Hi guys，I dont know how to explain this. But i am struggling... I have not been to the doctor to discuss this，but i think my old personal trainer noticed my disordered eating patterns when he told.me to stop running until i gained a weight of 52kg. for my height of 166cm.. It all started years ago，when I wanted to lose weight to become faster. To me running meant everything God what would i have done for It. I lost 10kg+ from 60kg. to 50kg. I kept losin weight because i did not adjust my nutrition to my Marathon training. Then i got underweight. Last summer i got injured. My body was so weak. When i couldnt run i lost weight because i felt guilty every time i ate since i wasnt burning everything. I got down to 48kg. Everyone kept telling me i was so thin. When on the inside i was feeling fat. Only running... only my unconditional love for running has let me eat again and gain the weight back to 51kg. when i returned to run. But that was before. I cannot describe that feeling when I returned to Run. God it was the most beautiful feeling in the World. It is my everhthing，the reason I want to live.
I tried to shift my focus to running performance and force myself to eat enough nut i always end up eating less thsn i burn. Its simple because i cant eat enough.
I realized my weight loss is not about marathon weight at all. I am below marathon weight and if it was about that i would be determined to take action to improve my condition.
My weight loss is my way to control my body，it gives me a sense of control noone can take away from me. When I feel hungry，starving i feel powerful i have no feelings. i cant think.of anything else. Feel no pain.
i am not able to maintain a healthy and ideal marathon weight. After restricting and exercising i lost back to 49-50.5kg. I weigh myself every day，my height 166cm. Weight 50.1kg. as of today.
As much as i love the feeling of an empty stomach，i love running more and as a runner it is my duty to make choices in the best interest of running. I tried not.to think about and force myself to eat more，today and yesterday. I feel so guilty. I hate to have food in my stomach. When I eat i feel everything. I miss the feeling of an empty stomach. I miss to feel that.
I dont know what to do.
Anorexia
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You need to see a doctor and/or therapist. If what you say is true and you're not messing around, then this is serious and you need to take care of not only the unhealthy physical issue but also the unhealthy psychological issue. Being underweight can have serious long-term health effects, including premature death.
My niece just went through this and it took a toll on her and her family.
Talk to a doctor ASAP. -
Please get help - tell someone, find a therapist. You aren't alone - there are more and more runners speaking out about this, and it's not worth it. You don't want to end up dealing with this for your entire life and have running taken away from you.
http://www.ameliabooneracing.com/blog/uncategorized/therecoveryineeded/ -
Do you get paid to be a runner? Answer that question honestly.
Next, what is important to you? Your health or the numbers that make up your weight?
Next, How strong are your hill sprints? You need muscle for that. If you think being skinny makes you fast, then you should also realize that having no muscles or mass makes you weak/slow on hill runs or on a gradient. -
I wish it wasnt. What I say is true. Dont get me wrong i am not starving myself otherwise i couldnt run at all. But i do restrict and do not eat enough to compensate for my exerxise. if i cant exercise i want to restrict food，because I have an oberwhelming fear od getting fat. Yesterday i ate meat，i cant remember the last time i ate meat. I felt so disgusted. It felt so poisonous inside me.
I dont know，but i was not able to digeat meat. I woke.up this morning and threw up. I dont know if it is just food poisoning or the fact that i cannot anymore digest meat because i didnt eat it for so long. -
This is about control, not diet.
Probably something structurally is off in your life for that to be your intuition. Probably some relationship that feels wrong (someone controlling in a close personal relationship, often).
Definitely something psychologically that would benefit you to know is off.
Two good things to realise are (1) having the responsibility to take care of someone else is very good for your mental health and (2) consistency in your lifestyle is the best way to a successful diet and training plan. Obsessing about food is not. Relaxing about it and finding something else is.
That stuff is not the way to be as healthy as possible. not even close.
