Ryan Schoppe runs 14:14.02 5K at the UIL XC State Championship US #2 all time

texaz wrote:

So that's... three runners today in three separate races under the old course record? a 14:34, 14:33, and 14:14 in 4A, 5A, and 6A?

ball out, Texas. we see you.

Are you 12 years old?

texaz wrote:

So that's... three runners today in three separate races under the old course record? a 14:34, 14:33, and 14:14 in 4A, 5A, and 6A?

ball out, Texas. we see you.

No doubt a very solid year for Texas, especially when you see all these top guys are legitimate:

6A Champ

Ryan Schoppe is a returning 8:52 3200m runner (state 3200m champion as well over Alex Maier).

5A Champ

(14:33) Graydon Morris is a returning 8:50 2-miler who has finished 2nd and 3rd at Footlocker Nationals.

4A Champ

(14:34) Judson Greer is a returning Junior who ran 4:14/9:06 as a sophomore, and has beaten Jarrett Kirk & Anthony Monte in a race this season.

For comparisons --- Woodbridge was ran around September 20th.

Anthony Monte ran 14:39 (6A). He ran 14:14.5 @ Woodbridge

Elias Perez 15:03 at this race (5A). He ran 14:25.9 @ Woodbridge.

Evan Caswell ran 14:48 at this race (6A). He ran 14:26.8 @ Woodbridge.

SLC @ Woodbridge

-Chavez finished as their #5 guy @ Woodbridge; At state he was their #1 (Nate was off). At regionals, #3.

-Joe Gardner was their #4 at state (#5 if Nate didn't bomb); He didn't run at Woodbridge.

Eastwood was off @ Desert Twilight --- Their #3 guy was their #8, for starters.

@ Woodbridge---

Compare Eastwood's performance at TX State & Regionals to their performance at Woodbridge. Honestly, you really only need to look at the spread to figure it out. They looked real good at state. That 1-5 spread @ Woodbridge, a fast/easy 3-mile race was 1:02. At TX state, it was about 30 seconds.

Again, I agree that the teams improved. And so have the other teams they ran against. Improving throughout the season is not unique to Texas athletes.

What's the argument for any of those 3 Texas teams to make it into the national field as an At-Large?

Per Strava course is only at most 15 seconds short.

The splits tell you it’s not a true 5k. They don’t add up.

No way Schoppe ran 4:20 for the last mile.

Splits wrote:

The splits tell you it’s not a true 5k. They don’t add up.

No way Schoppe ran 4:20 for the last mile.

Unfortunately, this guy's nailed it. It's just too good to be true. I mean, anyone remember Cooper Teare, crazy fast dude who graduated a few years ago?

4:00/ 8:40 (Arcadia) /14:13 on A TRACK at TDF. No way Schoppe runs his 3200 pace to close off an XC 5k.

TexasRunner6A wrote:

It was a normal 5k course, multiple people wore their watches and got 3.09-3.1

Normal as in it was ~ 69 meters short or a time that should be better attributed to this kid of 14:27 (outstanding!!) , but not 14:14...

TexasRunner6A wrote:

It was a normal 5k course, multiple people wore their watches and got 3.09-3.1

You just confirmed that the course is short! GPS measurements are always longer than the true measurement. Over 5k they will usually read at least 0.05 long and usually closer to 0.1 long. So I would bet that the course is between 3 0 and 3.05 miles based on those GPS measurements. Guaranteed.

The GPS measurements I saw were between 3.01 and 3.06. Not even close to a 5k. Schoppe is a great runner but he is not #2 all time. Just like Brynn Brown is not #2 all time. If you are going to make "all time" claims, the course should be verified.

It is cross country. Time does not matter.

Oatlands is supposedly 5k too but somehow tons of VA/DC/MD kids run big prs there.

Usually the best explanation is the simplest one.

Heracles has it right, Eastwood's #1 from State and NXR last year had some issues at Desert Twilight (finishing as their #8) and his since started rebounding and getting healthy. He ran as the #3 yesterday an is back in the mix as he should be, Eastwood's #1-5 is as good as anybody's in TX and the state results reflect that, also reflected when one of the regulars is off, like at DT. The 6 and 7 need to step up at NXR should anyone the top 5 have an off day.

For all the talk of the course being short, I think it’s more likely that the conditions for the state meet were near perfect. With good weather, hard packed ground, and the right competition, a course can run VERY fast.

There was a day like this in Ohio in 2017, at the Midwest Meet of Champions. It had been fairly nice the week of the race, and the day of the temp dropped and the wind quieter down. The result was Zach Kreft and Dustin Horter (two of Ohio’s best ever) running 14:29 and 14:36, and nearly every other runner in the race setting a new PR. A week later at the OCC championships (league meet) on the same course, rain had been dumping nonstop and the course ran almost 20-30 seconds slower because of the mud and suddenly spongey quality of the racing surface.

This is probably what happened this weekend in Texas. Perfect conditions lead to some very fast times- which I’m not saying discredits the runs by Schoppe, Morris, and Greer. After all, world records are run in perfect weather and on the worlds best tracks. It’s only natural that the fastest 5K times in XC will come from good racing conditions.

Anyway, my point is that maybe the UIL’s course is more accurate than the GPS watch on your wrist. Fast times can be explained by the conditions, not that the same course used year after year is supposedly 50-100m short. GPS, especially watches, aren’t always correct.

The Texas state XC course is and has been short for years. I guarantee if that course was wheeled you would find it to be between 3.0 and 3.05. Compare the gps data of the front runners vs the pack vs the back of the pack. The only ones with gps data even close to 3.10 will be the pack runners and that is because they aren’t able to hit all the tangents.

Non nike coach wrote:

The Texas state XC course is and has been short for years. I guarantee if that course was wheeled you would find it to be between 3.0 and 3.05. Compare the gps data of the front runners vs the pack vs the back of the pack. The only ones with gps data even close to 3.10 will be the pack runners and that is because they aren’t able to hit all the tangents.

This course was running 15-30 seconds faster than Desert Twilight, where Daschbach and Sprout went 14:14 and 14:16. I can't believe they could run 13:45-14:00 for a true 5K in XC.

BigTex wrote:

The GPS measurements I saw were between 3.01 and 3.06. Not even close to a 5k. Schoppe is a great runner but he is not #2 all time. Just like Brynn Brown is not #2 all time. If you are going to make "all time" claims, the course should be verified.

Brown was on pace to being the fastest female XC runner TX has ever produced (high school).

She was a returning 9:57 2-miler, for Christ sake.

The Milesplit XC invitational and McNeil showed she was on a whole other level compared to all the other girls in the entire state.

texaz wrote:

So that's... three runners today in three separate races under the old course record? a 14:34, 14:33, and 14:14 in 4A, 5A, and 6A?

ball out, Texas. we see you.

In around 1985 at the Texas state meet the national 200 meter record was broken 3 times in 3 separate divisions culminating in Roy Martin's 20.13. I think Joe Deloach ran in 3A or 4A.

Oatey wrote:

Oatlands is supposedly 5k too but somehow tons of VA/DC/MD kids run big prs there.

Usually the best explanation is the simplest one.

I'm sorry I meant Third Battle not Oatlands. My apologies to oatlands.