Yes and no.
He could possibly beat Kouros’ record - but Kouros is Kouros.
In his prime he was untouchable. Anyone who contests multi day events today does so in the shadow of men like Kouros. Walmsley clearly recognizes and respects that. It’s unfair to compare them.
Whether he will take a place along side Kouros remains to be seen, but it really looks like Walmsley is on the path to carve out his own legend.
Anyone who thinks Walmsley is the greatest ever is foolish. He's not even the greatest ultramarathoner the US has ever had. Do some research.
There are some incredible names out there that have won more and done way more than he has on a variety of different surfaces and terrain. Blake Wood. David Horton. Ted Corbitt. Karl Meltzer. Mike Morton. Marshall Ulrich. Scott Jurek.
Zorba the Geek wrote:
Whether he will take a place along side Kouros remains to be seen, but it really looks like Walmsley is on the path to carve out his own legend.
Walmsely will be known for winning the WS 100 2 times. A bunch of people have won that race more often than him. The legend about Jim will be how he couldn't handle to get lost at WS100 and walked it in.
Walmsley will be forgotten in 5 years just like Anton Krupicka or Geoff Roes.
Interesting take. You dont think he will be remembered for his CR at WS? Or do you really think someone is going to break that record any time in the near future?
And Anton forgotten? Hardly. The guys is nearly just as popular now after years of not running any races. I'll give you Geoff Roes.
bigb wrote:
Interesting take. You dont think he will be remembered for his CR at WS? Or do you really think someone is going to break that record any time in the near future?
And Anton forgotten? Hardly. The guys is nearly just as popular now after years of not running any races. I'll give you Geoff Roes.
It's a trail race and that is highly depending on the trail conditions at that specific day.
If you look at the winners list of WS100
1997 Mike Morton ran 15:40
2004 Scott Jurek ran 15:36
2010 Geoff Roes ran 15:07
2012 Tim Olson ran 14:46
2018 Jim Walmsley ran 14:30
2019 Jim Walmsley ran 14:09
And lets not forget that in 2019 Jared Hazen ran 14:26 as a second place finisher and Tom Evans 14:59 as third. Even 47 year old Jeff Browning could run a sub 16 hours in 9th place.
It's all about the trail conditions.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Western_States_Endurance_Runhttps://ultrasignup.com/results_event.aspx?did=61359Anton is incredibly popular despite barely racing as he is a good guy.
And spartathlon is nowhere near the best ultra,comrades pisses over it for popularity.
ccc wrote:
cb wrote:
Jurek broke 16 hours 1 time. Walmsley’s best time is almost 1.5 hours faster than Jurek’s. Jurek dominated for sure. But Walmsley’s career isn’t over yet so arguing this is pretty silly anyways. Races are run so differently now too. Less margin for error.
Well, it's a trail race with quite different conditions every year. Walmsley's record was done in probably the best overall trail conditions of the Western States.
And I like to point out that Walmsley got schooled by 2 time 100k World Champion at his own Hoka 100k race last year. Walmsley is a good runner but he is not that good.
Wasn't Walmsley's goal in the 100K race to set a record for 50 miles? If someone is trying to run a 2-mile PR in a 5000, the last 1.1 miles is an afterthought.
I am aware of this. But that doesn't answer the question. Regardless of the varying conditions, a CR is a CR and based on no one else ever coming close to that time its highly unlikely anyone will take it down any time soon.
Are you saying Geoff Roes isn't a good guy? :)
It seems like UTMB is more popular than Comrades or Spartathlon but maybe thats my own ignorance. Just seems like not many outside of South Africa pay it much attention, I realize it is huge there but don't often hear about ultra elites from all over the world going to race it. Whereas UTMB has been consistently attracting elite competition from all over.
Comrades is the oldest ultra race (1921) in the world and with now 25,000 runners.
Spartathlon with 153 miles a lot longer is the premium road ultra over 100k since 1983.
The UMTB is held since 2003 and quickly developed to the biggest trail mountain race with a distance around 106 miles.
SDSU Aztec wrote:
Wasn't Walmsley's goal in the 100K race to set a record for 50 miles? If someone is trying to run a 2-mile PR in a 5000, the last 1.1 miles is an afterthought.
Why did Hoka create a race just for Walmsley and made it longer than necessary?
No the plan was that Walmsley goes after the 100k world record. The 50 mile "record" a distance never really run on roads was just a lame excuse.
The watch doesn't lie and that is what we are discussing here. Kouros time against Walmsley time.
The watch says Scott Jurek would be 4 miles behind Jim in a marathon and 10 miles behind Jim at Western States.
My prediction is that Jim W will attempt to run a faster marathon before he attempts the Spartathlon.
The watch doesn't matter.
Scott Jurek won the Western States 7 times in a row. You can only race the people who show up at the starting line. That's what racing is about.
+100 Horton is a name not heard enough. Walmsley has a long, long way to go before he is on that level. Walmsley could start best by shutting his cake hole and finding better friends.
MeHereYouWhere?! wrote:
Anyone who thinks Walmsley is the greatest ever is foolish. He's not even the greatest ultramarathoner the US has ever had. Do some research.
There are some incredible names out there that have won more and done way more than he has on a variety of different surfaces and terrain. Blake Wood. David Horton. Ted Corbitt. Karl Meltzer. Mike Morton. Marshall Ulrich. Scott Jurek.
Sage beated Anton Krupicka at Speedgoat 50k.
And I beat Anton at the Leadville 100 when he DNFed.
Walmsley has won UROY 4 times in a row. Jurek never did that although he did win 4 times in his career. Both great ultra marathoners. Walmsley is competing at a time when the both the depth and talent of fields is much higher though.
cb wrote:
Walmsley has won UROY 4 times in a row. Jurek never did that although he did win 4 times in his career. Both great ultra marathoners. Walmsley is competing at a time when the both the depth and talent of fields is much higher though.
But whenever the competition is tough Walmsley craps out. He didn't finish the Diagonale de fous and he was not that successful at the UMTB. He is only good at WS100 where the competition is very limited due to the fact that there are less than 400 running slots.
Strawman much?
So by your argument, Jurek's 7 wins at Western don't count for much since " the competition is very limited...." ?
You are correct though that Walmsley will never win that uncompetitive race 7 times because he has nothing left to prove there. 14:09 is sick, even in favorable conditions. Plus he ran 14:24? there when it was warm.
5th place at UTMB against the likes of Francois and Killian and Thevenard isn't that bad and the Diagnol dnf was predictable on a short turnaround and for being overtrained. I actually find his efforts at both races commendable that he is willing to step out of his comfort zone of more runnable courses.
Jurek had bad races too. I agree that Jurek was great. Your dismissal of Walmsley is weak though. Your dislike is clearly not based on reason or logic but is based in emotion.
cb wrote:
So by your argument, Jurek's 7 wins at Western don't count for much since " the competition is very limited...." ?
Yes, this is true for Jurek too BUT Scott Jurek won 3 times Spartathlon and ran at the World Champions for 24 hours and he had very good results in 24 hours considering that there where never any good 24 hour races in the US.
The problem with US runners is that they are very separated from outside competition and they are not doing standard distances much. (100k and 24 hours) not that this could be changed easily because it's just Geography really.