Could you run 24hrs for 100 miles off 2:30 marathon training?

Depending on the course, you should shoot for at least sub 20hrs

-RS

I would hope so. On a fast course you could walk a majority of it and still get under 24h.

I'm not sure where you got your conversions but depending on the course they are way off. No 4:10 marathoner has run a sub 24 100. Even on a track.

You certainly could run 100 miles in a day with a 2:30 marathon. It would probably hurt and I anticipate you would end up walking the last 30 miles or so but it can be done.

If you decided to run a more challenging course like Leadville or Vermont or something you may get under 24 or you may not finish. It depends on the day.

just wonderin wrote:

I have the goal of running 2:30 in the marathon this fall. As a life bucket list item, i would like to run a hundred mile race in under 24 hours. Could I use my marathon training to jog the ultra?

A 2:30 marathon converts to about 14:30 100mile, and a 24 hour 100 mile converts to about a 4:10 marathon.

Obviously i would not be optimally trained, but could I do it?

I’m assuming you do most of your training on the road and aren’t accustomed to running on technical mountain trails? I’m also assuming that you live at sea level? Obviously I may be wrong with these assumptions.

Depends on the 100 miler you choose. A race at altitude with significant climbing and technical trails, like Leadville or Wasatch, it’s unlikely. A flat or low altitude/sea level 100 miler, like Tunnel Hill, then possibility.

Regardless, you are way underestimating the difficulty of completing a 100 mile race if you think you can “jog” it off of just marathon training. It isn’t just the physical training, doing well at ultras is also in large part mental.

Your conversion is false. Maybe a 4:10 road marathon converts to a 24 hr road or extremely flat 100 miler, but it certainly does not convert for a technical trail 100 miler, especially if you factor in the amount of vertical gain and altitude.

You will be surprised how difficult a 100 miler is.

Theoretically you should run it well under 14 hours. A flat race. A trail 100 will be even more difficult. In any case report back to us.

just wonderin wrote:

Obviously i would not be optimally trained, but could I do it?

If you just go from Marathon to a 100 mile race the chances of you finishing are very slim. 5% maybe and I am thinking of a track or flat 100 miler like Tunnel Hill. Chances are you are starting way too fast, even when you are thinking you are starting slow. It's a combination of picking the right speed and be mentally prepared for a very long tough grind. On top of it are issues you never had to deal with like blisters, nutrition and clothing.

100 miles is a whole different world.

A better option for you would be, to start with a 50k race, do a couple of 50 milers and 12 hour races before you try a 100 miler in 3-5 years. Chances of finishing are then probably 95%.

These things often come down to how well one's digestive system is working. It's best to practice eating on the run before race day. For that, one would need several five to six-hour training runs to find out which foods do, and do not, work.

Are five to six-hour runs part of your marathon build up?

I live in the rocky mountain area, I train on hilly trails at 5000'-9000'. the race that i would run would be at 4000', with a total of 3000' gain over the course of 100 miles

Looks like you are looking at the Pony Express Trail 100.

This race is probably mentally a lot more challenging than it looks on paper.

Good luck.

http://ponyexpress100.org/

4000' climbing over 100 miles counts as a flat race, so you won't need to run many hills in training. however, even doing 3hr long runs wouldn't cut it.

I suggest that you go get your sub-2:30 before you try to run a 100 miler. you might ruin the rest of your year and any hope of racing a marathon.

I'm about a 2:30 guy...and here's how my training would change:

training for marathon:

75-100 mpw, mostly around 80-90. maybe one or two doubles per week. one workout and one hard long run per week. run trails a couple times per week just for the love of it, but don't seek out hills necessarily unless you're training for a hilly marathon

training for a flat 100 miler on dirt:

80-110 mpw, mostly at slowish paces.

occasional road workouts when I'm running with friends, such as a progression long run of 20mi, avg about 6:30s

long runs go by time, not distance and would be 3hrs most of the time (20-25mi) but occasionally would do back to back long runs of 3/4hrs or a single 5hr long run.

would end up doing way more hills just because the local trails are hilly. the more hills, the better, even for a flat ultra (as long as you don't need to hike those hills too often due to the steepness)

just wonderin wrote:

I have the goal of running 2:30 in the marathon this fall. As a life bucket list item, i would like to run a hundred mile race in under 24 hours. Could I use my marathon training to jog the ultra?

