I have about 25 pairs, so it depends on what I’m running and how my legs are feeling.
I have about 25 pairs, so it depends on what I’m running and how my legs are feeling.
Tyler_Runs_Lifts wrote:
Curious as to what shoes everybody rotates between.
EZ/Recovery - Asics Gel Cumulus, Hoka Clifton 6
Long Run (No Workout) - Hoka Clifton 6
Long Run (Workout) - Debating what to get for new cycle
Track Workout - Hoka Rincon
Tempo Run - Hoka Rincon/Nike Vaporfly 4%
Casual Race Effort - Nike Vaporfly 4%
Hard Race Effort - Nike Next %
Thinking about snagging the Hoka Tracer 2 and/or the Carbon X.
I have a similar, but more conservative scheme. Basically any normal workout (fartleks, short and long repeats, tempos) or easy run I will run in trainers (right now NB 880 and 1080s) . For specific workouts (e.g. long run workouts) where I care about marathon pace I will run in something similar to race shoes (VF 4%) sometimes. Really, the closer I get to my goal race the more likely I am to run in a race shoe. We are exactly the same for racing. VF4% and Next% for non-peak and peak respectively.
Currently only using Nike Vomeros for all of my runs. Towards the end of the buildup we may use the Vaporfly 4%s but I tend not to use them too often after they wrecked my Achilles.
Tyler_Runs_Lifts wrote:
Curious as to what shoes everybody rotates between.
EZ/Recovery - Asics Gel Cumulus, Hoka Clifton 6
Long Run (No Workout) - Hoka Clifton 6
Long Run (Workout) - Debating what to get for new cycle
Track Workout - Hoka Rincon
Tempo Run - Hoka Rincon/Nike Vaporfly 4%
Casual Race Effort - Nike Vaporfly 4%
Hard Race Effort - Nike Next %
Thinking about snagging the Hoka Tracer 2 and/or the Carbon X.
tyler - they switch pacers halfway through a marathon? I hope they realize that it's against competition rules to have pacers jump in...must be a smalltown race.
your shoe choices are baffling to me...I don't know anyone who wears both the rock-hard Cumulus and the soft Clifton 6s in the same week. Anyway, you seem like you're definitely missing a shoe in your rotation. I'm surprised you can do workouts in the Rincon...it may be light but it's not that poppy of a shoe most of the time. great cushion to weight ratio though, probably keeps your legs fresher.
you seem like you need a pair of zoom flys. just get a cheaper older model...not the v3. they're great for harder long runs and tempos. not great for track workouts, but for a 2:30ish guy they should be solid for 5:30 to 6:45 pace. other benefit of having the zoom fly is that you get used to the feel of the vaporfly without having to put wasteful miles on a $250 shoe. you can find the zoom fly for $60-80. for me, a typical fartlek shoe would be the Boston (don't need to bring extra shoes for warmup/warmdown) or recently, the Adidas Tempo (stability version of Boston). The Bostons are much faster than a Rincon despite a small weight increase, and shouldn't beat up your legs like a flat would.
I work in a shoe store...so I don't know if you guys will understand how crazy I am...but here we go. My shoe rotation, approximately. some will be stability shoes which I am sticking with for the time being, but including neutral shoes as well. For simplicity's sake, I'll only include shoes that I use often enough to bother tracking mileage on Strava for.
EZ/Recovery - Asics Kayano (two pairs), Hoka Arahi (two pairs), Salomon RA Max 2, Hoka Bondi, Adidas Tempo 9, Adidas Boston 6
Long Run (No Workout) - Adidas Tempo, Asics Kayano, Hoka Arahi, NB Beacon, Hoka Rincon
Long Run (Workout) - Nike Zoom Fly, Adidas Tempo, Adidas Boston, Hoka Carbon X, Reebok Floatride Run Fast, Brooks Hyperion Tempo (prototype)
Track Workout - Adidas Tempo/Boston, Nike Streak LT3, Brooks Hyperion Tempo
Tempo Run - Tempo/Boston, Zoom Fly (I've had every version...maybe 6 pairs total including 3 prototypes), Hoka Carbon X, Reebok FR Run Fast, Brooks Hyperion Tempo
Casual Race Effort - who even does casual races?
