KB had a pair of lime green or whatever Next Percents today in the 1/2 marathon, and yesterday tons of runners chose the wear the Next Percents; eather the same color that KB had on, or the pink, or another variation. Infact a few of the guys just didn't care for the Alfas.
Next Percent vs Alfa wrote:
Infact a few of the guys just didn't care for the Alfas.
Like who, Chris Derrick and other nobodies? Alphaflys swept the men's top 5 including Jake Riley who never ran in them.
an honest assessment wrote:
Next Percent vs Alfa wrote:
Infact a few of the guys just didn't care for the Alfas.
Like who, Chris Derrick and other nobodies? Alphaflys swept the men's top 5 including Jake Riley who never ran in them.
Abdi had next% colored like AlphaFlys.
+1 Look more closely Abdi has Next%s
JoggyHobber wrote:
+1 Look more closely Abdi has Next%s
I think Lagat did, too. It will be interesting to see which one he chooses for his next one.
Alphafly is better than Next %. Stay butthurt my friends.
illinoisjones wrote:
Alphafly is better than Next %. Stay butthurt my friends.
. Then why did so many people not run in them?
[quote]illinoisjones wrote:
Alphafly is better than Next %. /quote]
It is not that simple. Besides the basic issues like 'comfort', whether or not 'mechanical assist' is taken advantage of is going to be a function of an individual runner's foot strike. The bag "shock/trampoline" may be better suited for lightweight foot-strikers with short ground-contact time...and of course, the restitution mechanics of bag tuning is going to factor into their performance. And then, the shelf-life of such a shoe would be determined by the aging characteristics of the plastic bag and foam materials.
the doped shoes wrote:
[quote]illinoisjones wrote:
Alphafly is better than Next %. /quote]
It is not that simple. Besides the basic issues like 'comfort', whether or not 'mechanical assist' is taken advantage of is going to be a function of an individual runner's foot strike. The bag "shock/trampoline" may be better suited for lightweight foot-strikers with short ground-contact time...and of course, the restitution mechanics of bag tuning is going to factor into their performance. And then, the shelf-life of such a shoe would be determined by the aging characteristics of the plastic bag and foam materials.
Add the Toyko Marathon winner and 2nd place runners. Both had on lime green Next Percents. Why no Alfa? Because not everyone is going to be wearing them.
the doped shoes wrote:
[quote]illinoisjones wrote:
Alphafly is better than Next %. /quote]
It is not that simple. Besides the basic issues like 'comfort', whether or not 'mechanical assist' is taken advantage of is going to be a function of an individual runner's foot strike. The bag "shock/trampoline" may be better suited for lightweight foot-strikers with short ground-contact time...and of course, the restitution mechanics of bag tuning is going to factor into their performance. And then, the shelf-life of such a shoe would be determined by the aging characteristics of the plastic bag and foam materials.
Edit: I meant to say, "lightweight fore-foot-strikers with short ground-contact time". For example, Rupp's 'punching' ground-strike makes Abdi's gait look more like a shuffle.
Next Percent vs Alfa wrote:
Add the Toyko Marathon winner and 2nd place runners. Both had on lime green Next Percents. Why no Alfa? Because not everyone is going to be wearing them.
I really do Mizuno steps up to the plate with their own version of mechanical assist. The Japanese have proven themselves to be more than capable engineers (e.g., in the auto industry). It was just a matter of Nike really jumping-the-shark on the shoe-assist rules in order to get the ball rolling. I now want to see some of the other shoe companies step up with some good engineering.
I’d say clearly HOKA and Saucony have done a pretty good job catching up if you look at Seidel/Tulamiuk(sp.) and how they did. Kipyego ran 2:25 last fall and you have to presume she was in better shape yesterday. The AlphaFly definitely works for some but it’s unclear to me that for many it’s significantly better for all than the next%. We’ll need more evidence.
It takes a certain degree of muscular and connective tissue (joint) strength to take advantage of shoes providing any measurable mechanical assist. Women may be more prone to injury wearing them after a sufficient period of time, particularly if the shoes are not specifically tuned to their weight class.
the doped shoes wrote:
Edit: I meant to say, "lightweight fore-foot-strikers with short ground-contact time". For example, Rupp's 'punching' ground-strike makes Abdi's gait look more like a shuffle.