Yes.

A 2:30 marathon converts to about 14:30 100mile, and a 24 hour 100 mile converts to about a 4:10 marathon.

Obviously i would not be optimally trained, but could I do it?

I suspect you're doing around 80mpw to get ready for the 2:30. If I wanted to do both (finish 100miler, & race a marathon) in one year/cycle, then I'd probably do a July 100 miler as the finish to a large volume, base-building spring/summer. In Apr, May, June, July I'd do the key weekly workouts to develop the speed, stamina, strength for the marathon but I would also be progressing to do some double long runs two-three days a week (18+ miles twice a day, maybe 90 sec slower than marathon pace).

Pick a single track, soft trail 100 mile race the second half of July and treat it as a social race and run it below your capabilities. The ten days after the 100 I'd do fewer workouts, but jog every day, two weeks after the 100 I'd continue marathon training for a mid-Nov race.

Tom Osler had a marathon best of 2:29 and once ran 100 miles in something like 18 hours(?) I'm not sure that's the exact time but he was well under 24 hours. So it can be done.

I was a 2:40 guy doing between 70-90 miles a week and did sub 24 at Arkansas Traveller two times. And one of the times I was doing a lot of biking with a buddy who was gearing up for Ironman, so I decided late to jump into Traveller to see if I could finish off of less running and biking inserted. Not much difference in performance.

And I don't think those were great results. I had better 50 mile times comparatively. A lot of success in 100's, in my opinion, can come from just running multiple 100's. Again, I could smoke a lot of the guys who beat me in the 100s when I ran them in 50s.

You could easily go in under 24 if you are in 2:30 shape. I have friends who have never ran sub 2:50 and have finished ran 16:30.

dshfdg wrote:

You could easily go in under 24 if you are in 2:30 shape. I have friends who have never ran sub 2:50 and have finished ran 16:30.

The thing is, that the Marathon time alone is no indication for anything longer than 100k.

I ran 16:42 as a split in a 24 hour race when I had a 3:09 Marathon PB.

Two years ago, a couple of fast Comrades Marathon runners tried to run 100 miles on track. They all failed miserably. I highly recommend that you work yourself up to the distance with 50k , 50 Miles, 100k and 12 hour runs.

All of the ultrarunning superstars have Marathon times around 2:30 or faster but that doesn't mean that every 2:30 guy could do that.

Fitness should not be an issue but as someone who has run about 5 ultras so far I can tell you that getting out of the chair at the 80 mile mark to run the final 20 miles takes something different than pounding out the 5:50 miles you need to run 2:30. As a 2:30 marathoner probably none of your workouts are longer than 2 to 2.5 hours. Training routines vary quite a bit for ultra runners but it would not be uncommon for someone competing in 100 mile races to run 25 - 30 miles if not once/week, fairly frequently.

I'm in about 2:25-2:27 marathon shape right now and am looking to go for a sub 14 hour finish at a flat 100 miler in 3.5 weeks. So yeah, I definitely think it's possible. I also think too many really long runs in a training cycle can lead to burnout before race day. One of the most important things for a long race is to show up mentally ready to burry yourself (in addition to being physically fit). So if a lot of really long runs in a cycle is going to zap your mental edge completely before race day, then err on the side of a few less of them. I will be going into the race with only two 30+ mile long runs, although I have been averaging 90 to 100 miles per week in singles, with lots 15-20 mile runs, about 8-10k ft of vert per week, two strength training sessions per week and some cycling as cross training. All that said, you don't have to pound yourself into the ground relentlessly with 4 and 5 hour long runs every weekend to run 100 miles. Get as fit as you can in a way that works best for you, throw in a couple extra long runs, practice some nutrition and hydration on those runs and make sure you're mentally ready to tackle the distance. That would be my input.

Unless your longest run during training is at least 50 miles then it is unlikely that you will finish 100 miles.

If you do 50 mile minimum training runs then you should easily break 24 hours off of 2:30 Marathon.

Good luck for your 100 miler.

I am also not a big fan of too long of training runs. A good preparation are always shorter ultras.