I got over it just by relaxing about it. Focussing on life and work, separating myself from bad social relationships that were controlling. It could help to know the psychological side of this. I did not use a psychiatrist, and honestly, many of them are not good, so feel free to shop there. A few common and predictable phenomena cause this in people, and it is useful to identify in abstract the causes so you can avoid them more surely in the future. -
I dont want to gain weight. If i do i will feel so fat and lose it again. Old habits die hard. After running half marathon for my birthday，it was the greatest gift of God to me. After that i forced myself to make theright choices and eat on a suplus. I ended up feeling sick and vomiting. It just doesnt help. I prefer to be underweight than to go through the immense pain of gaining weight.
Food made me so sick. I had to call in sick for work today because i am.not used eating this way and it made me.sick. i am not eating meat anymore in my entire life.
At least i feel better that my body has not absorbed the calories. I will get thinner and i wil be happier. That is what is in my mind. Its so good i am sick so i dont even want to eat. I will get skinnier and will be happier. That is what is in my mind. -
It doesnt matter if i get paid to be a runner. Thats not whats about if you cant understand dont answer me at all.
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Billmax wrote:
，i love running more and as a runner it is my duty to make choices in the best interest of running.
Wouldn't that mean eating the right amount? Anyways, running is not duty, nothing that goes along with it is duty, unless maybe you happen to run for a service academy in college. Running is fun. You should do it because you enjoy it, not because you have to. The problem comes because we can't always run fast or effortlessly, and its hard to do the mind numbing boring easy runs when you're sore, workouts when tired, long runs past the point of comfort, etc. This isn't duty though, its so we can enjoy accomplishing our goals. Its perfectly ok to run every day, run high mileage, and take competition seriously without ever having to; its ok to eschew family gatherings, social events, and even pick classes or jobs with less workload to train for running, not because one has to, but because one wants to. Its even ok to be a bit selfish and inconvenience others so one can succeed in running - and this doesn't make one a bad person or anything like that, yet it still doesn't make running for something beyond basic fitness a necessity.
Someone who is underweight needs to eat more than enough, not count calories, and not worry about whether they are burning what they are eating at all. A person who is a little chubby will race faster than one who is a little underweight. This is because the chubby person had more energy for training and was able to train and recover better than the underweight guy. Its true that elite male runners can be as low as 3-4% body fat without being underweight, but this is because they spent years and years eating enough and training to get to that level, not because they restricted their diets. I know lots of fast guys who ran d1, some who've made the trials and none of them restrict their diets. Most of them have to go out of their way to eat more than just 3 meals a day to have the energy they need for high level marathon training.
Do you want to have a long and successful running career in which you make consistent year to year improvements or do you want to stagnate and regress because you are not eating enough for your body to recover from training, with the increased metabolism that it brings. Feeling in control when you restrict your diet and feeling fat when you don't are normal, everyone feels those things. The problem is you're doing it to the point it hurts you. What do you feel when you run a race that is below your potential - real in control then? When you're disappointed that you didn't pr, that you missed your season goals - does that make you feel powerful? Given that you use kg, I assume you are a teenager outside the US and not concerned with the NCAA, but I can tell you people who had anorexia typically stop improving and usually quit running by their early 20s either due to chronic injury or getting so thin they can no longer run at a respectable level.
I don't think you need to stop running (in fact I would not), but to gain weight and train at a high level, which I assume you want to do, you need to eat a lot more than you currently do. I agree with other posters that you should see a counselor or psychologist. If you can't kick this, you are setting yourself up for failure. -
Hi controlis，I think you got It pretty well. Yes it is about my need to control everything of myself of my own body with food and exercise. i have only started eating more at maintanance of my current weight of 49-50.5 depending on the day because i realized i cannot exercise if my weight is lower than 49kg. I had to find a compromise between minimum health and my desire to stay thin. To me a BMI of 19 is fat. I felt so when i gained weight and recovered from this kind.of thinking. then it hit back at me. I lost weight again back to 49kg. to 50kg. depending on the day i weigh myself.