Other than your handle, you’re essentially correct.
Alphafly and Vaporfly are both great shoes and they’ll each suit the different styles of different athletes. Much like the Victory and Matumbo spikes were designed for middle and long distance respectively, but many athletes would cross over as they preferred the feel of the other option.
This is nothing new. If a company makes multiple products, it’s to cater to slightly different audiences. If Nike thought Alpha could just be picked up by any Vaporfly wearer they would have dropped the Vapor altogether. They didn’t. Some athletes will adopt Alpha while others will stick with what has worked before.
Turns out different things mean different things.
know your audience wrote:
the doped shoes wrote:
Edit: I meant to say, "lightweight fore-foot-strikers with short ground-contact time". For example, Rupp's 'punching' ground-strike makes Abdi's gait look more like a shuffle.
Other than your handle, you’re essentially correct.
Alphafly and Vaporfly are both great shoes and they’ll each suit the different styles of different athletes. Much like the Victory and Matumbo spikes were designed for middle and long distance respectively, but many athletes would cross over as they preferred the feel of the other option.
This is nothing new. If a company makes multiple products, it’s to cater to slightly different audiences. If Nike thought Alpha could just be picked up by any Vaporfly wearer they would have dropped the Vapor altogether. They didn’t. Some athletes will adopt Alpha while others will stick with what has worked before.
Turns out different things mean different things.
I don't see 5k road times going down in the Alphas. I think KB made a statement today in half, as he wore the lime green Next Percents. Some dudes are going to wear them, some are not. We saw that Saturday. The Next Percents are great, but l don't see the Alphas being the next level. If that were the case KB and everyone out there Saturday would have them on. I have heard some bad things about the Alphas.
Next Percent vs Alfa wrote:
know your audience wrote:
Other than your handle, you’re essentially correct.
Alphafly and Vaporfly are both great shoes and they’ll each suit the different styles of different athletes. Much like the Victory and Matumbo spikes were designed for middle and long distance respectively, but many athletes would cross over as they preferred the feel of the other option.
This is nothing new. If a company makes multiple products, it’s to cater to slightly different audiences. If Nike thought Alpha could just be picked up by any Vaporfly wearer they would have dropped the Vapor altogether. They didn’t. Some athletes will adopt Alpha while others will stick with what has worked before.
Turns out different things mean different things.
I don't see 5k road times going down in the Alphas. I think KB made a statement today in half, as he wore the lime green Next Percents. Some dudes are going to wear them, some are not. We saw that Saturday. The Next Percents are great, but l don't see the Alphas being the next level. If that were the case KB and everyone out there Saturday would have them on. I have heard some bad things about the Alphas.
For example the weight, 215 grams for size 8.5 which is 30g or so heavier than next%.
I think it is more a case of them being unproven. Most athletes would only have had access the day before a race, not having done and decent miles or workouts in them. The same thing happened at London last year when the Nexts came out, plenty of athletes opted to stay in the 4’s as they were proven.
Bob Loblaw’s law blog wrote:
Abdi had next% colored like AlphaFlys.
yes, Nike is probably releasing the whole line of running shoes in the same colorway.
Next Percent vs Alfa wrote:
I have heard some bad things about the Alphas.
the step in sole might be a problem if you don't land front enough. It's like ski jumping with that shoe. You need to land exactly where the air pockets are located. With Vaporfly Next%s the shoe is more "giving" when it comes to your stride.
I think I liked the 2018 orange 4% better than the 2019 green Next%. I ran in the Next% one time, at CIM, and while they had a nice pillowy feel, they didn't rocket me forward like the old 4%. I know, small sample size and I run 2:00 per mile slower than the elites. I'm just saying it will vary by the individual's biomechanics.
I'll try the green ones again at a HM and then decide which pair to use at Boston. The old 4% have about 150 miles on them and still feel great.
Again, I know this isn't relevant to the discussion around elites, just my experience.
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