He's gonna do it. Change my mind.
He's gonna do it. Change my mind.
So he did 15 miles of work at a little faster than marathon pace. Good workout, but there are loads of guys who could do this workout right now.
Aaron Fletcher is a local Alaskan runner I know. Last Saturday he did 12 miles straight at 5:00 pace, then 5 X 1 mile at 5:00 pace, and the rest was half a mile at 6 min pace. That is more volume at essentially the same pace, and nobody talks about him.
Jim is a good runner. He'll be in the top 15 most likely. But this workout doesn't make me think he will make the team.
He is certainly the mix.
I skimmed through the strava of Jim and Scott Fauble and put this spreadsheet together. I was curious to see what Jim's training looks like side by side with more conventional marathon training. I chose Fauble simply because he came up first when I searched "top marathon runners on strava".
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1_UfEorJy95Hj2qlIBGlSu-fANp2SPqw2bMiijiy4R9M/edit?usp=sharing
Not the prettiest spreadsheet in the world but you get the idea. Of course Jim crushes him in total mileage but I reckon Scott has the higher quality workouts. That new years day session and the 16 x 1 mile were hotter than anything Jim could handle.
Not sure what we learn from this other than that I have too much spare time on my hands.
Kind of a stupid workout. Repeat miles would be much better. I've never heard of an elite runner doing 5×5K.
Let’s just take all the GPS watches of all Trials qualifiers and see who’s “vo2max prediction” is higher
SDSU Aztec, 5 x 5km is a traditional Renato Canova workout that has been run by all his world champion marathoners, including Sandre Moe recently and Gabius. It's a progression. You start at 4km, then go 5km, then some go 6km. The pace does not increase, but the volume increases.
You can see the same from Kamworor, Kirui x 2, Shami, Mosop, etc.
Welcome.
AT THESWOOSH wrote:
SDSU Aztec, 5 x 5km is a traditional Renato Canova workout that has been run by all his world champion marathoners, including Sandre Moe recently and Gabius. It's a progression. You start at 4km, then go 5km, then some go 6km. The pace does not increase, but the volume increases.
You can see the same from Kamworor, Kirui x 2, Shami, Mosop, etc.
Welcome.
The difference is, Canova's guys don't have standing rest during this workout. They continue running during the rest periods at about 80-85% of their marathon pace. The standing rest makes this workout significantly easier.
AT THESWOOSH wrote:
SDSU Aztec, 5 x 5km is a traditional Renato Canova workout that has been run by all his world champion marathoners, including Sandre Moe recently and Gabius. It's a progression. You start at 4km, then go 5km, then some go 6km. The pace does not increase, but the volume increases.
You can see the same from Kamworor, Kirui x 2, Shami, Mosop, etc.
Welcome.
I thought Kipchoge likes to run 1Ks.
SDSU Aztec wrote:
AT THESWOOSH wrote:
SDSU Aztec, 5 x 5km is a traditional Renato Canova workout that has been run by all his world champion marathoners, including Sandre Moe recently and Gabius. It's a progression. You start at 4km, then go 5km, then some go 6km. The pace does not increase, but the volume increases.
You can see the same from Kamworor, Kirui x 2, Shami, Mosop, etc.
Welcome.
I thought Kipchoge likes to run 1Ks.
He does. There is room enough in a schedule for more than one kind of workout. From what I've seen, Kipchoge does plenty of 1 and 2 K repeats, but those are kind of secondary workouts to his long tempos with surges (basically what Canova's 5k workouts are).
The 5x18 is the true test of a marathoner. Anything else is child's play. Pfffft!
Malemute wrote:
SDSU Aztec wrote:
I thought Kipchoge likes to run 1Ks.
He does. There is room enough in a schedule for more than one kind of workout. From what I've seen, Kipchoge does plenty of 1 and 2 K repeats, but those are kind of secondary workouts to his long tempos with surges (basically what Canova's 5k workouts are).
Lots of guys have been in shape for PRs in the 10000 and marathons at about the same time and no one is going to be running 5×5K for the 10000.
Walmsley's workout is like 5 mini-tempos. You get your strength from mileage and prepare for racing with shorter intervals that get the HR up to 200 or so.
I’ve done 4x5k at HM pace for marathon builds before. Never 5. Though this may be a little slower than his HM pace.
Francis Sobotka wrote:
I skimmed through the strava of Jim and Scott Fauble and put this spreadsheet together. I was curious to see what Jim's training looks like side by side with more conventional marathon training. I chose Fauble simply because he came up first when I searched "top marathon runners on strava".
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1_UfEorJy95Hj2qlIBGlSu-fANp2SPqw2bMiijiy4R9M/edit?usp=sharingNot the prettiest spreadsheet in the world but you get the idea. Of course Jim crushes him in total mileage but I reckon Scott has the higher quality workouts. That new years day session and the 16 x 1 mile were hotter than anything Jim could handle.
Not sure what we learn from this other than that I have too much spare time on my hands.
Fauble had more quality early. I would expect someone targetting the Trials to have lots of serious workouts in the past couple of weeks, and he does not.
Much less mileage than Walms, also.
I think Jim could do all Scott's workouts, now. And mind he does all his work at or near Flagstaff, so remember to adjust for the altitude.
Check again. Most of these Flagstaff guys are doing their workouts down at 3000 ft.
[quote][b]
Rick Sanchez wrote:
The 5x18 is the true test of a marathoner. Anything else is child's play. Pfffft!
Well done, sir. An oldie, but a goodie.
walter j wrote:
I’ve done 4x5k at HM pace for marathon builds before. Never 5. Though this may be a little slower than his HM pace.
4 x 5k at HM pace seems insane to me. What were your repeat times, recovery, etc.?
mazzetti wrote:
walter j wrote:
I’ve done 4x5k at HM pace for marathon builds before. Never 5. Though this may be a little slower than his HM pace.
4 x 5k at HM pace seems insane to me. What were your repeat times, recovery, etc.?
12.5mi total @ HM pace... There’s no amount of recovery that could make that workout make any sense. I can’t even imagine attempting that
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