Its my way to cope with feelings to avoid myself from feeling. To shut down my human ability to feel emotion and pain. -
Kvothe，you are so mean. You dont understand，that I cannot eat more. It will make me feel so guilty and physically sick.
I was crying on a plate of spaghetti with salmon that i had to eat after finishing my half marathon last thursday. I was crying because i felt all these calories inside me. I felt fat，so full. I like to get up on a half empty stomach when i finish eating. I cannot stanf the feeling.of having a stomach full of food. Especially meat. Thata why i chose salmon. Meat is the worst fear food i have. Not because i am vegeterian even if i say thst to people... its because meat jas calories and beans dont.
The feeling of guilt is umbearable，It is stronger than me. I really do want to eat enough really i do，because running means everything.to me.
And yes I train because I love to. Running is the greatest passion of my life.
And as i said to my personal trainer when he told.me.to stop running because of my weight and eating habits... I told him go. I will run until i cant. I am underweight ok.., but i wont eat more than my planned calories of the day. I told him no i am not eating that. I will take coffee instead. -
Billmax wrote:
Kvothe，you are so mean. You dont understand，that I cannot eat more. It will make me feel so guilty and physically sick.
I was crying on a plate of spaghetti with salmon that i had to eat after finishing my half marathon last thursday. I was crying because i felt all these calories inside me. I felt fat，so full. I like to get up on a half empty stomach when i finish eating. I cannot stanf the feeling.of having a stomach full of food. Especially meat. Thata why i chose salmon. Meat is the worst fear food i have. Not because i am vegeterian even if i say thst to people... its because meat jas calories and beans dont.
The feeling of guilt is umbearable，It is stronger than me. I really do want to eat enough really i do，because running means everything.to me.
And yes I train because I love to. Running is the greatest passion of my life.
And as i said to my personal trainer when he told.me.to stop running because of my weight and eating habits... I told him go. I will run until i cant. I am underweight ok.., but i wont eat more than my planned calories of the day. I told him no i am not eating that. I will take coffee instead.
I'm mean because I was anorexic in high school. I don't want anyone to go through the pain and self torture that comes with that. Like you, I wanted feelings of control when I felt taking ownership of other areas of my life were out of my reach. I was also insecure - what if I ate right (without calorie restriction and at a level that got my bmi in the 19-22 range) and still couldn't run the times I wanted to. It was hard to come to the sheer fact that the out of touch goals I'd set for myself being beyond my ability (every high schooler wants to have that breakthrough season where they make foot locker and go on to make the olympics in college). It was hard to come to the realization that my parents' expectations for my academics, living a model christian lifestyle, and being super social weren't things I was ever going to do - I was never going to be a social butterfly or get in an ivy. Etc.
I exercised some form of calorie restriction through most of high school and it completely stopped me from running anywhere near as well as I could have. Its not normal to be wiped from 40-50 miles a week or to only be able to improve if one lives a certain way, eats certain foods, etc. It wasn't until I started posting on running messageboards like this one and could read about the training of others, learn about books like once a runner, running with the buffs, etc and was faced with running in college that I learned to eat healthy.
Faced with the choices of restricting my diet or be a decent college xc and 5/10k runner I chose the latter. I'd just read once a runner and some stories on Brian Sell, who like me ran d3 in college and wanted to really give it a go, no matter what. It was hard and it didn't come easy. There were relapses along the way, like after "binge eating some cookies" I remember going out and doing a balls to the wall 10 miler at 3 am one night - not healthy because it didn't further my goals. I don't know what will make it click for you, maybe it will be something like that, maybe nothing.
Even today I could give you a ball park estimate for how many calories are in any food I'm eating and I still read the nutrition labels on packaged foods - so I guess it never really goes away completely, but I haven't planned meals around calories or restricted meals based on calorie content since 18 and thats the reason I can put in 100+ mile weeks consistently with workouts and races. The hardest part is learning to feel full, it will often seem like you ate to the point of sickness at first, and learning to do your runs no matter how you feel. I'll start workouts even if I feel full from a big meal these days - whats the worst that can happen - a bit of gas, a little slow, and maybe a mad dash to somewhere I can take a #2.