Hard Race Effort - Nike Streak LT3 (up to 5k), original vaporfly 4% (5k-26.2), probably a zoom fly for a road ultra.
Trail (over 3hrs) - Hoka Speedgoat, Salomon S/Lab Ultra, Nike Kiger 6 (proto)
Trail (under 3hrs) - Salomon Sense Ride 2 (2 pairs), Nike Kiger 6, Hoka Speedgoat
and then like 20 other pairs I basically never use but have less than 50 miles on them. SO if anybody here is a size M 10 or M10.5 and wants to try out something new without paying much...let me know. I've got a lot of Hokas, zoom flys, sauconys, and many more that I'd be happy to let go.
from my last post you can see why I avoid cycling. I'd end up with 10 bikes
double posting...but I just feel the need to mention again how helpful doing some short hill sprints has been lately. If anybody doesn't do them...try it out. Think of them as an alternative to strides a couple days per week. Not a workout.
I'm now splitting times that match my all-out sprints for a 27sec hill while I'm doing 60sec hills at a lower intensity.
Jan 10th I did my first set of hill sprints. went too long (27sec, for 5 reps)
Jan 15th switched to a shorter hill. avg about 10.5sec for 5 reps then ran a 25low for the hill I used on the 10th. already my legs feel much more fluid at this effort.
Jan 17th. 40 degree morning so ran the 6x10sec hills again but maybe a half second slower. a bit too cold
Jan 20th, different hill but did 5x16sec hills and had one in 14.9 when a car pulled alongside me and I got a bit competitive. funny how "all-out" changes when people are watching
Jan 22nd, did my first real workout. 10min tempo, then 6min tempo on a singletrack path at about 6:00 pace which felt like 5:35ish effort. then did 2x55sec hills (split faster than 27sec for the same segment as my first session 1/10), then did 2x37sec hills.
So it's only been 12 days but I'm running like 5-10% faster for these hard hill reps. Increase in fitness isn't really that much, but I feel way more explosive and powerful. Planning on hitting some 200s pretty hard in a few days to see how these hills translate to flat ground. Not sure how to structure the 200s but thinking that 8x200 with 90-120sec rest would be good enough. Not gonna wear flats, will just wear my 10oz trainers. Hoping that I can run them in 32 without too much strain. Will probably try to start out around 34 and work down to 29 if possible.
@reed - I don't think there were more than 1000 finishers in the Louisiana Marathon this past weekend. No one was going for any super fast times (I think 2:28:XX won it). Just pacers from 3 hours on up in 10 minute increments.
When it comes to the shoes, I guess I'm a creature of habit. I always used to run in the Gel Cumulus and did so in most of my runs and workouts during my first marathon training cycle before finding that I like Hoka's offerings. I don't mind the Gel Cumulus that much, but the ones I have will probably be my last pair unless they change things up.
As far as the Zoom Fly goes, I used the FK version (black/orange) during my Boston Marathon training cycle last year and the stack height bothered me, as did the heft of the shoe. I know it's the same stack height as the Vaporfly 4% and all, but yeah, just didn't vibe with me in the long run. I think I put 180 miles in those or so and could bring them out of retirement.
How do you like the Carbon X? I am thinking about using that for my long run workouts.
Also, I might switch to the Tracer 2 for my track workouts. Any experience with those?
BTW, a casual race to me is one where I am just trying to get some work in and not race hard. Really any local race where I want to enter, but treat it as a weekly tempo or something.
I train solely in Asics Contends because they are super cheap ($35) and I can put around 700 miles on a pair.
I have a pair of Nike Zoom Streaks that I race in.
