New British invented doping test could detect EPO use months after injections

Assumption without evidence.

Demonstrably false. In the 80s:

the fastest 800 m runner was a Brit,

the fastest 1500 m runner was a Moroccan,

the fastest 5000 m runner was a Moroccan,

the fastest 10000 m runner was a Mexican,

the fastest marathon runner was an Ethiopian.

Wait. Do you mean the ladies? Among the women in the 80s:

the fastest 800 m runner was a Czech,

the fastest 1500 m runner was a Soviet,

the fastest 5000 m runner was a Norwegian,

the fastest 10000 m runner was a Norwegian,

the fastest marathon runner was a Norwegian.

0/10 - that's terrible even by your standards.

"the thousand or so elite Kenyans"? Lol, normally your definition of elite is rather narrow...

Either way: low on an absolute scale, yes, but high relative to say, nowadays Germans, French, Canadians, ...

East Africans dominated cross-country in the '80s followed by cross-country and track in the '90s, then later adding the road races.

When they did not dominate, it was more a question of lack of participation due to external factors like war or boycott.

If they came, they generally won. This has been generally true now for 4 decades.

When we talk about prevalance, the choice of "elite" matters less than picking the same population of doped runners to total runners.

That pretty much sums it up, except: - I don't know prevalence breakdown by nations, or more narrowly, of the East Africans that beat "everyone else", so I wouldn't suggest "they dope more" without knowing more

Armstronglivs wrote:

So Kenyans were 'clean' in the 80's when they were beating everyone else (you say), but then they started doping so they could beat each other. Really? Beating each other 'clean' wasn't good enough - they had to start cheating to do it? Oh, right.

That's even when we know - or you do - that it is only a "belief" they have (in other words, an illusion) that doping will enhance their performances. So they are not only corrupt, they are dumb - and apparently dumber than mostly everyone else, because they dope more, when they should know doping isn't actually helping them. That's extraordinary, to cheat without gaining advantage - and not 'get' it. No wonder they fail a lot of tests.

rekrunner wrote:

East Africans dominated cross-country in the '80s followed by cross-country and track in the '90s, then later adding the road races

The East Africans didn't dominate in the 1500 & 5000 during that time period. - it was mostly them and the North Africans that were medaling in the Olympics & WC from 91 through 2004. This looked like an arms race between the two regions.

I wouldn’t be so sure that J. Ingebrigtsen is clean. H. Ingebrigtsen was flagged as “likely doping” on the Fancy Bears leak. And, seeing as they’re brothers with the same coach, I think they’re probably using the same methods.

Yours has to be the one of most idiotic posts ever. Apparently several of the the US high schoolers each year who run under 48 seconds would have you reeling.

Coevett wrote:

Can anyone tell me where I can put money on Jakob winning 1500/5000 gold in Tokyo right now?

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2019/nov/05/ioc-gene-testing-dope-cheats-tokyo-olympics-athletics

There's a lot of political power behind allowing E. Africans and other third world athletes to cheat, never mind what we see with sprinters from all over. It's all for social conditioning. When Jakob first started hitting world class times it was said by a few that we'd see things doubled-down with E. Africans let get away with more, which we have seen in certain cases. It'll be interesting to see if the tests that are currently claimed to be in development are real. And if any true enforcement comes about.

The E. Africans have a high percentage of talented runners, but the situation we've seen since '87 is wholly artificial.

The Epopians and Kenyans had good cross teams in the early 80s - they have a narrow bell curve of performance which helps. It also isn't mentioned they basically sent all their best runners and other countries who could have fielded deeper teams merely sent a couple of their best who bothered to compete or felt like competing in the event. However, other people still beat these talented E. Africans across the line. Once EPO hit and they were allowed unfettered access and use, along with not being pestered with claims about tests and such like others (by design) the E. Africans began to dominate fully.

If true across the board, workable testing is ever implemented, the E. Africans may still win most of the medals. If the rest of the world regains interest in the sport along with true testing in place, then there will be people from many other places winning medals, rather than grinning frauds who avoid out of season / out of competition testing every.single.year.

LoneStarXC wrote:

This is exciting news, but WADA still has to approve the test. And then we have to hope that they don’t sweep positive tests under the rug. But, if all goes well, we should see a whole parade of dopers bite the dust.

This is the bigger danger -- officials being paid off to cover up positive tests. Until this is eradicated it doesn't matter how effective the science is.