Not everyone has a successful recovery from anorexia. There are high profile cases like Amber Trotter, but the more typical scenario is someone just stops running after freshman or sophmore year of college. After not running a step over the summer, they just don't come back to the team. I don't know if you'll take anything from this, but like others have said, I encourage you to seek help. You're not alone in what you're going through and its common in young distance runners both male and female.
I'm going to suggest a tool for you, the run fast eat slow cookbooks https://runfasteatslow.com/pages/about . These were designed by an Olympian and a former UNC runner who became a professional chef. They are full of healthy recipes designed specifically for runners. There are even a few free recipes under their blog. Its worth at least checking out the free ones for some ideas. -
I didn't know that. I have no words to put how i am feeling now. I want to Run. Now . But i know today is my recovery day and i am not gonna have that，my day without running. Is just that. Lifeless.
Yes i have a chronic injury like shin splints they call it. The doctor said my chronic injury is RSI repetitive strain injury. When he told me.to rest two weeks i got so angry i left his office and went for a 15km. run. Then 10km. the next day and 10 the next. When you said I will not make it To lifelong running because of my condition，you really hurt me. I know not even my old personal trainer considers me a good runner because i cant eat up to my needs. But i have run a lot in my life. Many half marathons including one this week and currently training for running next years Marathon despite my recurring RSI injury.
it is my birthday，and I prayed to God to give me that gift... to Run like before. I got up after days of hell without running and feeling the only thhing that makes me feel good.. I got up and kissed my running shoes. And started running. I didn stop . 22 years old，22km. of painless running just like before. I cannot put imto.words how happy i was. Despite my weak.body，I felt strong. I felt myself again，my mind completely lost.its power over me. How is it possible that i can run without pain.
After i finished to run，i said let me make a good choice and i purposefully ate to my needs. The feeling of guilt was overwhelming. The only thought in my mind was how i can burn them off. I do not want to.have these calories inside me. I felt so guilty. I ate to or more than my needs for.the days following my half marathon to maximise recovery. But it was too much for me. My stomavh has been unable.to digest the food or.the food.was poisoned i dont know but I threw up all the food exactly as it entered my mouth. Not on purpose.ok. Yes i tried but I felt unable.to.digest and handle the food. It was all sitting in my stomach. It gave me satisfaction and.calmness i have to say. That way my.body has not absorbed the calories anyway. I weighed myself，
this morning and i had the urge to put the bread back.in the fridge because i am 1kg. up compared to.yesterday.
Then i ate the bread. First i cut half of one slice i eat it plain. Then i said ok i will the whole slice. Only 1 slice.with a banana. And a spoon of olive oil + half teaspoon of jam because i am.too sick.to eat eggs. Eggsare the best appetite suppressant. I used to eat up to 6eggs a day.
For me its normal. I count. Everything every single calorie. I will not let anytjing to my body that does not get burned. My BMR is 1445 kcal. + exercise that is my calculation of the day and i do maintain my weight. I dont lose it and i dont gain it.
If i dont exerxise.i eat 1445kcal. If i do exerxise and burn 1000 calories i would eat 2000kcal.
I dont want to gain weight because what if my body will.not give me the results i want... I dont trust it. I would lose the feeling of being thin for something i wouldnt get anyway.
I dont know what to do because that is my fear. -
The average 40-50 mpw runner needs around 3000-4000cal per day to maintain health and respond/adapt well to the training without breaking down. Some people might have a faster metabolism and need more, but if you’re training seriously you definitely won’t thrive on less.
You need a lot more nourishment than you are allowing. Gradually up your intake over the course of a few months. Eating a lot of nut butters, steak, rice, fruit and pasta will do your body a lot of good.
