been run faster times. Seriously think about how different things must be if someone runs a 3:52 mile (i.e. the college mile record and seconds faster than thier PR) and gets 4th. If Oregon doesn't win the title in 2021, can they be the best team ever despite being failures?
Could the current crew be the best ever? Sure. But they are going to have to show up at the NCAA and lay down better performances than they have so far. Could happen, but I wouldn't bet on it. And yes we are talking about some crazy high standards....
I am Woman wrote:
How many NCAA titles did Centro win? Did he win every 1500 and mile title while in college? He would be the 5th best miler on the team today. He may do better outdoor but that is not what we are talking about.
You can't google?
2011 NCAA 1500m champ.
People who are arguing for the current milers purely on PB's need to get real: a full assessment weighs the value of national/international exposure and competitiveness, placement and experience. While we can't judge the current crop on that now, you can't deny those qualities from Centro, Wheating, etc.
If this hypothetical "Best Mid D" crew were to race other similar crews from Stanford, Ark, Nova, etc - I'd want guys with big-time race experience, not just flashy NCAA/time trial PB's.
I am Woman wrote:
How many NCAA titles did Centro win? Did he win every 1500 and mile title while in college? He would be the 5th best miler on the team today. He may do better outdoor but that is not what we are talking about.
wat?
he ran a 3:53 equivalent as a sophomore.
Centro was still in college when he won world bronze. He then decided to go pro.
Anyone see them going 1-2-3 in the outdoor 1500? Me neither, next!
Seriously, they have a great squad, but all-time for Oregon? Show me the medals.