Mostly low drop for me:
track/tempo: kinvara 10, escalante 1.5
slow long run: glideride, paradigm 3
fast long run: escalante 1.5
easy run: fuzex lyte2, dynaflyte 3, paradigm 3, torin 4
race: likely freedom iso or iso2 for Boston.
Tried clifton 5 last year, it was cushioned but caused blisters. Also any run longer than 20k would cause foot pain. Was thinking about trying bondi but once I got glideride I just said bye bye to Hoka.
Escalante racer is really good for speed workout and tempo runs. In my opinions better than kinvara 10 although costs more.
For my fall 2019 marathon I did my Daniels 2Q workouts in Boston 6 and zoom fly v1. All other runs were easy in Ride ISO, clifton 5 and reebok floatride energy. I picked up 2 more pairs of Ride ISOs, another clifton 5 and zoom fly flyknits.
I'll break in my next% in a half marathon a month before my goal. Other race shoes are 4% flyknit, floatride pro for 5k or less, floatride fast or NB 1400s.
hypnotichen wrote:
Mostly low drop for me:
track/tempo: kinvara 10, escalante 1.5
slow long run: glideride, paradigm 3
fast long run: escalante 1.5
easy run: fuzex lyte2, dynaflyte 3, paradigm 3, torin 4
race: likely freedom iso or iso2 for Boston.
Escalante racer is really good for speed workout and tempo runs. In my opinions better than kinvara 10 although costs more.
why race in the freedoms over the escalante racer or kinvara? freedoms seem a bit heavy for me for racing
Everything except hard race effort: New Balance Zante v4
Hard race effort: Vaporflys
The zante v4's are getting progressively harder to find since they were discontinued a while back in favor of the pursuit, which don't quite do it for me... Will have to find something else eventually, but so far I like just sticking to the one thing that is tried and tested to be super comfy.
Recovery: Skechers Forza 3
Easy: Reebok Forever Floatride Energy, Pegasus Turbo Shield
Easy to Moderate: Reebok Forever Floatride Energy, Reebok Floatride Run Fast, Adios 4, Pegasus Turbo 2
Long Fast Runs: Zoom Fly Flyknit, VaporFly 4%, Reebok Floatride Run Fast
Marathon Specific WOs: Zoom Fly Flyknit, VaporFly 4%, Reebok Floatride Run Fast
10k-5k pace WOs: VaporFly 4%
I am making my first sub 2:30 attempt at Grandma's this June. Started running in 2015 at age 32 and became addicted.
2016
2:51:46 at Twin Cities
2017
2:40:12 at Fargo
2:45:04 at Twin Cities (over trained and dead legs)
2018
2:40:49 at a cold and windy Boston
stress reaction; no fall 2018 marathon
2019
2:36:03 at Manitoba Marathon
2:31:40 at Chicago
marathonNoob wrote:
I train solely in Asics Contends because they are super cheap ($35) and I can put around 700 miles on a pair.
I have a pair of Nike Zoom Streaks that I race in.
700 miles!? That's crazy.
I am lucky to get 400 or so in shoes before I need to retire them.
How much do you weigh?
Tyler: 400? Yikes! Sounds like that would get expensive. I probably put around 1500 on each pair of zantes, but maybe I can get away with that since I'm on the lighter side and the zantes are pretty minimal to start with so there isn't much to wear away.
jvarunner: Welcome! Looks like we're in similar places, except that you are a year or two ahead of me. What did you think of Fargo? I'm running it this spring hoping for 2:32:xx after going 2:36:50 at Indy in November, so that's very much like your 2019 progression. What's your training been like the past couple of years?
@reed how can I contact you about M10 shoes? :)
@PowSloke - When I'm not in the middle of a training cycle, I weigh about 180 lbs, but when I'm training, I'm about 172 lbs, so it's not like I'm the lightest guy out there. I probably stop using them way too soon, but once I start to feel the cushion going, I don't want to run the risk of a possible injury.