Pay close attention to your energy levels and quality of sleep, if these things are slipping then you need to up your nutrition. -
Billmax wrote:
I didn't know that. I have no words to put how i am feeling now. I want to Run. Now . But i know today is my recovery day and i am not gonna have that，my day without running. Is just that. Lifeless.
Yes i have a chronic injury like shin splints they call it. The doctor said my chronic injury is RSI repetitive strain injury. When he told me.to rest two weeks i got so angry i left his office and went for a 15km. run. Then 10km. the next day and 10 the next. When you said I will not make it To lifelong running because of my condition，you really hurt me. I know not even my old personal trainer considers me a good runner because i cant eat up to my needs. But i have run a lot in my life. Many half marathons including one this week and currently training for running next years Marathon despite my recurring RSI injury.
it is my birthday，and I prayed to God to give me that gift... to Run like before. I got up after days of hell without running and feeling the only thhing that makes me feel good.. I got up and kissed my running shoes. And started running. I didn stop . 22 years old，22km. of painless running just like before. I cannot put imto.words how happy i was. Despite my weak.body，I felt strong. I felt myself again，my mind completely lost.its power over me. How is it possible that i can run without pain.
After i finished to run，i said let me make a good choice and i purposefully ate to my needs. The feeling of guilt was overwhelming. The only thought in my mind was how i can burn them off. I do not want to.have these calories inside me. I felt so guilty. I ate to or more than my needs for.the days following my half marathon to maximise recovery. But it was too much for me. My stomavh has been unable.to digest the food or.the food.was poisoned i dont know but I threw up all the food exactly as it entered my mouth. Not on purpose.ok. Yes i tried but I felt unable.to.digest and handle the food. It was all sitting in my stomach. It gave me satisfaction and.calmness i have to say. That way my.body has not absorbed the calories anyway. I weighed myself，
this morning and i had the urge to put the bread back.in the fridge because i am 1kg. up compared to.yesterday.
Then i ate the bread. First i cut half of one slice i eat it plain. Then i said ok i will the whole slice. Only 1 slice.with a banana. And a spoon of olive oil + half teaspoon of jam because i am.too sick.to eat eggs. Eggsare the best appetite suppressant. I used to eat up to 6eggs a day.
For me its normal. I count. Everything every single calorie. I will not let anytjing to my body that does not get burned. My BMR is 1445 kcal. + exercise that is my calculation of the day and i do maintain my weight. I dont lose it and i dont gain it.
If i dont exerxise.i eat 1445kcal. If i do exerxise and burn 1000 calories i would eat 2000kcal.
2k calories is the amount a sedentary, someone who does no exercise and is only lightly active, individual needs. Someone running like you describe needs quite a bit more. Chronic shin splints are not normal and your dietary restriction may have played a part in their onset. I suspect eating more would help in recovery from this.
Running shouldn't beat you down or make you feel weak. The workouts and training you describe should leave you feeling strong most of the time. Everyone has bad runs now and then, but the general feeling for a dude in his early 20s should be that of ascendance, always getting a bit faster season over season.
Billmax wrote:
I dont want to gain weight because what if my body will.not give me the results i want... I dont trust it. I would lose the feeling of being thin for something i wouldnt get anyway.
I dont know what to do because that is my fear.
Its bs, but you'll actually run faster as you gain weight. Even were you to gain weight to the point of being fat, or overweight according to the bmi charts, you'd run faster than you do now. It seems like such bullshi7, but that's human physiology for you. We aren't so far from our evolutionary past that our bodies won't go into a "starvation mode" when restricting calories. A calorie restricted individual's body reserves energy, even if they've eaten and its available to burn, hindering their ability a bit, giving a normal weight individual or even someone slightly chubby an edge over them.
