The Last 10K of a Marathon

Temp Oh wrote:

I've done it a couple of times on the way to good times.

For me it was not weekly mileage that made the difference but hardish running on tired legs. Progressive long runs when your legs already feel tired. Double session days e.g. am: 6 mile threshold or 8-10x1km, pm: MP fartlek (maybe 6ish miles 3 min MP, 1 min steady rec).

The feeling of running MP on legs that were toast became familiar.

Thank you, this makes sense as most will train for the first 20 miles but then not know how to run the last 6.2. Hanson's is supposed to train people to run as you said, 16 for an LR but then 10 fatigued the day after.

Most also try to run a ton of LSD and hope to put it together race day, but others and you have mentioned to get used to practicing at goal pace.

For me, fast-finish LRs and progressives work. Even 10-12 EZ (but even not really EZ, more steady, 8-8:20, gives you the fatigue to get ready for 8 hard MP miles right after that). Some will say let's do 20 at 9 pace but that won't teach your body to run while tired.

jamese1045@hotmail.com

wrote:1st 10k, warmup, 13.1 gathering all systems, 20 mi race starts (where you think "pick it up" in order to maintain a decent pace.

I like this approach and share a similar mindset. All of my marathons during the past 20 years have had slightly negative splits -- second half a minute or two faster than first half.

Miles 15-21 are usually the fastest 10K -- easy to get a little over-confident, then pay a bit of a price at 24 miles. Low-mileage training is probably a factor (20 to 45 mpw). Most recent marathon was 1:34 first half, 1:33 second half (age 58) -- I put a little "in the bank" between 13 and 24, then slowed by 25 seconds/mile the final two miles.

The only times I recall the final 10K as the fastest were my first marathon (started WAY too conservatively), and when I paced a woman for first 20 miles, then settled into a comfortably hard pace.

Reading some of these stories, I really envy a lot of you runners.

My first marathon was the 2nd Marine Corps.

That’s the day I learned that I just wasn’t built for the distance

180 pounds, 70-80 mile weeks, long runs were just grueling ha

Of course I could bench press 225, 20 times and could hit a baseball over 400 feet...

Could build be a factor? Muscle type.

In all the years, I just broke down after 20.

Both in training and on those race days.

I’ve always regretted not being able to run the distances beyond half marathon.

17:06 for 5k, 35:57 10k... 1:19.59 half and..............3:12.22 marathon .. sadly

Robert E . Lee wrote:17:06 for 5k, 35:57 10k... 1:19.59 half and..............3:12.22 marathon .. sadly

That is an amazingly drop-off between the half marathon and full marathon, especially training at 70 mpw. In my 40s, my times for 5K and HM were slightly slower (17:10, 1:21), but a 2:56 marathon was very easy. Ten pounds lighter than you, but not super skinny (5'11", 170) ... and only 45mpw.

If there was a big slowdown from 5K to HM, then, yes 3:12 marathon would make sense. But, wow, 6:06 pace for HM suggests efficient running and plenty of natural endurance. Was it perhaps a fueling issue -- either pre-race or during (or both)? Maybe that high(er) mileage training had you perpetually weakened with low reserves.

My base formula is:

Long Runs + Rest/Recovery = Marathon Success.