Tyler_Runs_Lifts wrote:
marathonNoob wrote:
I train solely in Asics Contends because they are super cheap ($35) and I can put around 700 miles on a pair.
I have a pair of Nike Zoom Streaks that I race in.
700 miles!? That's crazy.
I am lucky to get 400 or so in shoes before I need to retire them.
How much do you weigh?
I weigh a little over 150. I used to only get about 400 miles to a pair of shoes. Once I started buying cheap shoes I could suddenly get twice that. The material is much more sturdy and wears done much more slowly. Granted, my joints and ligaments are probably taking much more of a beating.
Those of you who can afford 20+ pairs of shoes, feel free to buy me a pair so I'm not running around in a $35 pair!
@reed
I used to use minimal shoes for marathons but after 30k or so it becomes too painful so nowadays I highly prefer more cushioned shoes.
Freedom is sure a little bit heavier than escalante but also more comfortable. I wore it when I PRed last Noveber and I have to say it's the only marathon so far that my lower body joints are not suffering terribly.
Escalante 1.5 is kind of weird. It felt's really really comfortable except during long runs freedom feels better.
To be fair, I did try escalante racer in one marathon in 2019 but unfortunately everything went wrong and I was feeling terrible before even passing halfway. Maybe my view on racer would be different on a good day, but you know once you failed miserably on something it's just natural to avoid going the same route again...
BTW, my old favorite race shoe is Asics 33 DFA2, which is similar to freedom in terms of weight but a little bit less cushioned.
Not sure how evoride would feel but hope it's a low drop so I can at least try it out.
jvarunner wrote:
Recovery: Skechers Forza 3
Easy: Reebok Forever Floatride Energy, Pegasus Turbo Shield
Easy to Moderate: Reebok Forever Floatride Energy, Reebok Floatride Run Fast, Adios 4, Pegasus Turbo 2
Long Fast Runs: Zoom Fly Flyknit, VaporFly 4%, Reebok Floatride Run Fast
Marathon Specific WOs: Zoom Fly Flyknit, VaporFly 4%, Reebok Floatride Run Fast
10k-5k pace WOs: VaporFly 4%
I am making my first sub 2:30 attempt at Grandma's this June. Started running in 2015 at age 32 and became addicted.
2016
2:51:46 at Twin Cities
2017
2:40:12 at Fargo
2:45:04 at Twin Cities (over trained and dead legs)
2018
2:40:49 at a cold and windy Boston
stress reaction; no fall 2018 marathon
2019
2:36:03 at Manitoba Marathon
2:31:40 at Chicago
I too started running at 32 in 2015. What did you do to go from 2:40 to 2:36 to 2:31? I did 2:40 last fall at 63 mpw, hoping 2:35 this spring on 70 mpw and 2:32 Chicago on 75 mpw.
hypnotichen wrote:
Not sure how evoride would feel but hope it's a low drop so I can at least try it out.
I'll try on the evorides when they come out. I tried on a pair when the asics rep came by a couple months ago and they are firm and have a light rocker. not super light, probably would fit in with the zoom fly/carbon x type of shoe.
somebody asked me earlier about the carbon x actually...and I haven't worn it much yet. It's more stable than the nike plated shoes, but has worse traction. the fit is a bit better than the nikes for most people from what I hear. I have friends who do a lot of workouts in them but still prefer the 4% for racing. I have another friend who does his easy runs in them but I think he just wore through his other trainers.
I'd think of them as a workout shoe, or a racing shoe for those who don't want the 4% for some reason.
RIP: D3 All-American Frank Csorba - who ran 13:56 in March - dead
RENATO can you talk about the preparation of Emile Cairess 2:06
Running for Bowerman Track Club used to be cool now its embarrassing
Hats off to my dad. He just ran a 1:42 Half Marathon and turns 75 in 2 months!
Great interview with Steve Cram - says Jakob has no chance of WRs this year