Anyways, I encourage you to look for counselors in your area. Find someone you can trust to share these issues with. Since you are 22 and not a minor they won't be allowed to share these things with your parents or family members. Maybe you can find a psychologist who has experience working with athletes. -
Kvothe，I thank.you for your advice to get me into an insight and see what you actually have to do to get a better runner. You said you have been through this，and I am sorry because of that. You have been through this thinking pattern，I cannot just eat to gain weight. Thankfully my BMI is not too bad is it？My current BMI is 18. Before it was close to 17.5 when I was injured and couldnt run. Through running i was able to gain weight because i was motivated to eat. I dont want to get a BMI 19 I feel fat. I feel i will not run fast anymore，I will not be good enough，nobody will love me if i gain a normal weight.
I know you say its bs，but that is how i feel.
Today i am not running，I feel i shouldnt have eaten at all. 450calories ，350，250，220，30，130. That is a lot of calories So far. And the thought that i cannot burn them （Today its Rest day）makes me very uncomfortable.
Why would I go to a counsellor？Everyone tells me the same thing. To EAT. I know that already. And I do eat，I can tell you the exact number of calories I ate today，yesterday，6 days ago because I do Eat -
Wow That is A LOT. How do you physically eat 3000 calories of real food？（I wouldnt eat junk Food even if you would force me with a gun）.
The only thing I can eat without feeling So full is pasta... grains Oh the bread. How I love it. And Pasta. Just That a BIt of pasta and bread with olive oil I could eat It at every meal of my life. But meat，and generally animal proteins I Cannot stomach. I know That As literal proof. I was buying organic chicken，110 kcal for 100G. I cooked It and I ate It. I couldnt stomach That I went to the toilet and vomited everything.
That doesnt happen wIth plants. I Feel So disgusted about animal proteins.. I Mostly combine beans with wholegrains. Do.you think That is enough protein？I mean, i cant eat more than that and I found thst running does not even make me hungry anymore is that normal？I remember years ago i would be ravenous after a long run. Now even half a marathon is like nothing... No appetite at all. -
I would wager you need at least 140-160g of protein a day to maintain health as an athlete in training. We need more than you think when we are running a lot.
Oats with nut milk some form of dairy free protein powder ? (I prefer the brand nutiva because it has many essential nutrients and no processed stuff - I recommend the vanilla flavour)
A medium to large bowl of this can contain up to 1k calories if you add nut butter and dried fruit.
If you combine nutritional yeast (vegan cheese) with coconut cream, you can make a high calorie and high protein soup that you may wish to put over things like beans or lentils.
It is possible to eat high cal and healthy. I do, and I never eat junk! I know it can seem very overwhelming so try to gradually adjust your diet and get used to it, but while you make this transition - perhaps compromise and cut down your mileage some because you really aren’t getting enough calories to healthfully sustain more than a few miles per week at the moment.
I’m sorry you are battling an eating disorder, I’ve never had anorexia but I was a binge eater for many years. I know how hard old habits can die but you can get there, it takes patience, and it takes the ability to not beat yourself up. Negative emotions towards yourself can stall your recovery. Please speak to somebody more qualified than a running message board about your eating disorder, they are serious illnesses that require medical intervention. -
Hi，
Thank you for your advices about the protein shake but i dont eat sugar.. Its like my worst fear food i dont know if i can handle that. Sure would be easier to get the calories because it scares me both the food volume and caloric content.
i dont know. I try to eat always within my comfort zone. But if i eat anything above than the calories i burn. I panick. I am really so afraid，to gain weight. I feel my body getting weaker，and in the way of what i woud love to do. But i cannot swim against this. I cannot see that i am this thin as people tell me，I feel fat most of the time.
7Today i only ate carbohydrates. Whole grain bread at breakfast，i slice. With a spoon of olive oil. Then i ate 150g. of wholegrain pasta with notjing in it. Then i ate 150...g. of wholegrain rice at dinner.
I then forced myself to eat this way today. And i added a few slices of bread here and there. Bread i made myself so that i can count the calories. I know thst i have eate up to my needs today，and I cannot put into words how guilty i feel. Even if i purposelly forced myself to improve my training. I am only thinking about how i can burn these calories.
I do want to improve my training，i really do even if that means to eat more. But you dont know how bad that feels. -
Are you in college? Do you work?
